Is the US dying?

[B-Line]

Sorry about the name calling... It was directly because of your post count/statement which lead me to believe in no uncertain terms, you were trolling.

Welcome to X5world. I think you'll find we are a nice group of people with values across the board. We don't all agree but we all do try to help one another.

So pull a chair up, pop a beer and enjoy Thanksgiving.

B

[NC_X5_Guy]

I don't think its about to die.....but stuff does change every single minute and we are faced with problems we have never seen or knew existed, but its not anything new, everything has to crash at some point.

[StanF18]

Originally Posted by sbriscoe

The responses, if any, on this topic will be interesting to say the least. Is the United States dying on the vine while we watch? Read the newspaper, watch the news (your pick of which news network), read the internet, news magazines, you name it. So much bad news, a guy in Florida commits suicide while on a webcam and many watch but few do anything of substance to prevent it. We dump millions into schools, and increase it yearly but education in the States is dismal at best compared to other developed nations. Freedom of speech is used more to spread trash and gossip rather than valid ideas. Christian speech is stifled in schools but other religions are hands off and protected. You cannot stop an Arab in an airport for fear of offending but you can search an old lady who wouldn’t know a gun if you showed it to her. If we are democrat we blame rising prices on the republicans and if we are republican we blame the democrats. Let’s blame the President even though the real power to control is in the Senate. A candidate for the Vice President is slammed for lack of experience but a Presidential candidate with no experience is hailed as the new Golden Child. We give money to corporations who have for years ripped of the consumer and when the consumer asks for help they are told no. We’ll protect the right to kill an unborn but put you in jail for mistreating an animal. If you are not of a liberal mind set then you have no right to speak your mind. We will spend billions on another country in trouble (Iraq-Afgan) but only if they have something to offer; other countries in need are ignored (African countries). I could go on and on; is it me or have we lost our way. Is it me or is this country slowly but surely going down the drain.

Your thoughts.

Short-sighted, "holier-than-thou" essay, riddled with both factual inaccuracies and Christian-right presumptions of "how life should be". I gather from your follow-up posts that you are a member of the "older" generation. So really what it boils down to, I'm sorry to say is that you, sir, are a bitter old man. Or you sure as hell sound like one. I pray that when I am your age I do not fall into the habit of criticizing everything about the post-modern era, while fondly recalling how great things used to run "back in my day".

Is the US dying? Ummm, no. I do not view a woman's right to choose (a right, by the way, which exists in every industrialized democracy in the world) as an example of the "US dying". Nor does the fact that someone killed themselves while they were online phase me for a minute. How is this any worse than the stuff that used to go down back "in your day"??

Was your generation really that much more civilized than today's? Do you want to tell me priests didn't suck little boys' weenies back in the 50s and 60s and 70s, just because it wasn't on the front page of your hometown newspaper? How about civil rights protesters in the 1960s getting beaten to a pulp by cops with billy clubs?? Or all the ugly race riots, whether in Watts, or in the other cities? Yeah, your generation was really sensitive to the plight of the less fortunate Here's a little news for ya: people have ALWAYS engaged in cruelty and barbarism, whether it was ancient Rome, the Holocaust, Pol Pot in Cambodia, or today's little genocides in Darfur and Sudan. In a historical context, I fail to see anything that much more troubling in today's world than the stuff that used to go down back in "the good old days". Times change, people don't. I'm sure some guy who was born back in 1910 could have put your same opinionated essay up in 1968, when Vietnam was raging, MLK and RFK were both assasinated, race riots were breaking out and the USSR had 10,000 nuclear warheads pointing to the US of A. He too, probably thought that the "US was dying". Guess what? We're still here.
No worse and no better. People will be people. All the same ugly crap went down during your generation. Maybe it just wasn't out in the open as much, or it wasn't part of the 24-hour news cycle that we have with today's internet and media, but all the same nasty ugly stuff that you are frowning upon has been an integral part of human society for the past 4,000 years. Just because you didn't read about child molestation in a 1950s or 60s newspaper doesn't mean it wasn't happening. It was just kept under wraps. And yet the "country didn't slip away from us" then, and I assure you us Gen-Xers and Gen-Yers won't let it slip away now either.

