Grr, Somalia again.

[Wagner]

Gee, I wonder if we are funding Somali Warlords to fight Al Queda queers in Mog?? Aren't these the same warlords that killed Delta and Ranger teams in October of 1993? Glad to see we have learned a lesson. So the 17 (106 wounded) rangers and Delta that died in Oct 3-8 1993 died for absolutely nothing and in fact the same country they were fighting for is now arming the groups that killed them.....wonderful. And they wonder why we question the government.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/africa...est/index.html

----------
MOGADISHU, Somalia (CNN) -- Renewed and intense fighting between Islamic fighters and an alliance of Somali warlords has broken out in the Somali capital of Mogadishu.

Journalist Mohamed Amiin said he saw one civilian lying in a pool of blood in the middle of the street and reports indicated the other two civilians also lay dead in the city streets Thursday.

Scores fled the fighting, which erupted on Wednesday and intensified Thursday morning as it spread across Mogadishu. The streets were full of terrified old people and children, witnesses told Reuters news agency.

A Mogadishu hospital said it was treating around 50 wounded civilians and fighters.

"People are being carried on wheelbarrows to the hospital with broken limbs and gunshot wounds. It's going from bad to worse," resident Abdifatah Abdikadir told Reuters by telephone from southern Mogadishu.

"The fighting is very heavy. They are hitting each other with mortars, anti-aircraft missiles and anti-tanks," coalition member Ibrahim Maalim told Reuters. "I have never seen such a heavy exchange. Mogadishu is blazing with fire," he added, as heavy artillery and gunshots reverberated over the telephone.

"There are bodies lying everywhere. I cannot count them and there are wounded people lying on the streets crying for help," Maalim told Reuters.
Alliance says militia tied to al Qaeda

The battles under way pit the Alliance for the Restoration of Peace and Counter-Terrorism against a union of Islamic fighters who support sharia -- Islamic law -- in the capital.

The alliance argues the Islamists are allied with al Qaeda; the Islamists accuse the United States of funneling cash to the warlords.

The United States says it supports Somalia's anti-terrorism efforts, but has decried the fighting in Mogadishu, which broke out earlier this month, killing more than 140 people -- most of them civilians, including many children.

Thursday's fighting began around 7 a.m. (midnight ET) and was concentrated in southern Mogadishu, where the Islamic fighters have taken control of the Sahafi Hotel -- previously controlled by the alliance.

Earlier this month, Somali President Abdullahi Yusuf Ahmed declared that any government ministers participating in the fighting would be removed from the government.

International concerns about the east African nation have been growing amid reports the al Qaeda terrorist network may have increased its presence in the chaotic state in recent years.

[Eric5273]

That is the American way. Spread lots of weapons around the world, arm groups that are fundamentalist in nature, support dictatorships and repression, etc.

Where do you think Al-Queda came from? Most of the terrorists we are fighting now originally trained in CIA terror training camps in Afghanistan and Pakistan in the mid-1980s. CIA went around the Middle East recruiting Islamic fundamentalists and trained them in terror tactics in order to fight against the "godless" communists, the Soviet Union.

The operation was a sucess and caused the Soviet Union to become unstable and eventually collapse.

[Wagner]

The cold war Soviet Union was in need of removal and the world was better for it. BTW, I have no problem arming groups to fight other groups, as I would rather people dealt with their own instead of relying on outside man power, however, in the case of Somalia I would rather just bomb the hell out of it and kill both sides then support warlords that killed our troops. But that is just me

---

Names of some of those that died in 1993

Master Sergeant Gary Gordon
Sergeant First class Randall Shughart

Army B Company, 3rd Battalion, 75th Ranger

* Sgt. James C. Joyce
* Sgt. Dominick Pilla
* Sgt. Lorenzo Ruiz
* Cpl. James Cavaco
* Cpl. James Smith
* Spc. Richard Kowalewski Jr.

[fln8tive]

Originally Posted by Eric5273

Most of the terrorists we are fighting now originally trained in CIA terror training camps in Afghanistan and Pakistan in the mid-1980s. CIA went around the Middle East recruiting Islamic fundamentalists and trained them in terror tactics in order to fight against the "godless" communists, the Soviet Union.

I remember when we once thought of the muhajadeen as those good 'ole freedom fighters, back when Rummy was swapping satellite imagery with his boy Saddam. My, how things change.

IMO, it's not that the USA sets out to create global ironies, it's more that our sheer size and global reach put us in a lot of traffic. Sometimes we hit the nail on the head, othertimes maybe not.

[Eric5273]

If you lock 10 people in a room with 10 guns, eventually someone is going to get shot.

A big reason there is so much violence in the world is that we distribute so many weapons around the world. There is something wrong when you constantly have to fight against armies using weapons that you yourself provided to them.

A better policy would be to just stop distributing weapons around the world. We should make sure to have a good military for our own defense. But stop arming the rest of the world, and stop opening up military bases all around the world. I'm so sick and tired of my tax money being used to bully foreign governments and protect the foreign investments of corporations. Let them pay for their own security, or let them play by the rules of those various countries.

[blondboinsd]

I find it hilarious that we gave weapons to osama bin laden, its just pathetic, we gave him the weapons he used against us and were feeling like victims why? Not saying 911 wasn't a horrible thing but we live in one disgustingly corrupt country

[Wagner]

Actually the prefered weapon of Islamic terrorists is the AK47 and RPG, both Russian made. The claymore style mines and shape charges they use now are courtesy of Iran.

AK47's are far more reliable then most US machinery, esspecially in those climates.

[fln8tive]

Originally Posted by WagnerX5

Actually the prefered weapon of Islamic terrorists is the AK47 and RPG, both Russian made. The claymore style mines and shape charges they use now are courtesy of Iran.

AK47's are far more reliable then most US machinery, esspecially in those climates.

Not to mention the South African, Austrian, Czech, and German arms. Oh, and the Chinese--

but, hey, let's blame America first.

[Wagner]

Bingo. Easier to blame the larger target telling someone you got arms from Kyrgyzstan doesn't have the same impact.

[Wagner]

Originally Posted by blondboinsd

I find it hilarious that we gave weapons to osama bin laden, its just pathetic, we gave him the weapons he used against us and were feeling like victims why? Not saying 911 wasn't a horrible thing but we live in one disgustingly corrupt country

I wouldn't say it is corrupt, everything for the most part was very legal (obviously not the Iran-Contra deals...side note: I still don't get why people look at Reagan as a golden boy) and in the best interest of the USA at the time, however, since every administration dictates its own foreign policy, after 4 years...things change. I think the USA would acheive greater control if it simply had a standardized foreign policy.