01 x5 timing chain guides?

[andrewwynn]

You do not need to do chain guides preemptively. They can last 300-400,000 miles. My research concluded that the primary failure mode is the chain tensioner . The guides are probably brittle by the time they are five years old or 60,000 miles. The chain is held off the guide by flowing oil like a journal bearing. On the engines I've changed guides there was virtually no wear @ 160,000 mi. The guides shattered when the chain gets loose and slaps against the brittle guides. Either from low oil pressure or worn chain tensioner. If you look at the design of the one chain solution on the M62 you'll see there is a incredible length of chain at the bottom that is subject to whip when the chain is not super tight.

Last year ones of the m62s I help with developed start up rattle, we checked for broken bits of guide and found none, we installed a new OEM tensioner and instantly fixed the start up rattle. Considering that some of these engines have made it 400,000 on original chain guides it's not a given they need to be replaced. That said 160-180,000 might be an ok time to consider replacing but it's more important to replace the tensioner at least by 120,000 then every 60-80,000 after that. One big pothole with a weak tensioner and 3# of chain slaps info that brittle chain guide and it's toast.

[Maruzo]

Originally Posted by andrewwynn

You do not need to do chain guides preemptively. They can last 300-400,000 miles. My research concluded that the primary failure mode is the chain tensioner . The guides are probably brittle by the time they are five years old or 60,000 miles. The chain is held off the guide by flowing oil like a journal bearing. On the engines I've changed guides there was virtually no wear @ 160,000 mi. The guides shattered when the chain gets loose and slaps against the brittle guides. Either from low oil pressure or worn chain tensioner. If you look at the design of the one chain solution on the M62 you'll see there is a incredible length of chain at the bottom that is subject to whip when the chain is not super tight.

Last year ones of the m62s I help with developed start up rattle, we checked for broken bits of guide and found none, we installed a new OEM tensioner and instantly fixed the start up rattle. Considering that some of these engines have made it 400,000 on original chain guides it's not a given they need to be replaced. That said 160-180,000 might be an ok time to consider replacing but it's more important to replace the tensioner at least by 120,000 then every 60-80,000 after that. One big pothole with a weak tensioner and 3# of chain slaps info that brittle chain guide and it's toast.

That's good info, andrew.

I replaced my tensioner with OEM part from ECS back in 2018. Have put in 20,000 miles since.

The start up rattle went away the first few starts after I replaced the tensioner, but came back.

The rattle are usually not very pronounced after the car's been driven for a while.

It's the loudest in the first morning cold start. Once warmed the subsequent starts gets quieter.

After I replaced the valve cover and spark plug, the first start was super quiet too.

But it was only that one time.

[andrewwynn]

There is a distinct difference in the chain rattle sound and other start up noises like vanos rattle and lifter tick which is pretty normal on my m54. When ambient drops below 50F, I will definitely expect some lifter tick during the first 5-7 seconds of start up. If it takes more than 7 seconds to fade I know I'm low on oil.

Just like the fact it takes some time for the lifters to fill from oil pressure the chain tensioner uses the same principle and it wouldn't surprise me to hear a little chain rattle on M62 during the first ten seconds but it should go away completely once oil pressure builds.

With the M62 I would pay particular attention for the sound of the tensioner getting sloppy because it's $65 and 30 minutes vs $1200 and 30 hours to replace the tensioner vs the guides.

[Maruzo]

Originally Posted by andrewwynn

There is a distinct difference in the chain rattle sound and other start up noises like vanos rattle and lifter tick which is pretty normal on my m54. When ambient drops below 50F, I will definitely expect some lifter tick during the first 5-7 seconds of start up. If it takes more than 7 seconds to fade I know I'm low on oil.

Just like the fact it takes some time for the lifters to fill from oil pressure the chain tensioner uses the same principle and it wouldn't surprise me to hear a little chain rattle on M62 during the first ten seconds but it should go away completely once oil pressure builds.

With the M62 I would pay particular attention for the sound of the tensioner getting sloppy because it's $65 and 30 minutes vs $1200 and 30 hours to replace the tensioner vs the guides.

Should I replace the tensioner again? Mine cost $100 from ECS and I only had it installed for 2 years.

I am gonna fit a bmw oil filter to see if that helps with improving oil pressure and reducing startup rattle.

[andrewwynn]

That was the fix for other people.i would not experiment with high flow filters or different weights of oil.

[syncrocrick]

This is a good reminder that I need to replace my chain tensioner asap. I have a 2003 with 183000 miles and a cold start (only) rattle. Definitively worst if the car sits for several weeks, and almost none when I drive it daily,

[andrewwynn]

Get OEM don't forget the crush washer it's single use. Not replacing cost my buddy 1 qt a week of oil until he did.

[JPuma]

Originally Posted by andrewwynn

There is a distinct difference in the chain rattle sound and other start up noises like vanos rattle and lifter tick which is pretty normal on my m54. When ambient drops below 50F, I will definitely expect some lifter tick during the first 5-7 seconds of start up. If it takes more than 7 seconds to fade I know I'm low on oil.

Just like the fact it takes some time for the lifters to fill from oil pressure the chain tensioner uses the same principle and it wouldn't surprise me to hear a little chain rattle on M62 during the first ten seconds but it should go away completely once oil pressure builds.

With the M62 I would pay particular attention for the sound of the tensioner getting sloppy because it's $65 and 30 minutes vs $1200 and 30 hours to replace the tensioner vs the guides.

I just changed my tensioner spring and the piston too. crush washer also. I had the ticking sound for the first few seconds, goes away quick and I thought I nailed the problem because on the first start when car was sitting, I didnt hear anything. Yesterday I started her up and heard the ticking, this morning too. The only difference was my driveway is on a decline. When I replaced the spring the nose of the car was facing the house, so front is slightly higher. I normally back in so nose on decline. I am about to use my snake camera like I did on my Cats to check the plastic guide rail. Maybe with the car parked with the nose on a down angle the chain might be rubbing/touching something vs with the nose in an incline.

I will see if there is any damage from the guides.

[andrewwynn]

The check valves hold oil in the timing gear. If they leak you'll get ticking at start mostly from the "lifters".

Loose chain is a distinct rattle sound. It will also usually just last a few moments while the tensioner fills with pressure.

[JPuma]

Originally Posted by andrewwynn

The check valves hold oil in the timing gear. If they leak you'll get ticking at start mostly from the "lifters".

Loose chain is a distinct rattle sound. It will also usually just last a few moments while the tensioner fills with pressure.

Mine is definitely like a ticking sounds, fast ticketing and the slows down and disappears after about 20 ticks. Its real short. At least the tensioner was a good maintenance to do, it was like 1/8 in shorter.

I started it again earlier to take a drive and didn't hear it this time. I was contemplating using an additive but I'm gonna hold off for now, I did an oil change in the summer and I barely drive.

Thanks for your input.