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  #31  
Old 05-02-2010, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by motordavid View Post
BigR,
I am also glad to see you cruise back in here, occasionally...

My comment about my continual "question" to my GeezerBuds is somewhat rhetorical, as I know most of them get their entire "news" from ~10 mins of Fox or Rush, et al.
Doesn't mean those sources suck, but a couple snippets of that stuff is not exactly "fair and balanced", or fully informative imo.

Thus, other than the usual right/conservative suspects, they can offer no real good ideas on "who" and "why".

(I always wonder what "conservative values" really means, even after reading some blogs/definitions/position papers on that toss around term.)

Back on point, sort of, Paul would be interesting and about a 180 from standard party machine politics in the US, but I suspect he has less chance than me breaking 75.
I have read considerably on he and his positions and ideas, but he may be too "smart" and tenuous for the typical TeaParty or RepublicanDem stuffed suits.

No polit xpert here, as I find myself ranting at all most all of them, and there are few I would hire to help me pick up yard debris, let alone "guide" me in any serious life task.

Things and, politics, and the Noise in this country is as loud and obnoxious and inane, and non-constructive, as I can recall in my 6+ decades here. I have no answer(s)...
it will probably not get better.

Good to read you again Ryan, and very good to read your back is on the heal.
BR, mD
Thanks MD

Will be very interesting to see how Obama handles current times, lots of drama in the world right now. My feeling is, like yours, no matter what he does Rep will say he sucks, Dems will say he rocks and the lowly intelligent minority will be left collectively saying WTF
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  #32  
Old 05-02-2010, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Wagner View Post
Thanks MD

Will be very interesting to see how Obama handles current times, lots of drama in the world right now. My feeling is, like yours, no matter what he does Rep will say he sucks, Dems will say he rocks and the lowly intelligent minority will be left collectively saying WTF

Politics as usual, and nothing will ever change.
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  #33  
Old 05-02-2010, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by motordavid View Post
No polit xpert here, as I find myself ranting at all most all of them, and there are few I would hire to help me pick up yard debris, let alone "guide" me in any serious life task.

Things and, politics, and the Noise in this country is as loud and obnoxious and inane, and non-constructive, as I can recall in my 6+ decades here. I have no answer(s)...it will probably not get better.
Again.
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  #34  
Old 05-02-2010, 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Quicksilver View Post
Politics as usual, and nothing will ever change.
Yup. The problem is people, in their dismay, stop questioning and thinking and start simply picking their side. Liberal...or Conservative...and move out from there. For every person thats post cracking a joke on FoxNews, the same could be done for a CNN or HuffingtonPost. You just look dumb when you prance around making proclamations about opinion persons of 'news' channels. People miss the markets that new agencies compete for, some are international in nature, some are focused on America which confuses people more as they attempt to lob all the fruit in one basket. And in classic fashion, right off the real news because there is also opinion.

The truth is it is very hard and tiring to attempt to really follow an issue. The game is setup that way intentionally. The less you know the more moves they can make. Even the Tea Party, which I am a proud member of, has its nut jobs. Pushing Palin as some 'leader' is just dumb. I would far more attribute Tea Party concepts to Ron Paul than any other talking head. I'll keep fighting the logic battle for my side, as fruitless as it may be, but hey..I can so I will
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We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

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  #35  
Old 05-03-2010, 12:41 AM
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Just curious wagner, as a proud tea party member what exactly do you think this movement stands for? Whenever I see tea party activists on tv I see a bunch of silly morons with signs that don't make much sense at all. Are all tea party members making more than $250,000/year and as a result concerned about tax increases? I don't mean to come off rude just looking for an educated opinion from the other side of the fence. I often group these people into a category I like to call uneducated racists who "want their country back" whatever that means. I certainly wouldn't think you fit that bill, so what is your reasoning?
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  #36  
Old 05-03-2010, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by CarsRmyVICE View Post
Just curious wagner, as a proud tea party member what exactly do you think this movement stands for? Whenever I see tea party activists on tv I see a bunch of silly morons with signs that don't make much sense at all. Are all tea party members making more than $250,000/year and as a result concerned about tax increases? I don't mean to come off rude just looking for an educated opinion from the other side of the fence. I often group these people into a category I like to call uneducated racists who "want their country back" whatever that means. I certainly wouldn't think you fit that bill, so what is your reasoning?
Certainly. And I appreciate you asking

First thing first, I'm a Libertarian which generally means I have a strong love for the US Constitution and Bill of Rights (in fact both these documents along with the Declaration of Independence are hanging in my office). I believe that the Federal government is controlled by these two documents, not the people being limited by these documents. I was not a fan of GW Bush and didn't vote for him once.

I make more than $250,000 (I can't speak for everyone else, but of the group I was talking to I was the only one making 6 figures), I have owned and sold businesses. I can get into the cons of owning a Type-S incorporation if you'd like, just ask. But federal laws and tax structure CRUSH small business.

