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  #1  
Old 12-15-2015, 09:05 AM
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TUB44 Rebuild or B44 "Hybrid"?

First of all, this is my first post. Glad to join the community and seems like there is a lot of knowledge here. Thanks for any help in advance.

Here is the deal guys, I bought a 01 X5 M62TU without getting to physically look at it (I know, scary right??). Turns out, like all M62 engines, the timing chain guides are destroyed. It ran/idles really rough. Would not really rev and misfires when trying. Dies about 30-45 seconds after running. And sounds horrible (most likely due to the chain guides). Lower oil pan was dropped and the valve guides are in pieces and the oil looks like there is glitter in it.

In my impulsive nature, I ran out to the junkyard and found a 5 series that was DRIVEN in to the yard and pulled it. The oil looked good. Both good indicators. However, this engine is a non-vanos (M62B44).

My question to you guys would be, what do you think I should do? Just refresh the TUB44 (all gaskets, timing chain and guides, s. plugs, etc.) granted the valves have not stuck the pistons. Or get the vanos heads rebuilt and slap them on the B44 (with the electronic throttle body and intake of course)?

I haven't done anything to either engine except drop that oil pan.

Thanks again guys. This is my first BMW. Hope it doesnt like a salty taste in my mouth.

Terrell B.
Baltimore Area
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  #2  
Old 12-15-2015, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NismoGT View Post
First of all, this is my first post. Glad to join the community and seems like there is a lot of knowledge here. Thanks for any help in advance.

Here is the deal guys, I bought a 01 X5 M62TU without getting to physically look at it (I know, scary right??). Turns out, like all M62 engines, the timing chain guides are destroyed. It ran/idles really rough. Would not really rev and misfires when trying. Dies about 30-45 seconds after running. And sounds horrible (most likely due to the chain guides). Lower oil pan was dropped and the valve guides are in pieces and the oil looks like there is glitter in it.

In my impulsive nature, I ran out to the junkyard and found a 5 series that was DRIVEN in to the yard and pulled it. The oil looked good. Both good indicators. However, this engine is a non-vanos (M62B44).

My question to you guys would be, what do you think I should do? Just refresh the TUB44 (all gaskets, timing chain and guides, s. plugs, etc.) granted the valves have not stuck the pistons. Or get the vanos heads rebuilt and slap them on the B44 (with the electronic throttle body and intake of course)?

I haven't done anything to either engine except drop that oil pan.

Thanks again guys. This is my first BMW. Hope it doesnt like a salty taste in my mouth.

Terrell B.
Baltimore Area
The Non Vanos M62B44 engine is a tank and far more reliable than the vanos equipped vehicles. They also have the better intake system.
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  #3  
Old 12-15-2015, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X53Jay4.8is View Post
The Non Vanos M62B44 engine is a tank and far more reliable than the vanos equipped vehicles. They also have the better intake system.
Yea but I would have to source all the electronics for the B44. At least, from what I have been reading about VANOS, is that the solenoids are the main culprit a lot of times. I'm just trying to get this truck back on the road and not kill my bank account in the process.

I'm thinking about just replacing the timing chain system and some VANOS parts and seeing where that gets me. Hopefully that fixes a majority of the issues.

I'm making an educated guess, I would imagine a loose chain/old tensioner can cause the engine to run like poo because the timing would be inconsistent. Correct assumption?
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Old 12-15-2015, 05:44 PM
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Not sure a loose chain would cause that....

Sounds like the chain all ready skipped a tooth or so on the cam sprocket. That's my guess anyway.

I would be concerned with whether or not the valves are bent.
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Old 12-15-2015, 05:55 PM
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Hey,

Did it still have oil pressure before you started dismantling it?
That glitter thing is more from the aluminum U-guide and the timing cover( see the attached picture of the one from my X)
I would get a simple compression test on all the cylinders and if it shows good numbers go ahead and replace just the stuff is broken on the old engine.
It's the way I did with mine. Two years and 9000 kms later I only have a timing over advanced for both banks,which is a camshaft sensor wheel misalignment thing.Other than that.Runs as strong as a tank.
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Old 12-15-2015, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helihover View Post
Not sure a loose chain would cause that....

