Just installed Pirelli Scorpion Ice & Snows
 

All 4 of the Diamaris were roasted and beginning to make noise. I opted for a dedicated snow tire for the best traction in the mountains. Most reviews that I read stated that owners were getting 40K or so out of a set running them year round. So far I like them. A touch noisy on the freeway but that was the tradeoff for superior traction in the snow. I'll report back as the miles increase.

Interesting idea running snows year round. I've heard great reviews of snow traction with them.

Definitely a plus being able to keep the 20" wheel look year round.

I have been considering this exact tire swap. My Diamaris' will be ready for replacing soon and I would like to replace them with all seasons or Pirelli Scorpion Ice & Snows all year. I live in Phoenix, AZ I think I would be literally the only person running snow tires year round haha!!! In the winter time I do a lot of snowboarding so I think we would really enjoy having them.

How loud are they at speeds? What are the handling characteristics compared to Diamaris? My uncle runs Blizzacks year round in Ohio on an RS6 and they are loud and bumpy on the freeway.

Keep us updated on your thoughts!!

I run them all winter because the sumer tires I have - Yoko Advans - suck big time in the rain. they work very well in the snow btw. I am running the 265-50-19 size which is about .5" taller than stock. they certainly do ride smoother, but some of that is a 19" 50 series vs. a 20" 35 and 40 series tire. also there is less tramlining. Still, I love getting the summers back on after the winter season because the dry grip is just not on par. Plus the 20's with the fat 315's in the back just look way better!!

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2529/...5ef_z.jpg?zz=1

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4132/...252dc1b8_z.jpg

AZ,

The majority of the reviews that I read stated that owners were running these tires year round and they had great wear characteristics. That was a huge component of my decision to go with dedicated snow tires versus all seasons. My Diamaris were becoming slightly feathered on the inside rears so the noise was terrible at any speed. So far the Scorpions are much quieter and smoother overall. We'll see how things go with a few more miles.

Good to know. Can't wait to drive em with 8 inches on the ground. Looks like Tahoe last year in the photo.

Sort of. Up near Bear Valley. And that was at 5K feet too....

You should not be running dedicated snow tires all year around, they will melt on anything above 7C. I see a couple of people do this, i am guessing because they can't afford to swap, i laugh in my head at them at traffic lights.

Do it right, or don't do it at all :)

I would not suggest using these all year long. When the temps rise in the summer you are compromising your safety and performance big-time. Have you every seen the video on Tirerack's website showing how winter tires out perform all-season in temp around 40F and below? Well the same would be true about all seasons in summer temperatures. When it gets hot outside and the streets warm up, it is going to take you longer to stop and you are not going to be as safe in emergency situations where you need the car to handle properly. I would really do some research on this if I were you.

Exactly, thanks for expanding :) I would suggest the OP get something for summer and winter. Most people will run 17" or 18" in winter and 19" or 20" in summer.

You are going to love the Pirelli's in the winter and snow. I am one of those who purchased the Scorpions in stock 20" sizes (275 and 315) last year and swear by them. I swapped them back out for the Diamaris' that still have good tread left for the spring/summer/fall use. I like max performance of two sets of tires that are dedicated to their specific seasons.

Winter tires can be a little noisier but some summer tires are not that quiet either. My diamaris in the front are fine, the rears are toast, but both ends make ahorrible racket....

I run winter tires (X-Ice) on my Tundra year round coz the rear axle has zero grip on summer tires (unless loaded ofcourse). They have over 30k miles and another 5k on them easily.

I also drove my Dunlop M2s one summer when I broke my foot and didn't feel much like swapping them (I have dedicated wheels). They wear quicker in the summer for sure but unless you track your car you are not giving up much, if anything.

In fact, summer tires or all-seasons in the winter is horribly dangerous and I see it all the time around here. The latter situation is FAR worse in my book as you may be able to gather some speed in a 4x4 but you will NOT be able to slow down.......which is witnessed by the incredible number of SUVs that wind-up with the shiny side down :-) around DC.

You don't think you are giving up grip by using winter tires in the summer? Really? :confused:

you certainly do give up some grip. But I don't think it creates a dangerous situation. Not on the order of running summers or even all seasons (no seasons!!) in the winter anyway. I run them until the rainy season is mostly over because my summer tires are pretty dicey in heavy rain. And we get some warm days in there. Never noticed an issue with grip although I am not trying to lay down top time of day on an autox course or anything :D

I am not saying it is more dangerous than using summers in winter. I wouldn't suggest doing either as they can both be dangerous. Put on the right tire for the right season. They were designed that way for a reason.

fseth, great point about the temperature. where is the comparison that specifies the temperature that the test was done at?

I can't find the video right now. I will look tomorrow. The only one I could find was comparing winter tires to summer and all seasons on ice, which is not only affected by temperature, but tread pattern as well. I will try to find one based soley on temp. In the meantime, here is a chart stolen from one of LeMansX5's threads;

don't work too hard on it. I only asked cause I have never seen a comparo that states temperatures. even Consumer Reports doesn't tell the temp they test at. (then they say winter tires don't do as well on dry pavement, duh, of course not at 70F!)

We use winter tires on each of our vehicles even though we get about 3 days of snow per year. I think the temperature alone has a much bigger influence on winter tire benefits than many give them credit for...

Sorry sprocket, I can't find a video on Tirerack's website showing dry testing. All the tests were on ice or snow. I think that I confused one of those for just testing based on temps.

