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AFAIK thicker oils also provide higher oil pressure... that's why thick oil additives like Lucas claim to "fix" oil pressure issues. Again, I'm only going off my experiences with 15ish vehicles. YMMV. I've never had a problem with my NA or FI engines using the thicker oil here in south Texas. But we never reach sub 0 degree temps either. :D |
Worth separating the discussion into the two phases of the engine's operation.
During start up, you want a thin oil so as to circulate faster. That is why the 5 spec, or 0 in a colder climate. This doesn't impact fuel economy, because it just matters until the oil warms. Once the oil warms it behaves like a 30, 40, or 50, as the case may be. This is where BMW recommends a 30, for fuel efficiency. A 40 makes sense in a hotter climate, and is also a recommended viscosity by BMW. Those vehicles that spec a 20w-50 are designed with appropriate cold clearances for that oil spec. |
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In the good ol' days deviating from factory specs was more beneficial and common practice among gearheads as oil and engine specs were less precise I think engine and oil specs today are such that it is a feels right/good choice like shorter change intervals --but maybe not. Since the BMW specs are 10-30 or 40 I guess that means they haven't found heavier weight oil affects durability--but maybe not. |
I stay with a 5w because it has a specified pour point lower than -40. It covers all ambients I drive in.
If you are seeing less than -40 as a cold start ambient, without engine pre heat, then 0w would be a good idea. BMW specs are 5w-30 or 5w-40, not 10w. Might be a typo. The other consideration is that it is good practice to use the narrowest range that covers the temperature extremes you expect. a 5w-30 is inherently better than a 5w-40, as long as the 30 covers your hot ambient condition. That is because more viscosity improvers are used in the formulation to extend the range, and fewer are better. That wide range isn't a free benefit, it comes with a cost to oil quality. |
Actually BMW does specify a "0"w oil, the Mobil 1 Euro. I don't run it for the low temp rating, I began running it because, Quote.....
"'The question of phosphorus and zinc. Phosphorus (a component of ZDDP - Zinc Dialkyl-Dithio-Phosphate) is the key component for valve train protection in an engine and 1600ppm (parts per million) used to be the standard for phosphorus in engine oil. In 1996 the EPA forced that to be dropped to 800ppm and then more recently (2004?) to 400ppm - a quarter of the original spec. Valvetrains and their components are not especially cheap to replace and this drop in phosphorus content has been a problem for many engines (especially those with flat-tappet type cams). So why was the level dropped? Money. Next to lead, it's the second most destructive substance to shove through a catalytic converter. The US government mandated a 150,000 mile liftime on catalytic converters and the quickest way to do that was to drop phosphorous levels and bugger the valvetrain problem. Literally. In the US, Mobil 1 originally came out with the 0W40 as a 'European Formula' as it was always above 1000 ppm. This initially got them out of the 1996 800ppm jam and knowledgeable consumers sought it out for obvious reasons. Their 15W50 has also maintained a very high level of phosphorus and all of the extended life Mobil synthetics now have at least 1000ppm. How do they get away with this? They're not classified as energy/fuel conserving oils and thus do not interfere with the precious government CAFE (corporate average fuel economy) ratings. (See my section on the EPA and fuel economy in the Fuel and Engine Bible for more info on this). This also means that they don't get the coveted ratings of other oils but they do protect your valvetrain." From here......Car Bibles : The Engine Oil Bible I run it for the added ZDDP. In the pic of my valvetrain (prior post), the production grind lines are still visible on the cam lobes. |
JCL-My mistake on the 10w. I know better.
TiAgX4-My reference to BMW specs are per the owner's manual. |
Yeah, the "0w" oil is not in the BMW manual, it's on the list of BMW approved oils on line, and on the FULL list available at dealers.
