M54 no start problem, ideas?
 

I think this is fuel system related, but I have exhausted my diagnostic skills. Backstory below, but I have run codes on my Foxwell and nothing comes up, fuel pump produces a generous flow when cranking (checked at top of tank), there is fuel present at the fuel rail schrader valve after cranking, battery is topped up, starter motor sounds fine, but I crank with no ignition. However, the issue started as a loss of power situation.

BACKSTORY: a little while back i stupidly ran my tank very low on fuel. I made it to the station and put fresh fuel in without problem. About 3 miles later, nearly home, going up a small hill there was hesitation, but I made it into my driveway. I ran codes and didn't see anything. The next day the car ran but clearly was losing power so I parked it and figured maybe I had stirred up gunk in the bottom of the tank and should change the fuel filter. I did that (getting the underbody protection on and off without a lift was a bitch, but the filter itself seemed pretty easy). Quick release fittings came right off and snapped back on, I started the car and ran it for several minutes and saw no leaks so I shut it off and closed the bottom back up. Dropped the car, started it and moved it 30 feet. Then a couple hours later I went to drive it to the store and after it started the revs immediately dropped and it stalled out. It did that a couple times and then refused to start. Ran codes again, still nothing.

This is my 2005 3.0i automatic which currently has 101K miles on it, fuel filter I took out was original, but the car was running great for the 6K miles I've owned it.

Any help greatly appreciated as always.

Have you tried unplugging MAF sensor to see if it will run?

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Thanks for the idea, definitely worth trying, but I just did it and no difference, cranks but doesn't start. I was hoping that was it, this not knowing where to look drives me crazy.

By "loss of power situation" what do you mean exactly? Did the battery get drained to the point where it wouldn't turn the starter? If so, check to see if the immobilizer lost synchronization with the EWS. It would provide the symptoms you have.

There was no problem with the battery. It sat some and got cranked a bunch while working on it so i threw a trickle charger on and topped it up so i know it is full voltage, but it was never really down, it always cranked fine.

By "loss of power" I mean the engine was hesitating like it wasn't consistently getting fuel and the car didn't have it's normal performance power. That came first, then it was stalling out after starting, now it won't start.

Did you take the spark plugs out,to see if their soaked in fuel,maybe flooded .

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No, I haven't looked at the spark plugs (I was stuck on it not getting fuel). Not sure I'll have time tomorrow but I'll try. It has sat for some longish periods between attempts at starting it, would that make any difference? I have some new spark plugs I've been planning on installing. Any reason not to put them in if I have the old ones out?

You need to check the fuel pressure at the rail, generous flow means nothing.

I would throw the new plugs in anyway. Easy job. Sitting for a long period of time,the fuel should evaporate. It still sounds like either its flooding real bad or not getting fuel to start.

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Spark, fuel, air...

I would confirm you have spark. Pull a coil and a spark plug, put them together and see if you get spark when cranking.

Borrow or buy (harbor freight) a fuel pressure tester...you need 50 psi or so at the rail when you prime/crank...Good tool to have..

Crank no spark/ignition usually means either loss of ews or a crank position sensor.

The previous loss of power sounds more like low fuel pressure or bad can position sensor.

(Very often no codes)

You need to test actual fuel pressure. Also; I recently fixed a car that crank no start because the fuel filter was installed with the output/return lines crossed sending no fuel to the engine (that error will show up as no pressure: I think you checked at the rail just not sure if you checked after swapping filter).

It's typical for the fuel pump to side fail. The symptom feels like a problem with the FPR.

One more thing; if fuel is near 1/4 tank is very likely that your siphon jet is leaking and you aren't getting fuel. If close to 1/3-1/4 tank add some gas just to eliminate that possibility.

Thanks for the suggestions. I couldn't get to this yesterday because of work. Today I pulled the forward most spark plug out, no sign of oil or fuel on it (put it back and cranked and pulled it out again and still no sign).

I checked for fuel at the rail after I put the new filter in (didn't think to check before). It's there, but i don't know if it's enough. I can borrow a fuel pressure gauge at O'Reilly's, guess I need some way to jump the pump relay to use it because I don't have a helper. Also a problem for testing spark, maybe this weekend.

