New House Wiring Suggestions - Page 3

LeMansX5 · #21 08-29-2005, 09:15 PM

This post is just in time. I think if anybody is installing copper for home, Cat 6 is the way to go, Cat 5e will not be able to support multimedia in the near term.
I was talking to a installer earlier today for future home. Below is what he proposed for almost 30k

for a 4-bed house:

Entertainment Solutions:
Whole home audio speakers and audio/video cabling
Whole home audio/video distribution
Home theater/media room
Family room, master bedroom, exercise room audio/video

Communications Solutions:
Structured cabling for voice, data and video
Internet routers and in-home computer networking
Satellite television
Doorbell and Intercom

Safety and Security Solutions:
Monitored security systems
Lighting control systems
Security cameras

Home Conveniences:
Central vac
Automated drapery and window coverings

His parts list:
-Elan system 12 although I think Crestron is probably better.

-Com Controller Rack Mount Elan
-Lutron controls for Lighting. Radio frequency lighting control package including an MFE keypad (wall mount) in the garage.
-GE interlogix for security
-Sonamp 1250MKII Multi-Channel Amplifier Rack Mount.
-VIA! Color In-Wall Touchpanel White, Each Elan
-4.0 Inch in-wall VIA! panel
-Color CCTVCamera W/Faceplate Brass Elan for front door
-Color CCTV Camera w/Pivoting Mounting Bracket
-A/V System set-up and interconnects
-Component and composite video cabling
-Symphony S623TR - for all beds, study, den
-Virtuoso 831D Speakers, Each Sonance -for family room
-Sivoia window pre-wire
-TL-441 CC4495 SCS Silver structured cabling

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ncx · #22 08-29-2005, 09:29 PM

Nice list. I like Crestron too.

haigha · #23 08-29-2005, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeMansX5

This post is just in time. I think if anybody is installing copper for home, Cat 6 is the way to go, Cat 5e will not be able to support multimedia in the near term.
I was talking to a installer earlier today for future home.

IIRC, Cat 5e four pair will support 10 Gbps. However, regular Cat 5 won't. I put Cat 5e in my house about six years ago. If I was installing now I would go with Cat 6 or Cat 7. There's no sense saving a few bucks by installing any variant of Cat 5 anymore. I pointed this out to Juan in an earlier thread.

Also, if the builder can set it up so that you can easily thread new cable through conduits, that will make "future proofing" less of an issue.

JCL · #24 08-29-2005, 10:02 PM

I couldn't possibly add anything on the data/video/etc cable discussion, it is all far more than I would think of or have expertise in. Lots of good ideas.

Now here is my story. My new home, built 3 years ago, just before I bought it) has 2 runs of cat5 in every room, coax in every room (and two points in the larger rooms), wired speakers (a la MD) in most rooms, 2 video monitors for the front door, etc. No automation. All done by the builder. Despite that, I found it easier to use wireless for data than terminating any of the cat5. Shows you how lazy I am. One access point in the den covers 4 rooms with 4 computers on 3 levels. Hard to argue with that, in a 6000 sq ft house.

But my suggestion is, pay attention to power as much as data. Lots of outlets, lots of locations. Don't forget switched and unswitched outlets in multiple zones outdoors as well. I found prewired boxes for all the outdoor lighting, which I didn't know I had. I found power outlets in places I never would have looked (ie cupboards with coax and cat5 terminations) and really appreciate it.

One more thought: ensure that everything is labelled. I see lots of installlations where the documentation is non-existent. It doesn't have to be. All points should have some type of identifying label, data and power.

I wouldn't call it future-proofing (more like risk management), but I think a little effort in those two areas can go a long way, on top of all the other higher-tech considerations others have covered.

kenner · #25 08-29-2005, 11:55 PM

Great info folks, I am shopping for a new home and now have some extra items for my check list.

One issue I did not see answered from the original post was whole house power protection.... generators and battery backups are fine, but living in the lightning capital of US (Tampa), or anywhere in the risky parts of the country, you need a little extra Zeus protection.

Certainly your developer will build to code, whatever that means. Usually a thin copper wire from your utility box to a water pipe or wimpy 6’ copper rod loosely buried next to the house. Don’t for a second believe that this will do a thing to protect your house and valuable electronic goodies from a pissed off storm front. Invest in a ZapCap or other aftermarket whole house protection for your utility box and maybe even a secondary protection device for major appliances (PolyPhaser, Lutron, Leviton, etc.). Have an electrician mount these as close to outside as possible and connect them to a good ground system (one or more 12’ copper ground rods connected with a beefy braid or wire built for grounding applications (you will not find this at Radio Shack). The best systems fan out the grounding system away from the house and do not rely on a single point.

For a few hundred bucks in time and materials, you will have that little extra margin of safety that could save you a whole lot of grief. ….but of course you can just rely on your home owners insurance and then you have an excuse to go shopping for new stuff.

Osbee · #26 08-30-2005, 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeMansX5

This post is just in time. I think if anybody is installing copper for home, Cat 6 is the way to go, Cat 5e will not be able to support multimedia in the near term.
I was talking to a installer earlier today for future home. Below is what he proposed for almost 30k

for a 4-bed house:

Entertainment Solutions:
Whole home audio speakers and audio/video cabling
Whole home audio/video distribution
Home theater/media room
Family room, master bedroom, exercise room audio/video

Communications Solutions:
Structured cabling for voice, data and video
Internet routers and in-home computer networking
Satellite television
Doorbell and Intercom

Safety and Security Solutions:
Monitored security systems
Lighting control systems
Security cameras

Home Conveniences:
Central vac
Automated drapery and window coverings

His parts list:
-Elan system 12 although I think Crestron is probably better.

