What would the adequate punishment be?
 

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/...a-attack_x.htm

BATON ROUGE (AP) — A man repeatedly stabbed his toddler and estranged wife along an interstate while horrified people watched from their cars in rush-hour traffic Friday night, police and witnesses said.

The 2-year-old girl was in a car with her parents when her father started stabbing his wife with a kitchen knife along Interstate 110 near the Governor's Mansion, said Cpl. L'Jean McKneely, a Baton Rouge Police spokesman.

When the 26-year-old woman got out and ran for help from an East Baton Rouge Parish sheriff's deputy in squad car just ahead of them, her husband stabbed his daughter, McKneely said.

"He kept stabbing her until the knife was stuck in her head," witness Gloria Spears told WAFB-TV.

The man then put the girl on the highway and drove off, side-swiping the deputy's car and striking his wife, police said. He sped into downtown Baton Rouge and knocked down at least three utility poles before his car hurtled through the air and overturned on top of another vehicle.

All three were taken to Our Lady of the Lake Medical Center. The child was in "extremely critical" condition, with a cut "along her midsection and a kitchen knife lodged in her head," McKneely said.

Her mother, who was thrown 20 to 40 feet by the impact of the car, also had numerous stab wounds, he said. She was expected to live. The man was being treated for minor injuries, McKneely said.

McKneely said the couple, who was not identified, has been married for about six years but were currently living apart. It was not immediately clear what led to the stabbings.

What a lovely thing to read first thing on Saturday morning. :tsk:

Yes it is. The male (I refuse to call him a "man") is unfit to live, but may be the only one who does. :mad:

Yep some things are better left un-said or reported that is.

From the Wik...
my vote for the punishment for these punques, including
child molestors, et al.
Put the show on Pay TV.

I suspect your basic punque might think twice, knowing
what fine final play awaited him.

" ...the full punishment for the crime was to be "hanged, drawn, and quartered" in that the convict would be:

Dragged on a hurdle (a wooden frame) to the place of execution.
Hanged by the neck, but removed before death (hanged).
Disembowelled, and the genitalia and entrails burned before the victim's eyes (drawn).[1]
Beheaded and the body divided into four parts (quartered).
Typically, the resulting five parts (i.e., the four quarters of the body and the head) were gibbeted (put on public display) in different parts of the city or town to deter would-be traitors. ... "

I say send this person to a high security mental hospital for the rest of his life.

And there, in one sentence, you have the difference between conservatives and liberals. Conservatives feel the person is responsible for his actions, and should he choose antisocial actions, pay the penalty. In this case, heinous crimes against the helpless deserve loss of the offender's life. Liberals, on the other hand, feel the death of the offender is too strong a punishment, and they might not really be responsible for their behavior anyway; it is the result of mental illness/poor upbringing/violence on TV/global warming.

Eric,
That rec'd lifetime "treatment" in the LooneyBin:
is that on your nickel, or mine? :confused:

Maybe he'll play the TwinkieDefense?! :rolleyes:

Liberals do not believe that the purpose of putting someone in jail is for "punishment".

Time for a quiz:

1. What is the government agency that handles the prisons in your state called:

A: Department of Punishment
B: Department of Revenge
C: Department of Justice
D: Department of Correction


2. The employees who work in the prisons are called what?

A: Punishment Officer
B: Security officer
C: Justice officer
D: Corrections officer


3. Why do you think they are called that?

A: The name was randomly picked out of a basket
B: The name means nothing
C: The name has something to do with the purpose of the prisons and the goals of those who work in them.



That's a poor argument.

Here is some info for you:

New Jersey: Death Penalty has Cost Jew Jersey Taxpayers $253 Billion
A New Jersey Policy Perspectives report concluded that the state's death penalty has cost taxpayers $253 million since 1983, a figure that is over and above the costs that would have been incurred had the state utilized a sentence of life without parole instead of death. The study examined the costs of death penalty cases to prosecutor offices, public defender offices, courts, and correctional facilities. The report's authors said that the cost estimate is "very conservative" because other significant costs uniquely associated with the death penalty were not available. "From a strictly financial perspective, it is hard to reach a conclusion other than this: New Jersey taxpayers over the last 23 years have paid more than a quarter billion dollars on a capital punishment system that has executed no one," the report concluded. Since 1982, there have been 197 capital trials in New Jersey and 60 death sentences, of which 50 were reversed. There have been no executions, and 10 men are housed on the state's death row. Michael Murphy, former Morris County prosecutor, remarked: "If you were to ask me how $11 million a year could best protect the people of New Jersey, I would tell you by giving the law enforcement community more resources. I'm not interested in hypotheticals or abstractions, I want the tools for law enforcement to do their job, and $11 million can buy a lot of tools." (See Newsday, Nov. 21, 2005; also Press Release, New Jerseyans for Alternatives to the Death Penalty, Nov. 21, 2005). Read the Executive Summary. Read the full report. Read the NJADP Press Release.