FWIW the fuel tank is currently 3/4 full so i don't think it could be a siphon issue. I could pull the pump out and check for a crack in the tube that goes to the top of the tank, but it really seems to gush out when I crank with a hose stuck in a bottle.

I guess I could throw a new fuel pump relay in if you think that might be the problem? But like I say, when I crank it gushes so I think the problem must be downstream from there. But maybe that's wrong.

You need to use a fuel pressure gauge. 50.0 psi not "gushing out". It needs to be stable.

My wife's previous car had very similar symptoms and the fuel pressure was 49-50 but would jump around so fast the needle looked translucent.

New FPR fixed hers.

Thanks. I will try to get the pressure gauge and a system for jumping the relay tomorrow. Bentleys says the jumper must be 14 gauge and have a 15 amp fuse. Is that correct (a wire would be a lot easier, but I will be going to O'Reilly's)?

I still think it's more likely the fuel system than the ignition, but I have been known to be wrong (ask my ex). Seems like I should check the actual pressure at the fuel rail and report back.

You def.need to meausure actual fuel pressure.tge crazy thing is wife's car sounded like no spark when yr he problem was weird fuel.

Static pressure was 50 but once I eventually did get it started it would jump from 48-50 or something like that. Was suggesting FPR problem and when I did post mortem on the FPR found the 8mm o-ring that was leaking and the actual problem. Could have just changed 40¢ o-ring vs $65 fuel filter. Live and learn.

Trying to test the fuel pressure but I'm not sure I'm doing it right. I have jumped the relay and can hear the pump running (although it sounds a bit inconsistent). There is definitely fuel at the Schrader valve, if I press it with a small screwdriver it comes out, but the pressure gauge I borrowed from O'Reilly's is not showing anything, ie the needle doesn't budge. I am using the "Ford Schrader Adapter" from the kit (the only thing that comes close to fitting), it threads on fine and I can press it in at the top and get fuel, but I am wondering if it is not seated all the way and maybe I need a different adapter? Is there any secret to this?

I did put new spark plugs in, because I had them. I have not tested for spark because I have not had anyone to crank for me. Is there any way around that?

If you get fuel flowing when you press the release valve then the gauge is probably hooked up ok.

Good point. I tried the release valve and got nothing, but I'm not sure I had the relay jumped when I did it and I'm not sure how much residual pressure there is. I will confirm in the morning.

The gauge adapter has to press the shrader valve button to register pressure.

If you hear the fuel pump and get a "splurt" of fuel at the rail you have the parts you need to test just need to get the gauge connected.


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With the pump running I get an occasional drip of fuel out of the relief valve on the pressure gauge, but it still doesn't register anything. I am wondering if the schrader adapter is fully engaging. I do get a splurt of fuel if I take the gauge off and press in the adapter top with a screwdriver.

The pump sounds a bit rough to me, but I do hear it constantly running. I asked O'Reilly about a different adapter and all they could say was that kit "works on all vehicles".

Clearly it doesn't... :rolleyes:

Sounds like the valve connection isn't opening the valve (depressing the centre pin).

That's my thought. I'm thinking of going to harbor Freight tomorrow (30 miles) to see if they have a different fitting or a kit with a different fitting, but I don't know what I am looking for

It just occurred to me (I guess I'm not very swift with this stuff) that I can confirm this is the issue by trying the pressure gauge on my other X5 that runs. I'll do that first, but if anybody knows what fitting I'm looking for please let me know.

If you have an old school tire pressure gauge you can check the pressure but the gas will wreck the internal seals so think of it as a disposable fuel pressure gauge.

The HF kit is the one I have but test it at the store parking lot I had to exchange my first one that leaked.


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I finally got a fuel pressure gauge that, sort of, fits*. With the fuel pump relay jumped it is showing a steady 48.5 psi at the fuel rail. For comparison, with the motor running on my older X5 it was showing 49.75 psi, pretty close to the 50 psi Andrewwynn suggested. But the engine still does not fire.

What should I look at next?

