X5 off-road prowess (?)
 

After watching Jeremy claw a Porsche Cayenne up a steep muddy hill on Top Gear two weeks ago, it made me wonder if the X could've done it.
(I know it doesn't have a locking diff, or any of that fancy hard-core off-roading stuff, but I imagine the X-drive can probably hold it own... )

Anyone have any first hand experience on how good the X5 is off-road?

Yeah, it's too low :)
Other than that, once you drop tire pressure pretty low, and just have a few guys watch out for you, the X5 goes through almost anything.

The only reason I go with my friends in their trucks rather than my own, is because the X5 is just too low, but then again, they can't take those turns onroad @ 90mph+ :)

Could you post the link with the cayenne off-road performance?
Thanks
Any vids about the x in off road?

the X5 would actually suck off road. It could do some mild stuff, but would get blown away by a jeep grand cherokee and may other true SUV's.

kil himmmmmmmmm........... :flame: :gun:
hahaha

i drive my x5 on lake minnetonka frequently and granted im running nitto 404s 255/55/18's(winter setup) the x5 is just not for offroad use. The older four wheel drive system is "ok" but i have gotten stuck a couplw times and had to be pulled out by my friends polaris ranger(6x6) Snow tires would make a night and day difference, but its just that when one tire has no traction it moves power to another wheel, and thats not the best when all four tires are on the real slippery stuff. My old qx4 was a tank and had a true 4 wheel lock with a low trans.
I really dont know what im saying but the x5 is good enough for me as far as offroading.

Agree, we did not buy this truck to do serious offroad. The benifet is it handles on road far better than any other SUV even the pepper :thumbup:

Since 99% of us do not do offroading which would you rather have.

X5 :thumbup:

exactly.

If I wanted an offroad SUV I would get a Jeep and off road it like I stole it. :D

I had two grand cherokees and those things were just mad off road!!! Dont plan on taking my X into the woods though i swear i'll cry if i find another scratch or chip :mad:

That's what I was thinking too... the Cayenne does have a locking diff, so that's probably why it did so well clawing up a steep mud-covered slope, and blasting through deep, soft sand. I wouldn't try taking the X into anything technical, but it would be nice to know you could make it up something steep and slippery - would the X just stop if it couldn't find traction at any wheel (rather than spinning its tires, and clawing for traction)?

well, when i got stuck only about 2 tires would spin for about 2 seconds then the other 2 would spin, and it was worthless. You have the new 4wheeldrive system so im sure its going to be bettter than what the older x5s have

Top Gear: Porshe Cayenne Video
 

Is this vid?

Top Gear: Porsche Cayenne Vid

Yep, that's the one...
In fact, this internet link has additional footage that was cut out for the US TV broadcast... like the end, where Jeremy refuses to drive home in it because it's too ugly :bustingup

Watched the video. Great car but this was hella funny:

"And then from here back. it looks like they haven't bothered. Honestly, I have seen more attractive gangrenous wounds than this. It is a monkfish among cars. It has the sex appeal of a camel :bustingup :rofl: :bustingup :rofl: :bustingup ....with gingivitis. :bustingup :bustingup :bustingup

Have a look at this artical:
http://www.xoutpost.com/articles.php?...icle&artid=108

It may be worth remembering this if/when you're next on the loose stuff.

Warning - long!

Having just arrived home from a holiday with some 4WD work I will give you my impressions..
Having owned (and still owning one) a number of Mitsubishi Pajeros / Monteros I like a bit of serious off-road driving.
I believe that for the $$ I should get a nice looking car (albeit with plenty of wash and polish), a tow car, and a reasonable off road car. If I get the odd scratch then so be it - you only live once :)
Last week I towed a 2+ tonne van to the Flinders Ranges in South Australia and the X towed like a champ - got about the same consumption towing from the 3.0 TD as the Pajero gets around town on its own.
Went on a self drive 4WD tour (Skytrek) which was 60Km and took 7 hours.
The prereqs were for a 4WD vehicle with low range - 6 speed auto sounded close enough for me. Asked the guy at the start if any BMWs had done the course - he said he didnt know BMW made a 4WD!!