Tennessee: Study Finds Death penalty Costly, Ineffective

• Death penalty trials cost an average of 48% more than the average cost of trials in which prosecutors seek life imprisonment.
• Tennessee District Attorneys General are not consistent in their pursuit of the death penalty.
• Surveys and interviews of district attorneys indicate that some prosecutors "use the death penalty as a 'bargaining chip' to secure plea bargains for lesser sentences."
• Previous research provides no clear indication whether the death penalty acts as a method of crime prevention.
• The Tennessee Court of Criminal Appeals reversed 29 percent of capital cases on direct appeal.
• Although any traumatic trial may cause stress and pain for jurors, the victims' family, and the defendant's family, the pressure may be at its peak during death penalty trials.

• The investigation costs for death-sentence cases were about 3 times greater than for non-death cases.
• The trial costs for death cases were about 16 times greater than for non-death cases ($508,000 for death case; $32,000 for non-death case).
• The appeal costs for death cases were 21 times greater.
• The costs of carrying out (i.e. incarceration and/or execution) a death sentence were about half the costs of carrying out a non-death sentence in a comparable case.
• Trials involving a death sentence averaged 34 days, including jury selection; non-death trials averaged about 9 days.

Ahh nah, executions and such are only expensive now because people have made the justice system and correctional system a fruitcake. Commit murder? Death is the penalty? Shot that afternoon. DONE. Money spent, a couple of court days...some scientists and a .45 cal round. Mistakes will happen, sure, but the bulk will be very much guilty.

:iagree:

AbsolfookinLutely, Ryan. Succinct and it is the primary and basic reason for the "costs" and time.

* * * * * * * *

Nice links and C&Ps, Eric...and, I am sincere. But, listing the "costs" of capital punishment and those processes is like listing the costs of keeping all the Gramps and Grams "alive" in the world via the medical "effort": Nice and startling stats and no one want to lose G&G or, put that 1/4% of the innocent poor bastards to death unjustly, but it is the Political & "Justice" process and, the morally corrupt/bible thumping idiots and their lobbies, that hold up/drag out/raise the price of offing the bad motherFu ckers, imo.

No arm wrestle...but, once one crosses society's line of decency and, basic live and let live foundation, in harmony and peace, then that MF'er is no fookin longer needed in that society or, on the freakin planet, imo.
BR,mD

Over the years, thousands of people on death row or with life in prison sentences have been released years later because new evidence proved they were innocent even after being convicted of murder by a jury.

If what you suggest is done, we will wrongly execute many people. Even one mistake like that is not acceptable IMO. What do you think?

:confused: :rofl:

Hold the phone...that'd make it wayyyy too easy for those "in power" to set up and snuff out those they think are undesireable or working against their causes, etc. It can't be like that- the appeals process is a check on people being set up or wrongly accused and we need to keep it on the books forever.

OTOH, Eric...calling the prison system the "Corrections System" is erroneous, as few get 'correct' while in there. Calling the War Department the Defense Department doesn't change anything except the nomenclature...it's still the War Department.

JV

How dare you to suggest that someone in our government is that corrupt that they would actually cause the death of another American citizen!! That is unacceptable!!

:rofl: :rofl: :nanana:

Well, I do call it as I see it, and I'm aware of very few former CIA/FBI/NSA higher ups dying in their sleep of natural causes...

It's much much higher than 1/4%.

Death Sentences Being Overturned in 2 of 3 Appeals

June 12, 2000

Reversals Are Attributed to Errors by Defense Lawyers, Police and Prosecutors

The most far-reaching study of the death penalty in the United States has found that two out of three sentences were overturned on appeal, mostly because of serious errors by incompetent defense lawyers or overzealous police officers and prosecutors who withheld evidence.

The study, an examination of appeals in all capital cases from the time the Supreme Court reinstated the death penalty, in 1976, to 1995, also found that 75 percent of the people whose death sentences were set aside were later given lesser sentences after retrials, in plea bargains or by order of a judge. An additional 7 percent were found not guilty on retrial.

----------

So between 1976 and 1995 (20 year period), 7% of those who were sentenced to death were found not guilty of murder after a later appeal.

Are you comfortable with executing murderers if it means that 7 out of every 100 that are executed are actually innocent of the crime?

As I stated, mistakes happen. How many of the guilty were guilty? I for one never intend to put myself in a scenario where I could be precieved, beyond a reasonable doubt, as a murderer. Maybe I just expect more out of society.

It is exactly that wait wait wait we could be wrong attitude that causes these problems in society. I'm pretty sure that had the two D'bags from Columbine been arrested you'd be the first to say "send them to a sanitarium" instead of "shoot them in the head". Two different schools of though, one no more 'correct' than the other.

And comparing stats from 76-95 in the year 2006 is asinine as so much of science has change in the 11 years since those stats were valid.

