x5 - how often need to change spark plugs if at all?

[FSETH]

Originally Posted by X5SilverBeast

I gotch bro. I honestly had no clue who mike miller was. Now that you have shed some light on who he is, I'll look into. I don't mean to sound arrogant or cocky, just wanted to give info on my personal experiences with maint. Coming from american muscle cars and chevy trucks, I've only been with the bmw brand for a little over 3.5 yrs. I know they are completely different and some of my methods work for chevy's and may not work on bmw's. But I look at it as trial and error as well as a learning lesson. My philosophy has always been, if you're not making mistakes, you're not learning.

No worries.

Yeah, there is a big difference between maintaining a modern BMW and a muscle car or a Chevy truck. OE plugs can go 100,000 miles, OE oil and filters have been proven to go up to 15,000 miles with no signs of extra engine wear, etc. Apples to oranges.

Also, seeing as we are already way off the original poster's question regarding spark plug intervals, I think you are going to be waiting a long time for your m62 to die. Especially, if you are maintaining it properly (or over-maintaining it). More than likely the rest of the car is going to fall apart around it. If it does fail though, have you looked at Bavarian Auto Recycling for rebuilt engines? They come with a two year unlimited milage warranty and many new parts. Last I saw, you can do some simple performance upgrades during the build as well. I am not talking anywhere near 600 horsepower, but they can do the following and pricing should be about half (give or take) of the $25,000 you were quoted;

Upgrades include flow tested CNC porting, hand polishing, and Bavarian Performance Camshaft an increase over stock.

BMW Parts used and rebuilt bmw auto parts

I would never personally put a LS, or any other brand of motor into my BMW, but that is just me.

[m5james]

BavEngine's site has changed drastically since I was on there last, but they were the ones who rebuild and did all the "performance option" machining on my engine. At that time though, they were doing the actual work themselves. I can't remember the last time I spoke to someone there, but since then they've contracted their work out to someone else. I didn't pay $25k, but it was around $13k after it was all said and done.

If I had to do it again though, I'd have gone LSx as I purely love my 7 for it's body size and interior room, but to have a complete package that is easier to tune, maintain, etc would definately be nice. There are days I drive around in either the 7 or the X and still find myself looking at the OBC or temp needle, just waiting for it to jump to the right...again. It's definately a love/hate relationship.

[X5SilverBeast]

Brand new LS3 crate motors run about 6-7K. Give or take a few thousand dollars more for wiring harness and fabrication. Get an m5 rear differential off a donor and you got yourself a classy rocket. I feel the same way as m5james, love the look of my e39 and really would love to keep it for as long as possible. I don't mind rebuilding suspensions and reconditioning other items. Don't get me wrong BMW's make great cars, that's what drove me on getting the wife the X5. But it sucks for me considering supersprint is the only company to offer headers and they are like $3K. It seems BMW has an extremely high cost for parts compared to other manufacturers, which in hindsite do the same thing. Stock LS3 pushing 400hp or more compared to a stock M62 pushing 282 at the crank. I'll take an LS3. But I still love BMW engines. Just look at all the hot rodders out there taking SB and BB chevy motors and putting them in fords, mercurys,etc. Just went to the good guy nationals this past weekend and it felt like every other car had an LS motor. They are really a dime a dozen.

[FSETH]

Originally Posted by X5SilverBeast

Brand new LS3 crate motors run about 6-7K. Give or take a few thousand dollars more for wiring harness and fabrication. Get an m5 rear differential off a donor and you got yourself a classy rocket. I feel the same way as m5james, love the look of my e39 and really would love to keep it for as long as possible. I don't mind rebuilding suspensions and reconditioning other items. Don't get me wrong BMW's make great cars, that's what drove me on getting the wife the X5. But it sucks for me considering supersprint is the only company to offer headers and they are like $3K. It seems BMW has an extremely high cost for parts compared to other manufacturers, which in hindsite do the same thing. Stock LS3 pushing 400hp or more compared to a stock M62 pushing 282 at the crank. I'll take an LS3. But I still love BMW engines. Just look at all the hot rodders out there taking SB and BB chevy motors and putting them in fords, mercurys,etc. Just went to the good guy nationals this past weekend and it felt like every other car had an LS motor. They are really a dime a dozen.

This is where we differ. If I wanted more power, but still like the e39 body, I would sell your 540 and buy an e39 M5 before I ever even thought about doing as LS swap. I am sure you can almost get an M5 with the sale of your 540 and the additional savings of $10,000+/- from the cost of the LS swap. Not to mention the resale value on that LS swapped 540 would be garbage unless you found just the right buyer. Plus, I would much rather have the s62 M engine than an LS any day and there are plenty of tuning options for that motor.