*I went to two different Harbor Freights, first one didn't have what they said they had, second one guy told me the only way to use their kits was to take the Schrader valve out (which I really didn't want to do), so I ordered an OTC 5630 which was advertised as "for Volvo and BMW" from Amazon. i'm living up in the mountains at the moment and it took a while to get here. It only has one fitting, which screws on, but even using plumbers tape and snugging it with a pair of pump pliers it leaks a bit of fuel on both cars.

FWIW my fuel filter and pressure regulator are new, put on just after this problem cropped up.

If this all started after you filled your tank maybe you should be questioning what you filled it with?

I'm pretty sure of what I filled it with, I've had my hand in the gas tank a few times now and this seems to be gas to me. I know what diesel smells and feels like, they do sell it where I bought this, but this isn't diesel and it's a gas station I use regularly. As I said at the beginning, my first thought was that I stirred up muck when I put the new gas in the tank, it is a 16 year old car, and the fuel filter I took off looked original. But maybe the gas fill up before the problem was just coincidental. I can believe in one coincidence but not two in a row.

Error code? This feels like EWS sync problem.

Pull a plug/coil and with helper see if you are getting spark (best with spare plug so you aren't venting fuel out the plug hole).

When wife's FPR failed I eventually got it to start with about 100 seconds of cranking in 8 second bursts. Initial attempts no sign of life at all just like no spark or no fuel.

No error codes. I've scanned multiple times, but can check again tomorrow. I will also try a 100 second cranking regimen. I haven't done that. I'll need to get a friend up here to check the spark, not sure when I can make that happen...but I'd like this resolved.

How many keys do you have? It wouldn’t hurt to initialize them. First, lock and unlock it with a key manually. Try a start afterwards. If it goes low on power, mine will crank but not start. After a manual lock and unlock, it starts up.

Update - code now
 

After unsuccessfully trying the 100 second cranking protocol I ran codes again and this time I got code D1 (DME: Anti tampering protection EWS), which fits with adrewwynn's thoughts. I was fortunate to find this earlier thread on that code:

https://xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-forums/...-no-start.html

But like others, my Foxwell NT510 Elite had trouble communicating, sometimes it wouldn't find the module, other times it would get halfway in and stop. I input the model manually to no avail and finally decided to try updating the Foxwell. That update has been running for hours but it says not to disturb it. In the meantime I saw this thread:

https://xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-forums/...ml#post1177584

Here Redraptor141 explains that because of different build dates for the modules I may need to try inputting different build dates for my car. I will try that as soon as the Foxwell update is complete (if ever).

I also found andrewwynn's explanation of how to test for spark solo ("To verify spark solo put paper between the electrode and ground it will burn a hole"). if the ECS reprogramming fails I will try that tomorrow.

And, belatedly, I have seen X5chemist's pots:
I have 2 diamond head keys. I have tried them both and just tried the manual lock/unlock, but no joy. I can try reinitializing them tomorrow.

Oddly I feel closer to a solution than I have in a week. Thanks to everyone for their help.

Tried to perform the EWS adjustment by inputting a variety of build dates on either side of the real one (May, 2005). The Foxwell consistently got me as far as the screen that says "establish switch on terminal 15 (I think that's position 1 but i tried position 2 as well), turn off engine then press continue". After that it always gives me a "No Communication" message.

Did a spark test with a piece of paper and no sign of any spark. That would make sense if I have an EWS problem, but that may not be my only problem.

The Foxwell recognizes both my keys, but I reinitialized one just in case and still no start.

Did I say I was feeling optimistic? Ha.

I have the cable for BMW Scanner 1.4 but have never used it (I'm a Mac guy). Is that what I should try next?

I've been keeping my battery on a charger so that shouldn't be an issue. It was never flat, but I did have an incident when I was working on the fuel filter where I had accidently locked the car before jacking the front and it set off the alarm. Could that be the source of this?

Check your obd port for issues. Others have had dirty/bent pins or even a broken socket cause your can't connect to module situation.

Usually extended battery disconnect is the cause of EWS sync problems but likely many ways.

Somebody very recently posted he was able to resync EWS with no tools just the key. I'll look for the thread

Okay, thanks. I'll see what I can determine. It just seems odd that it sees the error and gets me as far as it does if it's not actually connecting.