Sounds like the chain all ready skipped a tooth or so on the cam sprocket. That's my guess anyway.

I would be concerned with whether or not the valves are bent.
That is what concerns me now. I dont really want to pull the heads and replace valves.


Quote:
Originally Posted by diyanich View Post
Hey,

Did it still have oil pressure before you started dismantling it?
That glitter thing is more from the aluminum U-guide and the timing cover( see the attached picture of the one from my X)
I would get a simple compression test on all the cylinders and if it shows good numbers go ahead and replace just the stuff is broken on the old engine.
It's the way I did with mine. Two years and 9000 kms later I only have a timing over advanced for both banks,which is a camshaft sensor wheel misalignment thing.Other than that.Runs as strong as a tank.
I did not perform a compression test yet. Can I still perform one with the lower oil pan dropped and get accurate numbers? It would be a blessing if I only had to do the timing chain, maybe VANOS refresh and other regular maintenance stuff.
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Old 12-15-2015, 06:54 PM
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Here are pics of the lower oil pan



And the oil filter canister

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Old 12-15-2015, 07:19 PM
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Compression test doesn't involves engine running,just cranking for a few seconds each time you change the cylinder.I personally would do it just like that,but to be on the same side,just bolt the oil pan back refill with a minimum oil needed and proceed,ah a new filter wouldn't hurt,so you have less glitter passing into the oil passages.

When I bought the X it had the guides failed and no oil pressure...that said,I couldn't be sure about the previous guy stopping it right away it lost the pressure or driving for a while just like that,before the guides overheated and failed.

In your case if the oil pressure is still there,I personally see no reason to spend more money than needed.Only if the compression test shows good numbers.


If you go the rebuild road get a kit from these guys.The generic chinese copies are not easy to perform the timing alone.
Every guy that used this kit had positive and trouble free experience.Some of them had to get it anyways to retime after using chinese counterfeits.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NismoGT View Post
That is what concerns me now. I dont really want to pull the heads and replace valves.




I did not perform a compression test yet. Can I still perform one with the lower oil pan dropped and get accurate numbers? It would be a blessing if I only had to do the timing chain, maybe VANOS refresh and other regular maintenance stuff.
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Last edited by diyanich; 12-15-2015 at 07:24 PM.
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Old 12-15-2015, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diyanich View Post
Compression test doesn't involves engine running,just cranking for a few seconds each time you change the cylinder.I personally would do it just like that,but to be on the same side,just bolt the oil pan back refill with a minimum oil needed and proceed,ah a new filter wouldn't hurt,so you have less glitter passing into the oil passages.

When I bought the X it had the guides failed and no oil pressure...that said,I couldn't be sure about the previous guy stopping it right away it lost the pressure or driving for a while just like that,before the guides overheated and failed.

In your case if the oil pressure is still there,I personally see no reason to spend more money than needed.Only if the compression test shows good numbers.


If you go the rebuild road get a kit from these guys.The generic chinese copies are not easy to perform the timing alone.
Every guy that used this kit had positive and trouble free experience.Some of them had to get it anyways to retime after using chinese counterfeits.
G.A.S. BMW Tools
Couldn't a loose timing chain throw off compression numbers thought? If both valves do not completely close due to too much slack in the chain, you can't get a good seal and you will get an inaccurate reading.

However, if i do perform a compression test, is there any way to flush the metal shavings out before I rotate the engine any more?
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Old 12-15-2015, 10:14 PM
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A loose chain wouldn't make valve timing overlap,a few skipped teeth would.
In this case..do a leak down test,which is : manually turning the crankshaft so the piston gets into a TDC put a pressure into cylinder.If you have bent valves then you know it right away.
There are a few threads discussion this method here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NismoGT View Post
Couldn't a loose timing chain throw off compression numbers thought? If both valves do not completely close due to too much slack in the chain, you can't get a good seal and you will get an inaccurate reading.

However, if i do perform a compression test, is there any way to flush the metal shavings out before I rotate the engine any more?
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