This was my first time off-road with the X so I was quite interested to see how the traction control would work, as I figured this would determine whether I got through OK. Remembering to press the DSC button so that 4X4 appears on the dashboard display - I noted that this would need to be pressed again each time after an engine restart.
I agree that the biggest limitation is ground clearance - I had to take some different lines and go very slow over the really bumpy stuff - put the wheels on the high ground sometimes rather than in the ruts all the time.

Climbing up steep rocky hills I was quite impressed with the traction control - you can easily hear and feel the brakes cutting in on the spinning wheel(s).
There was really only one very tough spot - there was a jeep Cherokee some way in front of me and I saw a cloud of dust as he tried to get up this section. I saw passengers get out as he attacked it with more speed and finally got through. I took it slowly at first and FR and BL wheels came off the ground - the traction control tried but gave up. Seems like it works fine for small slippage, but when you seriously get wheels off the ground on steep uphill sections it doesnt have enough braking pressure on the spinning wheels.
Anyway, I kicked out my passenger to take some video, gave it a little more speed (still in 1st gear), and it went up without too much trouble. I watched the next 4WD (a Pajero) try a couple of times before getting out and moving a few rocks - he then got up with a bit of speed also.

I am pretty impressed with the off-road capability other than where decent ground clearance is required. Suspect it will perform nicely on sand - save that for another day.

A few images attached to give you an idea of the terrain - they dont give any idea of how steep it was.
X came out unscathed other than a scratch on one rim from a rock - good excuse to buy some nice wheels for around town :)

Enjoy.
DS

Thanks DK - excellent write-up!! :thumbup:

So now we know... the X is no slouch off-road after all.

:dancing:

I had a Land Rover Discovery, and I can surely say that on snow covered roads, the X is just as controllable, if not a tad better. I'm a firm believer in having the right tires. I dont mean you have to have snow tires to perform well in the sno, you just have to have a good set of all weather tires. I love the Mich Cross Terrains. If you're out in the snow or mud with low profile, high performance tires, then you should expect to get stuck, no matter what vehicle you have.
True offroad features like a differential lock arent seen as much today with the All Season Traction type drive systems. Even LandRover stopped adding the diff lock because the all season traction basically gets a computer to tell your brakes to do what the diff lock used to do.
The only bad thing about the X is the low ground clearance (relatively speaking) and bottoming out in a snow drift is a possibility that should be noted.
As for you guys with the Cherokees, give me a break! The frame on that junk box will bend if you try any real offroading. I've seen windshields break and doors not close properly from frame bending. Heck, many Jeeps arent even 4 wheel drive.

That is an excellent post DS. Love the pics of the X tearing A$$ up that hill!! Not that I would ever need to drive my X on such terrain.....its nice to know that I can if I need to. Be sure to write up a similar eval with pics when you take her in the sand!

Mark

WOW!! You are so confused and so utterly wrong. Next time compare the facts between a Jeep or a Cherokee to an X5 in an offroad situation. The X5 will lose to BOTH in a offroad test.

The X5 will destroy the oters on the road and in terms of quality and numerous other areas, but will lose and lose hard in an offroad test.

I can attest to the X doing quite well on sand. I drove mine 10 or 12 miles up and down the NC coast, some on hard pack by the Ocean, some on loose and large-grained sand towards the dunes, and she did great. :thumbup: I didn't get the secure feeling I get behind the wheel of my battle-weary '92 Pathfinder 4X4, but I know that will never get stuck in anything I will ever drive it into, and it was my first time with the X :D

Thanks for the nice words and pics, DS.

JV

I never said the X5 would beat the Cherokee off road. Read it again ;)

Cherokee sucks...go Land Rover!

I'd like to compare (in real off road or snow situation)the two sistems of traction of the x5: the older and the newer x drive. Has anyone tested both?

Message for DS: you say that your friends take a video for you: could you post it?
It would be very interesting for us!! :wow:

BillK, if we are talking about off-road prowess the X5 doesn't compare to any Jeep or Land Rover. We are talking about two completely different animals. Up until recently all Jeeps and Land Rovers use solid axles front and rear. These trucks are much more geared to off-roading than the X5. To be fair to the X5, it isn't intended to be an off-roader.

And just to clarify, Land Rover discontinued putting in a CDL (Center Diff Lock) in 1999 when they came out with the Series 2 Discovery. The reason that they discontinued it is that in the US, people would leave the diff locked on the street and they would destroy the transfer case. Also, the traction control in the Discovery 2 doesn't do anything to help out with front to rear slippage of the driveshafts, only side to side (wheel to wheel). Land Rover only discontinued the CDL here in the states.