Maybe because the error stored in DME

I see. I will make a close physical inspection, not sure how else to check the OBD port, I have tried three scanners recently (Foxwell, BluDriver and Creator - only the Foxwell can fix the EWS) and none reported any problems scanning, but this is beyond my brain.

Thanks for your help.

following along
 

I'm following this thread with some interest. Specifically re: anything concerning the M54, fuel pressure testing, Foxwell scan tools, and EWS problems.

At the current time, my M54 starts fine, never misses a beat, and so far my self-repaired (single) diamond key always works. And my Foxwell NT510E scanner works fine, if a bit slow. Since you mentioned Foxwell updates in post #30 I updated mine today. It only took <10 minutes. First update I did a while back took longer, though.

I wish someone could tell me the specific thread of the adapter for the fuel pressure Schrader valve on pre-facelift M54's. I've seen recommendations for the OTC 5630 kit, but I also read that the fitting doesn't work (on other forums), and ECS Tuning offers only one adapter, and it says it doesn't fit my 2001 M54.

My kit from harbor freight worked.

Hi Workingonit:

I'm not an expert, but from recent experience I can tell you that I've looked all over the internet for a spec on the Schrader valve and never found one. Some people say they're all the same (any bicycle valve is the same), others say they're all different, but I have found no specs. I can say that what was labeled as a "Ford Schrader Valve Adapter" on the O'Reilly's kit did not work. On my '05 it clearly didn't depress the valve enough to register, on my '01 it did register but spewed fuel like Niagra Falls (shout out to my Canadian friends).

The 5630 kit reads pressure on both cars. But it still leaks fuel. I put plumber's tape on and tightened every bit as far as I thought was safe. If you don't mind breaking your Schrader valve off you could tighten farther, but I wasn't willing to take that risk. I think the numbers the 5630 produced were probably close to accurate.

There are a zillion kits on Amazon that seem to be capable of this sloppy fit. I mostly bought the 5630 because Amazon said it was for Volvo and BMW and somewhere on Xoutpost someone said it was great. I don't think it's great, but it works better than the stuff from O'Reilly that they claim is worth $150.

Hope this helps.

SBBimmer,
A procedure is available on how to test the EWS. I found it while looking for a replacement EWS. PM me your emails address. I’ll mail a file. I’ll look for the original link and post it too.

No disrespect intended - seriously, I have nothing but respect for Andrewwynn, and I am sure HF has different things at different times, but after visiting two different HFs the only kit I found that had a Schrader adapter was the $300 "Master Kit", and if I'm going to spend $300 for a fuel pressure gauge it probably won't be from HF. On top of that, while the first location had no one who knew what a fuel pressure gauge was, the guy at the second location made clear to me that he believed the only way to solve my problem was to go to a bicycle shop and get a valve removal tool.

I saw a bunch of kits on HF's website, from $14.95 to the $299.00 one. I even read the PDF users manuals for them, but other than, maybe, the "Master" kit I couldn't identify any that seemed to have the right adapter - they might be there, if HF is close go look! Amazon has a lot of kits that say they have Schrader adapters. Do they fit? I don't know. That's why I spent extra money for the 5630 which said it did. But it didn't, really.

The OTC gauge itself seems pretty high quality, it has a pressure relief valve (good) and a very long hose for the extra gas. I HATE that it was packed in a blister pack and there were zero extra adapters (crazy for the price). I am NOT an Amazon fan. If you can find better at HF God bless, I just got frustrated after driving 30 miles in two different directions only to be disappointed. Just my POV. In my case the OTC worked (imperfectly) on both an '01 and an '05. Price is a bit crazy for imperfect, but I wanted answers so I paid it,

Who knows for sure that BMW might've used differently threaded valve on the same production run; as they used up valves made by one supplier, the next batch they used may have been from a second supplier, of a slightly different spec. My 2001 may have a different valve than an earlier 2001, and so forth.

I think I'll get a set from Amazon with several adapters to try (one of the $50 sets). I'll bet they're all made in the same Chinese factory as the OTC & Harbor Freight test kits.