As for Freedom of Speech being "used to spread trash and gossip", instead of "valid" ideas: one person's "trash and gossip" is another person's "valid" idea. Who assigned you to keep track of which ideas are "valid"?? For someone who claims to have spent 27 years defending our right to free speech, you sure do sound pissed-off about that free speech with your "trash and gossip" label .

As for the little "Christian speech is stifled in school" drive-by comment, here's another news flash: The Supreme Court long ago established the separation of Church and State in this country. No one is stifling anyone. You want your kid to pray in school?? No problem: send them to Catholic school or to Yeshiva, which are geared towards religious education. But do it on your own buck. Public schools are funded by the States' coffers, which are, in turn, the taxpayer coffers. Which means religion is not part of the official public school agenda. And just because you have a problem with that, it doesn't qualify as the country "going down the drain" in my book.

[ylwjacket]

OK, I have to jump in.

First, his original post did not force any beliefs on anyone, other than expressing what I took to be disappointment with the way some things are going.

For some reason that I still don't understand, waaaayyyyy too many of you people look for any religious (actually, Christian) connotations in any post, and immediately wnat to start a verbal war over someone else's beliefs - and that is plain wrong, my friends.

He asked if you thought the country is off-track. He didn't force anything on you.

Now, on to the question - I am figuring that I must feel a bit like my dad felt in the late 60's. As a middle-aged, conservative, middle class guy, it is easy to feel persecuted these days.

However, I think that most of our national funk is predicated upon our current economic situation. This collective depression makes it really easy to find everything wrong with our country.

As for me, I still sing the words to the national anthem, and get a little teary when doing so. I still take my kids to Arlington when we go to Washington, so my kids understand that their lifestyle was bought at a steep price. We still go to church as much as possible, because we think it's an important part of our lives. I believe in God; however, if you don't, that is your business.

And, above all else, I wouldn't trade my life as an American for anything. Our non-American friends on here probably feel the same way, and I say more power to them - they should.

And last, around my house, family comes first - ALWAYS.

Last - YOU GUYS NEED TO LIGHTEN UP AND LAY OFF THE RELIGIOUS ATTACKS. IT IS GETTING AWFUL FRICKIN OLD ON THIS FORUM.

[Quicksilver]

Originally Posted by ylwjacket

OK, I have to jump in.

First, his original post did not force any beliefs on anyone, other than expressing what I took to be disappointment with the way some things are going.

For some reason that I still don't understand, waaaayyyyy too many of you people look for any religious (actually, Christian) connotations in any post, and immediately wnat to start a verbal war over someone else's beliefs - and that is plain wrong, my friends.

He asked if you thought the country is off-track. He didn't force anything on you.

Last - YOU GUYS NEED TO LIGHTEN UP AND LAY OFF THE RELIGIOUS ATTACKS. IT IS GETTING AWFUL FRICKIN OLD ON THIS FORUM.

Interesting that the day after Thanksgiving at least 3 people are killed while shopping. One trampled to death in Wallyworld 2 more having a shoot out at toy's are us.......... Hmmmmmm

For what it's worth this ole bird can tell you that for sure times have changed and the change is nothing to be proud of.

[blondboinsd]

I disagree, I think this country's constant evolving isn't necessarily bad.

I wouldn't want to go back to the 50's or 60's for all the money in the world. Yeah I'm sure it looked good but it wasn't and cherry and pie.

At some point In the past, I could be killed for being exactly how I was born, Black People's quality of life was zero and Jewish People we're persecuted and driven from their homes. We moved Chinese/Japanese Americans into internment camps. We have a lot of stuff we used to think was ok that finally now we realize is not.

