Home Forums Articles How To's FAQ Register
Go Back   Xoutpost.com > BMW SAV Forums > X5 (E53) Forum
Fluid Motor Union
User Name
Password
Member List Premier Membership Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Xoutpost server transfer and maintenance is occurring....
Xoutpost is currently undergoing a planned server migration.... stay tuned for new developments.... sincerely, the management


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 09-29-2021, 10:32 PM
RocketyMan's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: PNW
Posts: 553
RocketyMan is on a distinguished road
Angry Spirited Drive -- Now rear Camber Negative

Alrighty...I went up to the mountains with my maternal side of the family to help spread my grandmother's ashes next to my grandpa's somewhere a several weeks ago. The drive up the mountain has TERRIBLE roads--meaning smooth road with sink-holes completely out of sight. As a result, I hit quite a few rather harshly. Then noticed my steering now pulls more to the right the next day... -_-

Now my rear camber on both axles is noticeably negative. The rear driver side (the one I think I hit the hardest) is the absolute worst negative camber. I can jack up my car on the smooth garage floor and hear the tire adjust quite excessively as the suspension jousts from negative to positive as I jack it up. Then setting it down and rolling it back and forth, it looks like the wheel is about to pop off.


So here's my usual checks I did:

1. Extensively inspected the lower control arm bushings -- both are very tight and appear to not moved since I last had them set -- Just to make sure I took a wrench on it to see if I could get it to shift or move. Nothing. Tight.

2. Attempted to shake the wheel in the air with my hands on the 12-oclock and 6-oclock positions to try and determine if any looseness -- found none

3. I inspected the rear: forward&aft control arm -- joints appears to be tight

4. Looked at the lower ball joint -- I replaced this last year and still looks good.

5. Looked at the integral link...still look good


Question:
Could the rear sub-frame bushings cause a camber issue? I can see extensive cracking of the rubber mount...great.

If something were to bend what could be the culprit? I cant tell if any up of upper control arms bent--they look straight and the rubber bushes look fine.

Could the spring "saddle" break or deteriorate somehow causing it to sit lower? I couldn't find any evidence of this.
__________________
2003 BMW X5 3.0i -- MT5, 3.64s final gears, H&R lowering springs, K-Mac bushing kit
2007 BMW X3 3.0Si -- MT6
Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links

  #2  
Old 09-29-2021, 10:44 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Menlo Park, CA
Posts: 2,311
Fifty150hs is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by RocketyMan View Post
Alrighty...I went up to the mountains with my maternal side of the family to help spread my grandmother's ashes next to my grandpa's somewhere a several weeks ago. The drive up the mountain has TERRIBLE roads--meaning smooth road with sink-holes completely out of sight. As a result, I hit quite a few rather harshly. Then noticed my steering now pulls more to the right the next day... -_-

Now my rear camber on both axles is noticeably negative. The rear driver side (the one I think I hit the hardest) is the absolute worst negative camber. I can jack up my car on the smooth garage floor and hear the tire adjust quite excessively as the suspension jousts from negative to positive as I jack it up. Then setting it down and rolling it back and forth, it looks like the wheel is about to pop off.


So here's my usual checks I did:

1. Extensively inspected the lower control arm bushings -- both are very tight and appear to not moved since I last had them set -- Just to make sure I took a wrench on it to see if I could get it to shift or move. Nothing. Tight.

2. Attempted to shake the wheel in the air with my hands on the 12-oclock and 6-oclock positions to try and determine if any looseness -- found none

3. I inspected the rear: forward&aft control arm -- joints appears to be tight

4. Looked at the lower ball joint -- I replaced this last year and still looks good.

5. Looked at the integral link...still look good


Question:
Could the rear sub-frame bushings cause a camber issue? I can see extensive cracking of the rubber mount...great.

If something were to bend what could be the culprit? I cant tell if any up of upper control arms bent--they look straight and the rubber bushes look fine.

Could the spring "saddle" break or deteriorate somehow causing it to sit lower? I couldn't find any evidence of this.
could be something bent. I'd take it in for an alignment and see if they can get it into spec. If they can't get the camber into spec in the rear, it's usually the ball joints. The subframe bushing should have nothing to do with alignment. Did you look at the swing arm bushings? How old are they?
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 09-29-2021, 11:12 PM
andrewwynn's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Racine, WI
Posts: 10,818
andrewwynn will become famous soon enough
The usual defects causing sudden change in suspension alignment are usually the wishbone inner side or the rose bushing (ball joint at the bottom).