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EWS3.3 wire testing.
Grab your voltmeter and check each EWS wire. Is fuse 11 okay? Check for voltage drop across it. It's where my X5 is having amp draws of 500 mA! Yet, the module tests okay and responds to scanning. Two items may have faults: starter or transmission shift inputs. Knowing when it should and shouldn't have power is great information.

So is the EWS synchronized or not? Since that would cause all of your symptoms exactly, it seems like it would be worth getting it re-synchronized should be done before you spend money on tools to check fuel pressure, right?

Yeah the kit I bought from HF was defective and I had to exchange. 2nd copy worked though. $25-30

I believe EWS sync problem had been confirmed. Current problem is getting scanner connected to module to reset it.


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That is what I believe. That may not be the only problem but it seems like it needs to be cured next. I'll update if I make progress.

Thanks, I'll do this ASAP.

Search xo for a recent thread about the topic. Somebody got his EWS to sync with just a key sequence


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I've been looking, but I haven't found that thread yet. I have learned a lot! I had no idea how common the EWS sync issue is. Note to self: never let the battery run down or leave the key in the ignition. If anyone wants an overview of EWS there's a pretty good one here:

http://www.unofficialbmw.com/images/BMW_EWS.pdf
(We use version 3.3)

It was a busy weekend (but I have tomorrow!). I inspected and cleaned the contacts on my OBD II port but that didn't make any difference. I did finally realize that I could find the manufacture date of my EWS ECU with the diagnostic function on the Foxwell. My EWS was built year '05, CW16 (which I am guessing means Calendar Week). That would put the build in April of '05 which makes sense since my car was built in May. That means I am pretty sure that inputting a March '05 build date (next option is September) should be right. I had been trying all sorts of permutations so it's nice to confirm that.

I may try to see if I can get BMW scanner going or maybe a proper update of the Foxwell (the last attempt failed).

It's official, I'm an idiot.
 

What I needed to do was update the Foxwell. Once I did that it worked like a charm. The car started right up and seems to be running fine - I'm not sure what my earlier stalling problem was, but I just went for a test drive and had no hesitation. Cleared the D1 code and nothing came back.

The new software has a slightly different procedure for syncing the EWS than before: 1) Under "Main Groups" choose "Special Functions" 2) then choose "Immo & Keys" then 3) "Adjustment. engine control - EWS" and from there follow the instructions. It now tells you to turn the key all the way off and wait for 25 seconds - and gives you a countdown until you are good to go.

If you own a Foxwell NT510 Elite and haven't updated it, here is how:

First, ignore the online instructions that tell you the NT510 should be updated by registering at the old Foxwell website Foxwelltech.com. That is wrong and sent me on a wild goose chase. You MUST update the Elite by first registering at Foxwelltech.us.

Next you need to download Foxwell's updating App "FoxAssist", NOT "FoxScanner" which is the old App. You're supposed to be able to download FoxAssist from your "Registered Products" page, but that link was broken for me. I ultimately found it at: https://www.foxwelltech.us/support-tools.html

FoxAssist works on Windows 7, 8 and 10 only. Install, open it and log in with your Foxwell credentials.

Remove the micro SD card from your scanner (I thought it could be updated in the scanner via USB cable but apparently not). Use a card reader to connect it to your computer.

Your scanner should now show up on the "Download" tab of FoxAssist. Click "Update" and wait. When it says it's done you can put the card back in your Scanner and it will start up with the new software (the software lives on the microUSB card, your scanner is nothing without it.).

Slow speed stalling, eg: pull into intersection when light turns green butt pause to turn left and it stalls; almost always cam position sensor

Wow, awesome! Sure wish I would have known how to update my foxwell when I had my EWS get un-synchronized a couple years ago! I beat my head against it for a couple of weeks before I had it towed to a local indy and had them do it.

I beat my head against the wall too! But I'm happy now. There's nothing like an E53 when it's running right.

Thanks. My stalling was after I changed the fuel filter, the revs would drop and the engine would stall out at an idle (I never got to drive it more than 30'). Right now it seems to be running fine. Fingers crossed.

Thanks for all the help!