[X5SilverBeast]

Originally Posted by FSETH

This is where we differ. If I wanted more power, but still like the e39 body, I would sell your 540 and buy an e39 M5 before I ever even thought about doing as LS swap. I am sure you can almost get an M5 with the sale of your 540 and the additional savings of $10,000+/- from the cost of the LS swap. Not to mention the resale value on that LS swapped 540 would be garbage unless you found just the right buyer. Plus, I would much rather have the s62 M engine than an LS any day and there are plenty of tuning options for that motor.

I see your point and actually considered doing so before the LS swap came to light. Very true as far as tuning options. That has really upset me that the M62 doesn't have very many options to squeeze out HP for a decent price. I've been all over BFC and M5Board and noticed the S62 has a little more maint. items to worry about over the m62(also mine is prevanos and the 97/98 came with the bigger intake over the vanos m62tu). I'm not worried about selling the 540 with an LS swap due to the fact I'll probably end up keeping the car for a long time. But for a stock M5, say 400hp, with high mileage or low mileage, I could probably do the ls swap for around the same price.(Not sure as I haven't priced out the e39 m5 lately.) Also, with few bolt-on mods, I can push a lot more HP with the LS motor for a lot cheaper than the S62. Cams are cheap on an LS compared to the S62. I've also considered FI just like m5james. But with adding FI, I've always been under the impression with high mileage engines, you may want to rebuild the internals to take the added boost. which is an additional cost.

I'm def. not worried about the resale value of the car. That pretty much took a dive over the past few years. When I bought the 540, paid like 13K and NADA was at 18K. Now you can buy any e39 other than an M5 for like 3K or more. I totally get where you are coming from, but the bond I have with my car now, makes me wanna keep it for a long time. Plus, you don't see very many e39 with an LS motor. It's like frankenstein on steriods. lol

[m5james]

My 7 is probably worth 8-10k on the market now considering the odometer mileage, I can't add 13k to the price to recoup my costs, so resale value is irrelevant if your keeping the car for yourself. People always throw out to just sell their car to get the M5, but I look at it like this:

Between the loss of money in whatever you're selling, profits made from the dealership/private party of you purchasing the M5, entering a whole new (to you) vehicle with an unknown history of maintenance, probably higher mileage or pay more for a lower mileage vehicle, increased insurance....

Or keep the car you already know and love, do an engine swap with a BRAND NEW engine and you've basically paid for the biggest hit of why people go and buy another car anyways...to get something with lower mileage and more reliable. Regardless of how old the body is, you don't get more reliable than a brand new drivetrain.

It's what classic car owners have been doing for years, taking cars that are 20, 30, 40+ years old, adding in newer and more modern power in a perfectly fine chassis and keeping it for their own personal benefit. I don't buy things for my vehicles to consider what it's going to do to resale value, I do it for myself. I personally like BMW's because of the name, their handling, and in the particular case of my 7, the interior size. An engine swap isn't going to take that away from the bigger picture if I keep the car. I could do an engine swap and no one would know the wiser, so there is no real downside. If the time comes that I'm getting rid of it anyways, it's either because the interior gets too ratted out and sloppy, has been wrecked, or I just felt like a change. I've seen guys spend 10's of thousands on custom cars for shows, their own benefit, etc. listing a grocery list of mods and what they spent...and then still selling it for 1/4 of what they're into it for. With a few RARE exceptions, car aren't an investment, so make it what you want and enjoy it for what it's worth.

[X5SilverBeast]

Originally Posted by m5james

My 7 is probably worth 8-10k on the market now considering the odometer mileage, I can't add 13k to the price to recoup my costs, so resale value is irrelevant if your keeping the car for yourself. People always throw out to just sell their car to get the M5, but I look at it like this:

Between the loss of money in whatever you're selling, profits made from the dealership/private party of you purchasing the M5, entering a whole new (to you) vehicle with an unknown history of maintenance, probably higher mileage or pay more for a lower mileage vehicle, increased insurance....

Or keep the car you already know and love, do an engine swap with a BRAND NEW engine and you've basically paid for the biggest hit of why people go and buy another car anyways...to get something with lower mileage and more reliable. Regardless of how old the body is, you don't get more reliable than a brand new drivetrain.

It's what classic car owners have been doing for years, taking cars that are 20, 30, 40+ years old, adding in newer and more modern power in a perfectly fine chassis and keeping it for their own personal benefit. I don't buy things for my vehicles to consider what it's going to do to resale value, I do it for myself. I personally like BMW's because of the name, their handling, and in the particular case of my 7, the interior size. An engine swap isn't going to take that away from the bigger picture if I keep the car. I could do an engine swap and no one would know the wiser, so there is no real downside. If the time comes that I'm getting rid of it anyways, it's either because the interior gets too ratted out and sloppy, has been wrecked, or I just felt like a change. I've seen guys spend 10's of thousands on custom cars for shows, their own benefit, etc. listing a grocery list of mods and what they spent...and then still selling it for 1/4 of what they're into it for. With a few RARE exceptions, car aren't an investment, so make it what you want and enjoy it for what it's worth.