You will not be able to "wiggle" the tire unless you first remove the spring tension.

https://youtu.be/VYTMJ4qUbFE

This video shows the prime suspect of a quick change in toe or camber.
__________________
2011 E70 • N55 (me)
2012 E70 • N63 (wife)
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 09-29-2021, 11:13 PM
andrewwynn's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Racine, WI
Posts: 10,818
andrewwynn will become famous soon enough
The subframe is one big piece. If it shifts it would just make the car crab durn the road not affect camber


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
__________________
2011 E70 • N55 (me)
2012 E70 • N63 (wife)
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 09-29-2021, 11:14 PM
RocketyMan's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: PNW
Posts: 553
RocketyMan is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fifty150hs View Post
could be something bent. I'd take it in for an alignment and see if they can get it into spec. If they can't get the camber into spec in the rear, it's usually the ball joints. The subframe bushing should have nothing to do with alignment. Did you look at the swing arm bushings? How old are they?
The lower control arm bushings are about 1 year old. They're urethane.
__________________
2003 BMW X5 3.0i -- MT5, 3.64s final gears, H&R lowering springs, K-Mac bushing kit
2007 BMW X3 3.0Si -- MT6
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 09-29-2021, 11:15 PM
andrewwynn's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Racine, WI
Posts: 10,818
andrewwynn will become famous soon enough
They also won't affect camber in any meaningful way.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
__________________
2011 E70 • N55 (me)
2012 E70 • N63 (wife)
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 09-30-2021, 12:06 AM
crystalworks's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: SA, TX
Posts: 6,414
crystalworks is on a distinguished road
Would blowing the rear shocks and/or the rear strut mounts tearing through cause the suspension to sag? Notice any fluid leaking from the rear shocks? In my head without aid from the rear shocks the truck would squat on the springs and cause negative camber.
__________________
2005 X5 4.4i Build 04/05 Maintenance/Build Log
Nav, Pano, Sport (Purchased 06/14 w/ 109,000 miles) (Sold 8/15 w/121,000 miles)


2006 X5 4.8is Build 11/05 Maintenance/Build Log
Nav, DSP, Pano, Running Boards, OEM Tow Hitch, Cold Weather Pckg (Purchased 08/15 w/ 90,500 miles)

2010 X5 35d Build 02/10
Nav, HiFi, 6 DVD, Sports Pckg, Cold Weather Pckg, HUD, CAS, Running Boards, Leather Dash, PDC, Pano (Purchased 03/17 w/ 136,120 miles)
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 09-30-2021, 12:27 AM
RocketyMan's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: PNW
Posts: 553
RocketyMan is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewwynn View Post
The usual defects causing sudden change in suspension alignment are usually the wishbone inner side or the rose bushing (ball joint at the bottom).

You will not be able to "wiggle" the tire unless you first remove the spring tension.

https://youtu.be/VYTMJ4qUbFE

This video shows the prime suspect of a quick change in toe or camber.
I replaced the ball joint last year with a delphi as well as the the integral link that goes along with it.

Tomorrow I'll try jacking up the control arm a little bit to see if I can take off pressure and feel for any play.
__________________
2003 BMW X5 3.0i -- MT5, 3.64s final gears, H&R lowering springs, K-Mac bushing kit
2007 BMW X3 3.0Si -- MT6
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 09-30-2021, 12:32 AM
RocketyMan's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: PNW
Posts: 553
RocketyMan is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by crystalworks View Post
Would blowing the rear shocks and/or the rear strut mounts tearing through cause the suspension to sag? Notice any fluid leaking from the rear shocks? In my head without aid from the rear shocks the truck would squat on the springs and cause negative camber.
No, I don't notice and misting or leaks from the rear shocks. What I do notice is some fresh looking rust on the inside of the rotor. I would think a wheel bearing would be very noticeable. I can take off the rotor tomorrow and have a looksie.

On the picture, you can see the upper portion of the inner fender liner where the tire rubbed on the hard bump. You can also see on the inside of the rotor shield some fresh looking rust...I never seen it before.

My springs there I also checked to see if any of the coils broke and couldn't see anything broke.
Attached Images
 
__________________
2003 BMW X5 3.0i -- MT5, 3.64s final gears, H&R lowering springs, K-Mac bushing kit
2007 BMW X3 3.0Si -- MT6
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 09-30-2021, 10:11 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Menlo Park, CA
Posts: 2,311
Fifty150hs is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by RocketyMan View Post
No, I don't notice and misting or leaks from the rear shocks. What I do notice is some fresh looking rust on the inside of the rotor. I would think a wheel bearing would be very noticeable. I can take off the rotor tomorrow and have a looksie.

On the picture, you can see the upper portion of the inner fender liner where the tire rubbed on the hard bump. You can also see on the inside of the rotor shield some fresh looking rust...I never seen it before.

My springs there I also checked to see if any of the coils broke and couldn't see anything broke.
How much did you lower your truck with the lowering springs? I put coilovers on mine and lowered it 2". With that much drop I had to replace both control arms with adjustable ones to be able to get the alignment into spec.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On





All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:55 AM.
vBulletin, Copyright 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0
© 2017 Xoutpost.com. All rights reserved. Xoutpost.com is a private enthusiast site not associated with BMW AG.
The BMW name, marks, M stripe logo, and Roundel logo as well as X3, X5 and X6 designations used in the pages of this Web Site are the property of BMW AG.
This web site is not sponsored or affiliated in any way with BMW AG or any of its subsidiaries.