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Originally Posted by crystalworks
I certainly am not for the hyper or draconian reaction that some countries took. Could PPE have been more available? Yes. Should our health care system be much more capable. Uh huh. Could bars and dine-in restaurants have been closed sooner, sure. They should probably still be closed. Could face coverings have been mandated in businesses sooner. Yep. Schools should be closed. But I don't know what kind of realistic approach could have been taken by the American government, under anyone's leadership you guys are looking for that would have greatly changed the numbers. If we are blaming the government, fine, don't focus on Trump. As Happy pointed out pelosi screwed the pooch too, in more instances than one. Congress' constant bickering and inaction is equally to blame.
We have the ability to protect ourselves regardless of other's actions. My family went through an initial shelter in place phase out of shock and concern as well. And was upset by people not wearing face coverings. But we've all gotten over that and are now taking more reasonable precautions. Home schooling our daughter, wear a mask when in any business, avoid crowds (especially those prone to have non mask wearers), no eating out, etc. The only real big impact is the home schooling. Fortunately masks in businesses are mandated here.
180,000 deaths (190 now?) sounds like a huge number. And it is, depending on context. But we have no idea what percentage of those are covid deaths (healthy person dying after contacting covid), covid contributed deaths (underlying conditions), or misdiagnosed deaths. Our family has personally had to deal with a covid misdiagnosis.
I am NOT a Trump supporter, but the continued outrage from the left has gotten worse than the outrage from the right when Obama was in office. Especially over covid, when both parties are to blame. There was an America before Trump and there will be one after Trump. If the executive branch is failing us, the legislative, and judicial are supposed to course correct. If you are unhappy with current govt actions, vote all the incumbents out.
BTW, thank you for your service Happy (and all servicemen/women who frequent the forums). And I hope your family has recovered from their covid experiences.
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Considering what other countries and some areas in our country that implemented the recommended guidelines and their resulting success, it seems clear that we would have COVID-19 under control by now if we had had a Federal mandate to follow the guidelines across the country. I think a Federal mandate is still necessary and it should include severe enough penalties to act as an effective deterrent for those that choose not to cooperate for whatever reason.
I don't agree that those having underlining conditions should be eliminated from the Covid-19 death count. It doesn't mean they were already terminal. It means they are more likely to die if infected. For example, they could have diabetes or cancer and be doing fine. They might have lived another 30 years with either disease. They get Covid-19 and die. Why isn't the cause of death the virus?
The leaders of a country, just as in a business, are responsible for the actions taken by those they manage. They don't get to shift the blame to anyone else. It doesn't matter what Pelosi or anyone else does. In this cause, Trump was directly involved in the mismanagement. It wasn't the fault of anyone else in his administration though they violated their oath of office by not speaking up. He personally downplayed the recommendations of the scientists and still is. He puts his support for defiance of the guidelines on display at televised rallies for all to see. At best that is dereliction of duty, a violation of his oath of office. In a business, certainly a corporation, he would have been fired long ago.
I agree that the House, Senate and President don't work together. That is also part of the job of a President to see that they do.
It requires a two thirds vote by House and Senate to override a veto by the President. Historically that has happened less than ten percent of the time. As it is now that will never happen an either side of the isle. That leaves no possibility of a course correction. And since most votes are party line driven, voting out incumbents isn't going to become a priority. I think term limits should be applied to the house and senate but I can't see those in office in favor of doing so, even suggesting consideration.
IMO, the best we can hope for is that at some point the House and Senate have a significant majority of the same party as the president. Bi-partisan support is at least two terms away and only with forced mending of the major fences separating the parties. Right now they are calling each other stupid, crazy or worse. That only makes things worse. Those are fighting words and working very well.
Less than 45% of eligible Americans vote. Perhaps 1 or 2 here will decide voting is important. If another 10% start voting, or whatever critical mass is, major changes are very possible.