Couldn't have said any better than that. Doing the same with my 81 silverado, ground up restoration. It's really great when you've designed this car in your head and after countless hours working on and money spent, the final project is exactly what you've wanted. Priceless. Especially in my circumstances, it's a family project. I will be teaching my daughter every step of the way.

[FSETH]

Originally Posted by X5SilverBeast

I see your point and actually considered doing so before the LS swap came to light. Very true as far as tuning options. That has really upset me that the M62 doesn't have very many options to squeeze out HP for a decent price. I've been all over BFC and M5Board and noticed the S62 has a little more maint. items to worry about over the m62(also mine is prevanos and the 97/98 came with the bigger intake over the vanos m62tu). I'm not worried about selling the 540 with an LS swap due to the fact I'll probably end up keeping the car for a long time. But for a stock M5, say 400hp, with high mileage or low mileage, I could probably do the ls swap for around the same price.(Not sure as I haven't priced out the e39 m5 lately.) Also, with few bolt-on mods, I can push a lot more HP with the LS motor for a lot cheaper than the S62. Cams are cheap on an LS compared to the S62. I've also considered FI just like m5james. But with adding FI, I've always been under the impression with high mileage engines, you may want to rebuild the internals to take the added boost. which is an additional cost.

I'm def. not worried about the resale value of the car. That pretty much took a dive over the past few years. When I bought the 540, paid like 13K and NADA was at 18K. Now you can buy any e39 other than an M5 for like 3K or more. I totally get where you are coming from, but the bond I have with my car now, makes me wanna keep it for a long time. Plus, you don't see very many e39 with an LS motor. It's like frankenstein on steriods. lol

I hear you on resale value, but the e39 M5 will bottom out then likely increase over time. Especially if you hold onto it as long as you are making it sound. The LS swap is pretty much worthless to anyone else besides you immediately. If the higher cost of adding HP to the BMW is a major concern, you have to realize that unless you are 100% sure you are going to keep the car forever, at some point when do you sell it, you will recoup some of that money with an original M5. Just pointing that out.

I am not a fan of FI on cars that come stock NA. I would rather have the NA version, personally.

You are right about LS being cheaper horsepower though. BMW horsepower does not come cheap. You have to pay to play. It is a higher end car and that is just the reality of it. You can mod a Camaro, Mustang, Civic, etc. for much cheaper than a BMW. The only real exception is an ecu flash for the current BMW turbo motors. That is some of the cheapest BMW horsepower you are ever going to get.

At the end of the day though, I agree with you that if you are looking for a 600 hp monster for as cheap as possible and don't care about it affecting the authenticity or resale value of your BMW, then the LS swap may be the best option for you.

[m5james]

Coming from cars and truck that were factory turbo or S/C, the term "pay to play" was never so true until I came into BMW's. If I do an engine swap, as I said, no one will know the wiser (if I don't tell them) so I will still have a highend car...just FAR more affordable. Those guys with a 3 series and a LSx in their car, yeah, they'll have a harder time passing it off, but in a 5, 7 or even an X that already comes V8, it wouldn't be any louder than stock with a proper exhaust system or could be just as loud as some of the X's I've heard on here with aftermarket exhaust.

I'm no purist...I like fast sleepers, and then couple that with the shock factor of opening the hood to show the gem inside the box and/or roasting someone off the line/at the track in my luxo barge 7...that's what puts the smile on my face to this day Someone will always be faster, but with an LSx drivetrain, at least my options to keep up with the Jones' would be far greater. The lack of aftermarket mods for the M62 isn't the engines problem, it's the same issue I have now...finding some REASONABLE to tune it. There are a handful of twin S/C M5's running around, but I can guarantee they're in the 6 figure range in mods...to me that is rediculious, all to keep the BMW engine? I'd rather hit their numbers for as little as 1/10th the price, by the time I sell my car it'll probably be worth a grand or so at best, so if going to GM is the answer to keep her on the road and keep up with modern technology, so be it. To each their own though.

People are doing this all this time - http://www.bing.com/search?q=bmw+lsx...AVB01D&pc=AVBR, http://www.google.com/#hl=en&expIds=...b964bcc94c5a63, http://www.google.com/#hl=en&expIds=...b964bcc94c5a63

[FSETH]

If you are no purist, then more power to you. Unfortunately though, great motors and handling are the two best things about BMW's and you would be removing 50% of that equation. I would personally be utterly dissappointed when the hood was opened to reveal a Chevy crate motor. Pure blaspheme.

Now if you opened the hood of a 540i or 740i and there was an s62 tuned to the gills, that is a completely different story. Any other way just cheapens it, imo. Sorry guys.