This is one of the main reasons why the collective opinions of the people are often wrong. The collective will at one time thought it was ok to send Chinese/Japanese American's off to a camp, they thought it was ok to kill me for being gay and they think Black People and Women shouldn't have any rights. Lucky for us, the majority no longer think that way, but they DID. Shameful huh?

This is why I was SO opposed to Prop 8 in Ca, I don't have anyone I want to marry but I realize it's our duty as American citizens to always fight for Everyone to have an equal shot at equality. Saddly we saw what happened when the collective will of the people is focused on Hate and their minds are closed. This is why it will be overturned, because it's wrong.

I don't condone persecutions of Churches, I think everyone is entitled to believe as they wish UNTIL they come and tell me I don't deserve to be equal, then I stand up and fight.

So I understand this whole "American is dying" mentality, but it's wrong, we are better off now because of the protections so many of previous decades fought for. Yes we are in a crisis, yes it's doom and gloom, but we are going to get through it and we will be ok.

[Quicksilver]

Mr. blondboinsd

Your welcome to disagree. You have that right and please don't take offense but i said nothing about this country in my reply to "ylwjacket". Therefore you have no reference point to make the assumptions you make especially within the context of my comment.

Honestly my friend "blondboinsd" you don't have a clue regarding the quality of life of Black people during the 50's or 60's and I never said or eluded to ""American is dying" or any of the rhetoric you espouse.

I believe if you were to read my post carefully I quoted "ylwjacket" and his comments. So i would thank you for not putting words in my mouth.

Originally Posted by blondboinsd

I disagree, I think this country's constant evolving isn't necessarily bad.

I wouldn't want to go back to the 50's or 60's for all the money in the world. Yeah I'm sure it looked good but it wasn't and cherry and pie.

At some point In the past, I could be killed for being exactly how I was born, Black People's quality of life was zero and Jewish People we're persecuted and driven from their homes. We moved Chinese/Japanese Americans into internment camps. We have a lot of stuff we used to think was ok that finally now we realize is not.

This is one of the main reasons why the collective opinions of the people are often wrong. The collective will at one time thought it was ok to send Chinese/Japanese American's off to a camp, they thought it was ok to kill me for being gay and they think Black People and Women shouldn't have any rights. Lucky for us, the majority no longer think that way, but they DID. Shameful huh?

This is why I was SO opposed to Prop 8 in Ca, I don't have anyone I want to marry but I realize it's our duty as American citizens to always fight for Everyone to have an equal shot at equality. Saddly we saw what happened when the collective will of the people is focused on Hate and their minds are closed. This is why it will be overturned, because it's wrong.

I don't condone persecutions of Churches, I think everyone is entitled to believe as they wish UNTIL they come and tell me I don't deserve to be equal, then I stand up and fight.

So I understand this whole "American is dying" mentality, but it's wrong, we are better off now because of the protections so many of previous decades fought for. Yes we are in a crisis, yes it's doom and gloom, but we are going to get through it and we will be ok.

[blondboinsd]

Originally Posted by Quicksilver

Mr. blondboinsd

Your welcome to disagree. You have that right and please don't take offense but i said nothing about this country in my reply to "ylwjacket". Therefore you have no reference point to make the assumptions you make especially within the context of my comment.

Honestly my friend "blondboinsd" you don't have a clue regarding the quality of life of Black people during the 50's or 60's and I never said or eluded to ""American is dying" or any of the rhetoric you espouse.

I believe if you were to read my post carefully I quoted "ylwjacket" and his comments. So i would thank you for not putting words in my mouth.

The Comments above were not meant to be directed at your post, I removed your quote as it was misdirected, it was directed at you saying that the "change" isn't good, I was disagreeing. Just as you say I don't know about African American's in the 50's and 60's, you have no idea what I deal with, yet in prior posts have acted like you do. So I will agree to disagree on this. This will not be discussed any further.