-Com Controller Rack Mount Elan
-Lutron controls for Lighting. Radio frequency lighting control package including an MFE keypad (wall mount) in the garage.
-GE interlogix for security
-Sonamp 1250MKII Multi-Channel Amplifier Rack Mount.
-VIA! Color In-Wall Touchpanel White, Each Elan
-4.0 Inch in-wall VIA! panel
-Color CCTVCamera W/Faceplate Brass Elan for front door
-Color CCTV Camera w/Pivoting Mounting Bracket
-A/V System set-up and interconnects
-Component and composite video cabling
-Symphony S623TR - for all beds, study, den
-Virtuoso 831D Speakers, Each Sonance -for family room
-Sivoia window pre-wire
-TL-441 CC4495 SCS Silver structured cabling

Excellent price for $30k. If you can afford Crestron, I would suggest it, although it will be about 50% more than Elan. Elan sounds very nice, but it can be a little bit limited as to what it can do. If you are looking for bi-directional feed back from your iPod or MP3 server on in-wall touch panels, Crestron would be the best way to go. As for the speakers, we almost ALWAYS use Sonance, they have lifetime warranty and they seem to be one of the best sounding in-wall speakes on the market. We do a lot of Crestron systems. They are very flexable and very customizable.

Osbee · #27 08-30-2005, 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenner

Great info folks, I am shopping for a new home and now have some extra items for my check list.

One issue I did not see answered from the original post was whole house power protection.... generators and battery backups are fine, but living in the lightning capital of US (Tampa), or anywhere in the risky parts of the country, you need a little extra Zeus protection.

Certainly your developer will build to code, whatever that means. Usually a thin copper wire from your utility box to a water pipe or wimpy 6’ copper rod loosely buried next to the house. Don’t for a second believe that this will do a thing to protect your house and valuable electronic goodies from a pissed off storm front. Invest in a ZapCap or other aftermarket whole house protection for your utility box and maybe even a secondary protection device for major appliances (PolyPhaser, Lutron, Leviton, etc.). Have an electrician mount these as close to outside as possible and connect them to a good ground system (one or more 12’ copper ground rods connected with a beefy braid or wire built for grounding applications (you will not find this at Radio Shack). The best systems fan out the grounding system away from the house and do not rely on a single point.

For a few hundred bucks in time and materials, you will have that little extra margin of safety that could save you a whole lot of grief. ….but of course you can just rely on your home owners insurance and then you have an excuse to go shopping for new stuff.

We've been using the Panamax whole-house protection modules that are installed in the circuit breaker with pretty good success. Although, we've seen some surges creep in through the CATV line and the clamping voltage on most of these surge protectors aren't low enough to catch them and they fry catv boxes.... But, the good thing is, the CATV company replaces them for free. But yes, proper grounding is key. Be sure to ground your CATV and telephone lines aswell as your SAT dish.

LeMansX5 · #28 08-30-2005, 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osbee

Excellent price for $30k. If you can afford Crestron, I would suggest it, although it will be about 50% more than Elan. Elan sounds very nice, but it can be a little bit limited as to what it can do. If you are looking for bi-directional feed back from your iPod or MP3 server on in-wall touch panels, Crestron would be the best way to go. As for the speakers, we almost ALWAYS use Sonance, they have lifetime warranty and they seem to be one of the best sounding in-wall speakes on the market. We do a lot of Crestron systems. They are very flexable and very customizable.

Which Crestron system is equivalent to Elan system 12?

motordavid · #29 08-30-2005, 09:45 AM

After reading the posts of suggestions and punch lists, I feel like we are barely getting by in our 4 yr old, "slightly wired" hovel, lol!

The anti-lightning info was very interesting; we got zapped a year ago when a direct strike on our on-ground green transformer "box" was hit: it travelled into our house and blew surge protectors out of outlets, fried APC UPS units, etc. Our TV/audio-video survived, though we lost all of our phones and my old 'puter was zapped, but eventually fixed. We spent considerable time w/our electrician and a tech from our elec. utility guy and did some mods to what we thought were originally "good protection"; most of those rec'd by Kenner were intstituted...when we were done, the local utility tech said that was about all we could do, but he still felt that a huge ground strike could zap the house. I felt less than mollified, to say the least. This isn't Tampa, et al, but lightning up here on the ridge at 5K is no treat.

NEway, good lists of HighTech stuff...maybe in my next life, after I've come back rich instead of good looking, lol!
BR,md

Osbee · #30 08-31-2005, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeMansX5

Which Crestron system is equivalent to Elan system 12?

LemansX5,

If I were to "match" Elan's system 12, I would use the following:

Crestron CP2e Processor (3 serial, 8 IR, 8 veriports and Ethernet)
Crestron PAD-8A (8 Input X 8 Room Distribution Amplifer)
Crestron IVDS-24X24 (Composite Video Switcher if video to the panels is a must. SRP $2000
AudioControl Architect 960 (16 Channel (8 Pairs) X 60 Watts Bridgeable Ampliter)
Crestron TPS-2000L (In-wall 5" Touch Panel with 10 buttons)
Crestron DBF-12 (12 Button Keypads in rooms that don't need touch panels).
ReQuest Multimedia AudioReQuest Fusion 120 (120GB MP3/WAV/FLAC Audio server with 2-way communication and ethernet)
Sonance iPort IW-4 (RS-232 Controllable 2-Way In-wall iPod docking station)

Stick with Sonance speakers.

P.S. SRP is a very accurate price. We don't discount Crestron more than 15%, no one does.

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