Why can't US car maker build a quality product?
 

2 words....Labor Union

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/4815646.stm - GM markes a 10.2B dollar loss for 2005

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/4639034.stm - Ford closes 14 plants, cuts 30,000 jobs


Take all this in to account: higher labor rates + labor unions + higher manufacturing costs + higher EPA/Government regulations = hard times for business.

My point being all these peeps that run around asking, "why can't the US build a quality car?" Well, with all the above "costs" a quality US car would start in the high 50K's, so to compete you have to cut somewhere and since you can't bypass the Government...you cut the product. Why? Because you can always recall and fix the product. IMO this is why US cars have such reliability issues along with build quality problems.

I agree that the US car makers are drowning in red ink, but the truth is that US car makers are doing a lot better at making reliable cars. We have to keep in mind that the US car makers pump out hundreds of thousands of cars a year while the European manufacturers produce far less. Ironically, the reliability of the Euro cars, and some japanese cars, are being passed by the US manufacturers. That is not to say that the non-US cars are getting worse, not at al, the US manufacturers are just doing better.

That being said, Roger Penske needs to be hired as the next CEO of GM. He turned Detroit Diesel around in under 5 years, from a 3% market share when GM owned them to a 30% share, and he did it by competing with Cummins!

I've posted this many times, maybe it should be a sticky :)

http://www.jdpower.com/presspass/pr/images/2005089a.gif

The other 2 words. Crappy products. Unions don't stop people from buying a quality product.

They do when $1500-$2000of every car goes to paying the union members health care and pension for the rest of their lives.

That may be true for some folks. However I just bought a 2006 530i. The money I paid for it i could have bought 2 American cars. Why didn't i? Was it because $1500-$2000 of every car goes to paying the union members health care and pension for the rest of their lives? NO. I didn't find anything that i thought measured up to my dollar. Why not just build a better product that people are willing to buy then you can pay your bills and stop whining about what it's costing you to do business. I agree that American Auto Makers Need to pull together their business model but it's all a lot of talk until you make a product that someone wants to buy.

Quicksilver, you also have to remember the major consumer base isn't buying vehicles over $40K. They are buying vehicles between $15-$33K. I believe dollar for dollar there are a few GM (Cadillac) vehicles that could compete easily with a 5-series. Individual preference may lead in a different direction, but there is competition.

When you have a company like a GM or Ford, these are companies that own multitudes of other companies or at least have major stake in others. What drives me nuts is when people in general go "US car makers can't build a good product" that just isn't true, what is true is they can't build a seriously competing vehicle for the cost. IMO all automakers should cross their fingers and pray to the car-Gods that China doesn't decide it wants a serious auto industry. The amount of "free" labor there would kill Japan/Euro/US sales all together.

I'm not following you. You paid 2x what an American manufacturer would charge you for a car because why? What percentage of the US population do you think can afford to spend, what? almost $70k when all is said and done, on a car, when their average income is somewhere in the $50k's?

People pay 2x as much because, well there's no nice way to put it, because they like the status symbol of it. Reliability being equal, there is no reason to spend more than $20k on a car these days, unless people want the 'extras'. Don't get me wrong, I like buying higher end cars myself, i'm not throwing stones in a glass house, but to deny the facts that most people buy BMW, DC/MB, Audi, Ferrari etc etc, isn't because they need basic transportation, it's for a lot of intangible reasons that none of us like to admit because it makes us look shallow and prideful.

Exactly.

YAHOOOO Got everyone's juices going. IT'S MONDAY. Yep all of you are correct. Theres a lot of truth in every one of your arguements. I for one was just stirring the pot. Your right I didn't buy a BMW because i needed basic transportation it was because I'm getting old and do not intend on going out without having some fun. Now maybe that may be an intangible reason but all i have to say about that is "keep on living". I believe your own mortality will change that attitude.:rofl:

I have already seen the light at the end of the tunnel and it's a triain coming my way :) hence the '01 and '04 bmw's, the new house last year, the '04 vette, the breitling i'm looking to get... you can't take it with you, and you never know when your number is up, might as well enjoy it while you can.