While I love the X5, I know its limitations. It stays on the street. My Land Rover gets to see the dirt and rocks.

I don't think anyone is trying to compare the X5 to a Land Rover for off-road capability... but it is nice to see some first-hand evidence that our beloved X5's - which TROUNCE everything else on the road - can also hold their own in light-to-medium off-road duty... which is a lot more than some people credit it with!! :thumbup:

>Message for DS: you say that your friends take a video for you: could you post it?
> It would be very interesting for us!!
Yes I could cut a small section of video (this is where most of the pictures come from) but would need somewhere to post it - any ideas?

>Also, the traction control in the Discovery 2 doesn't do anything to help out with
>front to rear slippage of the driveshafts, only side to side
X-Drive takes care of this on the X5, performing the same function of a centre diff lock, but only when there is excess slippage between front and back (ie more than just the difference generated by turning a corner etc). As mentioned, i think the traction control is a bit soft for serious off road work, but I guess if it was more agressive then the brakes would be more likely to overheat.
If ground clearence is not a factor then I would say that the off road performance is very similar to my Pajero/Montero which has standard a manual locking centre diff, limited slip rear diff only, and low range.
First gear on the 6 speed auto is quite low and I think just as competent as low range, especially with the low revving diesel.
DS

I don't know if I would say suck...but it probably doesn't do as well as a vehicle whos sole original purpose was for off-road travel. All I can say is after driving in my friends Grand Cherokee...I'll take the X with 4 flat tires over the Jeep.

http://nwapa.org/mudfest/#Anchor-Model-Year-21683 <-- as usual when this question comes up, I point here :)

Amen, brother! :iagree: :D :woot: :cool:

Ahh - didnt realise that you can a attach video files .... here you go.
Two small clips of the toughest section. Doesnt show that it was quite a steep hill, although you can hear the tyres trying to get grip in (1.)
1. First attempt at slow speed (incar)
2. A little more speed and up it went (outside)
All good fun.
DS

More Off-road in Australia
 

Hey DS,
Another X5 in Aus here. I have taken my 2004 X5 4.4 off road a few times this year with a tag-along 4WD tour company: Great divine tour and they are very impressed with the X5 off-road capabilities considering its low clearance. The new X-drive system is very capable. We did a tour at Stockton beach in NSW on sand dunes/beach and the X5 has no problem whatsoever as long as the DSC button is pressed. On a steep sand hill challenge, even the tour guide with his turbo diesel Toyota landcruiser could not get up and my X5 had no trouble going up (and it was my first time going off-road too).

I am going on a 2 days 4WD driver training in a few weeks time and looking forward to the most out of this awesome luxury SAV!

Here are a couple of photos on past trips (not sure if it upload correctly, haven't been on the forum for a while). Enjoy.
QT

http://www.xoutpost.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2699
http://www.xoutpost.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2700

It looks like they did not load properly, downunder. I would love to see them, tho.

That's awesome - glad to hear it!! :thumbup:

First off, READ MY POST. I never said it was better than the LR off raod. As for the Jeep, I never said that either. HOWEVER....Every Jeep that I have seen doing any serious offroading was HEAVILY modified. In all fairness, if one were to modify an X5 (almost impossible since the market for that doesnt exist) in the same manner that a Jeep would be modified, then you would have a real competition.
I firmly believe that an unmodified, standard Jeep Cherokee is NOT a serious offroad contender.
The LR (up to about 2003) is one of the best offroad/onroad vehicles and requires much less modification. Again, please DO NOT put words in my mouth. :)

BillK, I reread your original post. I must have misread it, sorry. :D

While I agree with you that the Jeep Cherokee is a complete POS, it is a good off-roader bone stock. It has good ground clearance, solid axles which give good axle travel and stability, and has a true 4 wheel drive transfer case. It doesn't have a frame; it is a unibody construction, thus the flex in the body. I had one myself and experienced the groaning, creaking and eventual breaking of things. That's why I bought the Land Rover Discovery.