Here is what I stand for as a Tea Party member:

- balanced budget
- non progressive tax system
- considerably less Federal Government interaction and involvement in private business and lives
- banishment of the Federal Reserve system, which greatly assisted in creating both the housing and financial crisis
- Health care reform that starts by knocking down the federal barrier to state competition
- No bailout for private industry
- No government push for unionization of labor
- Environmental standards that make sense in form and function
- No deficit spending, the logic behind running up trillions in debt with no plan to repay is staggering


Those are my primary feelings and my thoughts. I got involved over a year ago and have seen, as with many things that attempt to be labeled and grouped, the fringe elements get the most coverage. I would love for people who think the Tea Party people are a bunch of loons, to actually go to an event and simply walk around without bias. And generate an opinion. I fully understand why people get this view that they are lunatics, that is what you're being shown. At one Tea Party rally I actually watched a bus load of ACORN union activists come in (completely from out of town, so shipped in) and when they saw the size of the crowd they were competing with, they drove away. The point is, some new groups are doing everything they can to minimize or dramatize the Tea Party folks. Do the Tea Parties have nuts? Of course, just like any group. A lot of people think that Republicans started the Tea Party, absolutely not. It is just that Republicans are PRO Tea Party simply because, at this point in time, the Tea Party has a lot of complaint about the administration and legislature. What Republicans don't get is, we don't like them either Oh, and for the record..I'm not a Republican. The days of Republicans being conservatives are long gone.
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An unwavering defender of those I see worth protecting.

"promote the general welfare, not provide the general welfare"

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.


Last edited by Wagner; 05-03-2010 at 09:32 AM.
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  #37  
Old 05-03-2010, 11:34 AM
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Wagner, thanks for the detailed response. It is obvious you are passionate about the cause. I am familiar with corporate legal form and the tax structures that noose them. I must say I am one of those people who thinks/thought that a republican think tank shit out this tea party movement. Especially when I see morons like Palin showing up at the rallies. You make several excellent points about our country's transformation from what it once was to the semi-socialist republic we now live in. I will say I think some of your ideas are far fetched such as banishment of the federal reserve system. With that said, my undergraduate education was in finance and I can surely understand your quarrel with the fed. (I have no intentions of being a banker after spending the summer at Merrill lynch....so no witch hunt ) Additionally, I feel that it is extremely difficult if not irrational to live word for word off documents written over 200 years ago (aside from the bill of rights). I do not support the governments recent stomping on these documents, but I do not think our country could be run any better adhering to the principals outlined in the constitution and declaration alone. Last but not lease I do not yet make over 250,000. As someone who intends to own and operate a small business in our economy, I must say I have several concerns as you are well aware of. I sure as death intend to one day be in that higher tax bracket that's currently being progressively taxed and will acknowledge that my opinion may change when that day comes.
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  #38  
Old 05-03-2010, 12:48 PM
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Great to see you back Wagner. This forum is heavily weighted toward the Government will save us crowd and really needs some balance.

MrLabGuy, Libertarian who believes in Personal Responsibility which includes corporations, government and individual citizens.
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  #39  
Old 05-03-2010, 01:08 PM
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Great to see you back Wagner. This forum is heavily weighted toward the Government will save us crowd and really needs some balance.

MrLabGuy, Libertarian who believes in Personal Responsibility which includes corporations, government and individual citizens.
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  #40  
Old 05-03-2010, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by CarsRmyVICE View Post
Just curious wagner, as a proud tea party member what exactly do you think this movement stands for? Whenever I see tea party activists on tv I see a bunch of silly morons with signs that don't make much sense at all. Are all tea party members making more than $250,000/year and as a result concerned about tax increases? I don't mean to come off rude just looking for an educated opinion from the other side of the fence. I often group these people into a category I like to call uneducated racists who "want their country back" whatever that means. I certainly wouldn't think you fit that bill, so what is your reasoning?
You've not seen silly morons with signs until you've been to San Francisco. Most of America gets their information from news reports and thus an opinion about the Tea Party Movement. The Liberal Media likes a story and focuses on the fringe element in their reporting.

Those in the movement who "want their country back" would like to see a move toward our founding principals. The founders purposely set limits on the government for good reason. America under the rule of Progressives is "progressing" toward the European model of government. The core message of the Tea Party movement is one where Government plays less of a role in the lives of Americans. Government and our taxes should focus on Defense and infrastructure. There was a time when local governments used taxes for Schools, Roads, Fire and Police. Taxes have increased and yet our roads crumble, schools are being closed while fire and police are scaled back due to lack of funds. Ask yourself why... Not for lack of funds but for lack of financial discipline.

What we need as I've said is personal responsibility. Not another political program or government committee to solve our problems.
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