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As an alternative to the Mobil1 0W 40 oil I generally use, I will now consider using Penrite Enviro+ 5W 40 as it meets BMW (and other manufacturer's specs), has a 'high' zinc content, and seems to be more suited to our warmer climate here in Australia. I have several vehicles, including a couple of diesels (one with a particulate cleaner) and I've been looking for one engine oil that I can use on all motors (including the N62). This one seems to fit the bill, although has had the zinc content reduced slightly to accommodate the diesel particulate filter:
Base Oil:
ENVIRO+ 5W-40 is a premium full synthetic, SAE 5W-40 Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM), Fully Licensed and Warranty Approved engine oil. It is fully licensed and approved for warranty service for particular GM / Holden (dexos 2TM ), VW, Audi, Skoda, Seat, BMW, Mercedes Benz & Porsche vehicles. It uses the latest advances in mid SAPS (Sulphated Ash, Phosphorus and Sulphur)* additive technology. Can be used where the following SAE viscosities are recommended:
Application: ENVIRO+ 5W-40 is designed for use in modern 4, 6 & 8+ cylinder multi-cam, multi-valve (including VVT), naturally aspirated, supercharged & turbocharged engines. It is suitable for use in direct injection petrol and light duty diesel engines including those fitted with/without DPFs (Diesel Particulate Filters). ENVIRO+ 5W-40 exceeds API SN and ACEA C3 and may be used where SAE 0W-40, 5W-30 & 10W-30 oils are specified in the owners handbook. May also be used where the fuel economy specifications ACEA A1/B1, A5/B5 and ILSAC GF-5 are specified and in vehicles requiring ACEA A3/B4 made before the 2010 model year, and where ACEA C2 or C3 is specified ENVIRO+ 5W-40 is suitable for use in passenger cars, 4WDs & light commercial vehicles. ENVIRO+ 5W-40 is not recommended for use in motorcycles. ENVIRO+ 5W-40 can be used with Petrol, LPG, E10, diesel (With & Without DPFs) & other conventional fuels. ENVIRO+ 5W-40 features the Penrite EXTRA TEN in the oil's SAE rating. The EXTRA TEN helps protect your engine by using an oil that has a higher viscosity at operating temperature than what is normally specified, thus providing better protection and reducing engine wear in all driving conditions. Important Maintenance Information For vehicles fitted with a Diesel Particulate filter we recommend the use of Penrite ENVIRO+DPF CLEANER to clean & prevent DPF blockages, maximise catalyst life and improve engine efficiency, power & fuel economy. Product Benefits:
Density at 15°C, kg/L 0.850 Viscosity, Kinematic, cSt at 40°C at 100°C 81 13.4 Viscosity Index 168 Cold Cranking Viscosity, cP at -30°C 5620 Zinc, Mass % 0.089 Phosphorus, Mass % 0.080 Sulphated Ash, Mass % 0.80 |
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You could use it, and it would certainly be fine for your diesel models, but BMW issued a TSB saying not to use it on gasoline fueled BMWs except in certain limited markets. Australia is not on the list. It is approved in the EU plus certain European countries. The reason is that the LL04 oil spec was found to not stand up due to gasoline fuel compatibility issues. It breaks down early. Some still choose to use it because it says BMW on the bottle and they think it must be fine, but they should be doing shorter oil change intervals if that is their choice. And I don't understand why people would knowingly choose an oil that has been shown to break down early. There are so many oils that stand up much better. I have the version included in the workshop manuals, from 2004. IIRC, it wasn't much of a problem then. The issues in North American with oil breakdown started around 2008-2009, and that is when BMWNA issued a TSB as a reminder not to use an LL04 oil, except in a diesel. The bulletin reads as follows: 11 03 04 (156) weltweit all countries Datum/Date: 12/2004 Update: 09/2005 BMW Quality Longlife-04 All Situation: The launch of the E90 and E87 with diesel particulate filter, makes a new engine oil BMW Longlife-04 absolutely essential. The function of the diesel particulate filter and low fuel consumption can only be guaranteed for the vehicle's entire service life if BMW Longlife-04 engine oil is used. Effect: A new type of additive in the engine oil means that less ash is formed during combustion and thus prevents the diesel particulate filter from becoming blocked with ash deposits. Affected vehicles: This engine oil is unambiguously specified for diesel engines with diesel particulate filter. However, it also satisfies the requirements of spark-ignition engines. Longlife-04 engine oil specifications include the requirements of Longlife-01 and Longlife-98. Longlife-04 oils are only approved for spark-ignition engines in Europe (EU plus Switzerland, Norway and Liechtenstein). They must not be used outside this area. Procedure: For further information, please refer to BMW Operating Fluids Service Information bulletin "Specified engine oils for BMW Group engines" (Enclosure 3) Jeff |
Thanks for the info JCL. I think I'll have to continue to purchase different oils, dependent on the application. I'll stick with Mobil1 either 5W40 or 0W40 for the N62 (and my hemi 6.1) and purchase the Penrite Enviro+ 5W40 for my diesels (that get a similar 10,000 service interval).
Strange that BMW apply different specifications for some countries/ regions (Europe only for the Long Life 04). I would have thought that environmental conditions would have been the only factor, on the assumption fuel quality is not an issue (operating temps, elevation, humidity perhaps)? |
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