Now to the subject of modifying a X5 for off-roading, its not really feasible. Having independent suspension makes any kind of lift extremely difficult. With a solid axle truck, its as simple as swapping the springs and shocks and attending to any driveline angle issues because of the lift. On a independent suspension truck, lifting it is much more complex because of the camber effects of the lift. Also, the breakage factor goes way up because of the increased angles on the cvs. There was a company that did a suspension lift on a LR freelander. On the first off-road trip, it blew a cv joint and took the transmission with it. Independent suspension trucks are best left alone. If a off-roader is desired the best solution is to start with a solid axle truck and go from there.

Going back to LR, one of the best bone stock off-roaders is the 2004 Discovery Series 2. It has the 4.6 litre engine and CDL standard. It is a great compromise on-road / off-road truck.

I have my doubts about the new LR Discovery. First off, the rear ground clearance seems lower. Also, FORD has a tendancy to make good cars into bad cars. I think they are stressing "marketability" which means less offroad, more onroad. Take a look at Volvo. Its a crying shame what they did to them. Excellent cars down the pooper. have you seen recent reliability reports on Volvo's? Enough to make you cry. But I have strayed (very) far from the original topic. My mistake.
By the way: the V8 on the LR is a killer regarding gas consumption. I forsee these things fading away with gas prices being what they are.

Bill, just to clarify, the 2004 Discovery is the old solid axle truck. The new LR3 is the vehicle you are referring to, I'm assuming. I've attached a pic of the 2004 Discovery. The 2004 Discovery is the BMW revamp of the old series one Discovery. The LR3 is the Ford inspired Honda Element crossed with an Explorer. I agree with you regarding how they are looking to marketability as opposed to sticking with a certain brand strategy. The LR3 is a compromise vehicle IMHO. It has independent suspension and a long wheelbase. It will never be able to compete with the X5 in terms of street driving and also loses a lot of off-road ability.

I do disagree with you that gas prices will hurt LR sales. Being expensive SUVs ($45-$80K) I doubt that gas prices will influence their target market's buying decisions. It might hurt the lower priced SUVs such as the Explorer, etc.

You forgot about my off-road thread that I originally posted on bimmerf :D

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=77633

http://www.bm3w.co.uk/ug/data/3051/1673DSC00166.JPG

would turning the DSC off help?

I took mine off road at work today... :p

You are gonig to hell for doing that!!!!!

:D :D I kid!! Nice work :thumbup:

Just click on the link. It work for me. If you have pop-up block on, you need to turn it off. Hope it helps.
QT

Didn't work for me, either... even w/ pop-up blocker disabled :dunno:
I would def. like to see the pics too, though - this has been an awesome thread! :thumbup:

Would you mind telling me how to add pics to the message? Thanks.

Click the insert image icon, looks like a mountain.

Type or paste the address in, (important thing is the [/IMG] quotes).

If it's an X5world gallery item, paste the BB Image Code anywhere in the post, you don't need insert image. (BB image code is found at the bottom of the uploaded image).


http://xoutpost.com/gallery/files/8/9...and600x450.jpg

http://xoutpost.com/gallery/files/8/9/X5onsand.jpg

http://xoutpost.com/gallery/files/8/9...iff324x243.jpg

Thanks for the tip, DE05 LSF.

There you go Aaron...it was good fun revving near redline in 2nd gear going up that sand hill. The noise the X5 made is just unbelievable. Everyone thought a jet was taking off........ :D

Haha, I love you guys so much.

Has anyone tried taking off bumper moldings to get bigger tires on the car?

:bump:

for those who have not seen.

Thanks for the bump LeMansX5! It was an interesting read

Agreed, nice bump.
For those who'd like to read up a bit more on off roading try these: Offroading and Drove on the beach today with no problems
I remember seeing an insane video of an X5 in a rally that nearly rolled. The X was moving at a high rate of knots as well. Can't find it at the moment. I'll have another look tomorrow.

^^ This video has been posted umpteen times here...Enjoy. DSC in action. :rofl:

I still love that one, especially the guy running away. Looks like he's ready to dive off the cliff if necessary!

I'm sure that driver was praying to the gods of DSC and X-drive, and it worked!

You, my friend are an ANIMAL!!

and im that 1% who dares to take this car on mild offroading ;0

I take mine off roading everyday , my whole city (Dhaka) streets are bunch of off roading tracks :P