It was a number I grabbed at...that 7% stat is old news and most of it stems from pre-DNA days and slobs with crummy defense lawyers.

Am I comfortable with executing murderers...? Absolfookinlutely. Give them a fair trial on Wed., and hang'emhigh on Friday night. No injections, 10 years later.

Couldn't find a stat for you, on the % of death row guys that have never been convicted of another felony or heinous crime, but I suspect it is very, very small: thus, most death row punques are social trash, sociopaths and scum, neway.

I didn't know this was Debate Class 101, so I will avoid the C&Ps and the arm wrestle...I think you are missing my point: heinous acts of violence, esp. if they result if death of an innocent victim should provide for capital punishment, in a short time frame, for the azzhole that took someone's life, or diddled some kid. That's my position; all the Goog on the net will not change my opin. "Treatment", prison, etc., are for non-murderers and non-child molestors.
GL,mD

Maybe we need to establish a new penal colony, like in Papillon.

Some crap-hole rock in the middle of the ocean. Put 'em all there. If they win their appeal, we know where they're at. If they lose their appeal, we forget about them entirely.

They are removed permanently from society, and they lvie a happy, fullfilling, free-range lifestyle. Everybody wins.

I like your idea, YJ! :thumbup:

Sort of a Lord of the Flies, via Devil's Island, and Darwin at Work deal. :)

Sorry to dig up this old thread, but I read an interesting article today which is related:

U.S. Death Sentences Drop to 30-Year Low

The opinion was given by several of you in this thread that the long appeal process should not exist for those on death row, and those convicted and sentenced to death should be executed quickly, perhaps like Saddam Hussein was.

There then was discussion about wrongful executions and the fact that many death sentences have been overturned during later appeals. Your argument about this was that most of these sentences being overturned must have been due to new DNA evidence being introduced. If this was indeed true, then such mistakes would no longer be made as DNA evidence is now used whenever available.

But this article states the following:

Since the death penalty was reinstated, 123 people have been freed from death row after significant questions were raised about their convictions - 14 of them through DNA testing, according to the Death Penalty Information Center.


So out of the 123 cases where people were freed from death row, only 14 (or about 11%) were due to DNA evidence. That means that even with DNA evidence, 109 people would have been wrongfully executed had the appeal process not existed.

What you fail to point out in your statistics is how many of these "innocents" had a conviction overturned due to some mistake made by the prosecution. Just as in the fact that you think there are wrongly convicted innocents, there are surely some of those guilty bastards let off. I am pretty positive that all 109 were not innocent. The internet, and the world as well, is full of information that can satisfy any argument. I have to live with the fact that some guilty bastard is going to go free due to some technicality. This is in place to try AS BEST AS WE CAN to limit the "conviction" of innocent civillians. But to dismantle the system because of a fear that one innocent person may get caught in the trap is ludicrous (even though you are clearly entitled to your belief) There was an uproar recently with the "botched" execution of a convicted killer in Florida, because he "suffered" a few minutes longer than he should. I am personally glad the bastard suffered. I am sure he suffered less than his victim. However, I also welcome the uproar because it will force society (particularly the state) to a higher standard, which ultimately makes the system of capital punishment "safer" to the innocents.

What society needs to be is responsible for its actions. Period. What is lost in this whole blog is who is absolutely 100% innocent: The child!!! There is simply no justification whatsoever for the crime committed against the child. Noone knows what the lady may or may not have done. I am not one of those who feel she deserved any of her assault, but WE do not know what she may have done to contribute to it. Again, it goes to responsibility. She surely had to know, if they were seperated, that this guy was a little flaky, or domineering, or assanine, or whatever. Why put the child in harms way????? The dude should be clearly put away (I say shot), and not in some fooking rehab joint. My child's safety is above all other's period. It is my RESPONSIBILITY.

The mistake in our constitution is the "cruel and unuasual punishment" clause. In today's language, it should state unusually cruel punishment. Because punishment should be cruel, prisons should be terrible, not fooking hotel rooms. I like to think I am a good looking man. Because of this vain opinion, the main reason I do not commit crimes is because I do not want to become Bubba's bitch. If that were not the issue, I wouldnt mind being locked up to watch Oprah all day on my ass for the rest of my life. It is sad that THAT and my own moral compass prevents me from killing someone. There surely doesnt seem to be any other deterrent the way things are going.

It seems that there are those who do not like the death penalty and those that do. Most who do not like it are probably liberal and most who do like it it are conservative.

What is ironic is that the Democrats are usually associated with looking out for society's victims, while rebublicans are looking out for the big guy. When it comes to crime.....Completely the otherway around!

P.S. EVERYTHING the Government does is more expensive than it should be. If we commercialize death, it would be much cheaper. As a small business owner, I know I could do it for a lot less and get rich :gun:

F*uck the Looney Bin, Shoot the F*ucker in the face