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  #11  
Old 09-17-2009, 04:46 PM
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Because hybrids are gay.

And their batteries die at 75,000 miles and cost too much to replace, while the diesel lasts 400,000 miles and outlives the car. /hybrid argument.

Look at all the threads bitching about the economic impact of CARS.

I think BMW NA needs to get their head out of NJ (where they want AWD on every car) and look at the whole picture. Just like our government.
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  #12  
Old 09-17-2009, 05:37 PM
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Did the numers again just for the heck of it comparing the base MSRP's of a 335i vs 335d. Based on 15,000 miles of annual driving with 60% being highway and my local fuel prices, it would take about 7 years to recoup the initial investment of the 335d over the 335i. The 335d uses 13.6 barrels vs. 15.6 for the 335i. The 335d does have a smaller carbon footprint. Guess that magazine was right.
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Last edited by FSETH; 09-17-2009 at 05:52 PM.
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  #13  
Old 09-17-2009, 05:54 PM
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I agree that the diesel only available on AWD/X-Drive is fairly shortsighted. Must be some number cruncher
"cost containment" value, and sold to the mkt geniuses.

Back at the Diesel Ranch, I also don't get the "no diesel in X1, for the US", esp. vis a vis that diesels only avail. on
XDrive cars strategy.

Alas, the new X cars are almost out of my budget/needs/rationale as it is...
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  #14  
Old 09-17-2009, 09:50 PM
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Why is this thread turning into a hybrid thread again? No one who drives normally can achieve the fuel consumption figures stated in the hybrid.

I think the marketing folks got the demographic wrong in another way as well: Folks like us, who have been asking for diesels for quite awhile, tend to shy away from AWD models unless absolutely necessary. We know the virtues of diesels, and we also know the limitations of AWD. We'd rather have an unhinged rear-drive BMW.

Your average American buyer who shows up at the dealership on Saturday afternoon will probably not know about the benefits of a diesel. This is the same Joe and Jill that wants AWD in the Sunbelt. Thus, sales will likely remain biased towards vehicles like the 325xi sedan. With an automatic transmission.
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  #15  
Old 09-17-2009, 10:26 PM
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I didn't mean to make this a hybrid thread. I was just saying that if you are buying a diesel to save the environment or save money in operating costs, the hybrid is just as good, if not a better option. I don't see why one would want to buy a diesel BMW when it does appear that it will take years to break even on the extra costs compared to the regular gas version.

What are the main reasons some of you would prefer a diesel?

I do a lot of driving for work and have looked around at Jetta diesels and Fusion hybrids to cut down on costs. That is why I threw out that particular example.

Meiac, I do agree that hybrids are somewhat lame. Especially the Prius looking ones, but the Fusion isn't a bad looking car, IMO. Also, it doesn't look much different from the regular gas version. Ford's warranty on the hybrid powertrain system is 8 years or 100,000. That is pretty solid.

I agree that BMW is probably only offering their diesels as all-wheel drive to cut costs. As far as I know, they are not selling that hot, are they?
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  #16  
Old 09-18-2009, 01:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AzNMpower32 View Post
I think the marketing folks got the demographic wrong in another way as well: Folks like us, who have been asking for diesels for quite awhile, tend to shy away from AWD models unless absolutely necessary. We know the virtues of diesels, and we also know the limitations of AWD. We'd rather have an unhinged rear-drive BMW.
Must be a different demographic. Folks in my part of the world who want diesels tend to want AWD as well. These folks are the granolas, and their VW microbuses and Subarus are wearing out. They haven't bought a Volvo since the 245 was discontinued, so their choices are limited. A wagon, with a diesel, and AWD, is a perfect fit. Some of them would of course like a manual transmission, but they can't have everything.

I think the idea of an unhinged rear-drive vehicle is more sporting, and that is the antithesis of a diesel, which was my point back in post #3. That is why BMW will bundle an AWD, with an automatic, and a diesel. Package deal.
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  #17  
Old 09-18-2009, 02:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCL View Post
Must be a different demographic. Folks in my part of the world who want diesels tend to want AWD as well. These folks are the granolas, and their VW microbuses and Subarus are wearing out. They haven't bought a Volvo since the 245 was discontinued, so their choices are limited. A wagon, with a diesel, and AWD, is a perfect fit. Some of them would of course like a manual transmission, but they can't have everything.
Well, subaru is bringing over their diesel boxer, so there ya go!

My point to FSETH is to people like my family, who still has their Volvo 940 from 1995, the hybrid is way too technology based to have the longevity of a diesel. We know people who have 350K+ on their Jetta TDI's, Silverado Diesels, 400K on their Mercs... and they're still good cars to drive.

Hybrids haven't been around long enough to tell for sure, but what happens as the batteries gradually lose their ability to charge (like you laptop after a few years) Then there's the recycling part. I can't wait to see what happens to all the "granolas" when the batteries start wearing out and they can't afford to recycle them... They'll disown the spaceships so fast its nuts. I do know that, even though the original prius sucked in general, my friends 2003 has gotten steadily worse since he over paid for it in terms of performance and MPG.

Yeah 100k is great for the typical "buy a new fridge every 3 years" but for someone who drives 40k a year or ACTUALLY does keep a car for 10 years, it doesn't cut it (Our T'Reg had 100k after 4)
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  #18  
Old 09-18-2009, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCL View Post
Must be a different demographic. Folks in my part of the world who want diesels tend to want AWD as well. These folks are the granolas, and their VW microbuses and Subarus are wearing out. They haven't bought a Volvo since the 245 was discontinued, so their choices are limited. A wagon, with a diesel, and AWD, is a perfect fit. Some of them would of course like a manual transmission, but they can't have everything.

I think the idea of an unhinged rear-drive vehicle is more sporting, and that is the antithesis of a diesel, which was my point back in post #3. That is why BMW will bundle an AWD, with an automatic, and a diesel. Package deal.

I agree. The people who will buy many of the BMW diesels are not typical car buyers, or even typical BMW enthusiasts for that matter. I know Audi has planted a diesel in the R8 that hauls and the 335d is no sloutch, but I don't associate rear wheel drive and performance with the word diesel. I would buy the 335i if I wanted performance and the 335d if I wanted a car that I could leave running at truck stops.
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