The above chart I added from LeMansX5's thread was from BMW Canada and the following link is to Continental's website. Both suggest that 7 degrees C (44F) is the temperature cutoff.

https://www.conti-online.com/generat...ter-tires.html

Just about every tire source says that the summer and all seasons harden at lower temperatures (below 7C) causing poor performance and that winter tires in hotter temps get way too soft to perform well. Plus, they wear very quickly.

Ofcourse winter tires are not ideal in the summer which is why I have a set for of each kind. But, if you are going to compromize on a single set of tires in a place where temps drop below freezing or a lot of rain around freezing then winter tires are a perfectly acceptable compromise. No further comment.

A good summer or all-season tire should handle heavy rain just fine. My Pirelli Scorpion Zeros are good and my old Toyo S/T's were fantastic in the rain. I have never driven a vehicle in the rain with as much confidence as the X5 on those old Toyo's. Among many other reasons, your winter's may have felt better in the rain because they are much skinnier than your summer tires.

Running winter tires in summer creates a dangerous situation as the heat causes them to become even softer than they were designed to be run. This causes longer stopping distances and reduced handling capabilities.

These charts are very helpful. However, would we say that unless you live in a place that has extreme winter condition, all seasons are the way to go? For example, I live in Phoenix and make trips to the mountains in the winter. I am wondering if it makes more sense for me just to get all seasons vs 2 dedicated sets of tires.

Maybe to you it is a perfectly acceptable compromise, but not to me, or tire manufacturers, or BMW, etc.

How long is summer where you live? How long does it stay over about 45 degrees? Half the year or more? If so, then half the year you would be using the wrong tires. By your logic, if I live in an area that only sees freezing temperatures about 3 or 4 months, then summer tires are a perfectly acceptable compromise because temperatures are warm "a lot".

Absolutely. What are the alternatives? A year round Winter tire, no thanks. A year round Summer tire, no way. A good all season tire can handle all weather conditions well. Not great and not as good as a dedicated winter or summer, but good. I know you and I both wished they made the Continental Extreme Contact DWS in our staggered sizes and here is another reason. Watch this video to see how they handle winter conditions.

Video Center

I'd like to thank you fseth. I was looking to purchase the Continental Extreme Contacts DWS size 20" since I don't feel the need to have two sets of rims/tires for summer/winter use since I don't drive my SAV much in the NYC winters and this video just justified me purchasing them. Thanks for the video :thumbup:

FSETH: I think we need send a petition letter to Continental to make the DWS in our size haha!!!! I had watched that tirerack video when I began looking at the DWS.

No more comments, please do not infer things I have not stated, thanks.

You promise this time? :D

No problem. There are a few members who have these and have experience with them in the snow. So far, everything I have come across has been positive. You may be able to search out some of those threads and ask for more feedback. I just got some on my e36. So far so good, but I have very limited mileage and all of it was on dry roads.

AZX54.4, I hear you. Maybe we could get that going. The all season choices are pretty slim for the 4.4 staggered setup.

Fseth: It is so true. We basically have two credible options in my opinion. The pirelli scorpion zeros and the michelin latitude HP's.
I wonder if we put some calls into Continental if we could make something happen?

I agree and I always run summer tires on all my other cars except the wifes where I run higher treadwear rating all seasons. And I have always experienced excellent wet performance with summer tires. But for whatever reason the Yokohama Advans are terrible and flat out scary in the rain even with AWD. Go figure. Needless to say I won't be getting another set of those. Toyo S/Ts will probably be my choice for summers next time. Although I really don't mind just running the winters for the 4-5 months of the ski season as it saves me the hassle of swapping. And it doesn't rain all that much in the other months. But it's pretty silly to have an AWD SUV that does terrible in the rain. Especially now that my wife is driving it to transport kids... So for sure will get a better summer or even all season tire to run in the summer next time. But likely will stick with snows for the winter because I tend to go during the worst blizzards of the year in the Sierra's chasing powder and it can get ugly up there. :wow:

Agreed. I wouldn't want my wife driving around in a car that doesn't handle the wet conditions well. The Toyo S/T's are all seasons, as are the S/T II's. I loved the S/T's, but they were really noisy as they aged. Apparently, the new S/T II's took care of that issue. If you are looking for all seasons that handle both wet and dry conditions well, you may want to take a look at the Conti ExtremeContact DWS's. They are not the Conti's of yesterday and have been rated through the roof at the TireRack. As shown in the video I provided, they can also handle some snow if you get caught in it before you change over to winters. Plus, I think the treadware rating is over 500.

Yep, that is why I have the Zero's.

Maybe we could get a thread going that showed a bunch of interest for that size and let them see all the businees they were missing out on. Eh, it would probably be a waste, but I guess you never know.

Right, who knows what it would do. Its just the rear tire that they dont make. What comments do you have about the zeros? Do you like them? Good all weather traction, noise etc...?

So far, so good. I don't have a lot of seat time with them yet though because the X is my wifes car. Imo, dry traction and steering response feels similar to the Toyo's. The difference in noise compared to the old Toyo's is night and day. So far they are quite and ride really well. I can't decide if they flat spot a little or not after the car has been sitting for a while. I need to pay more attention to this. If they do, it is only for a few miles. So far I have not had the opportunity to drive them in heavy rain, but I expect them to do just fine based on what I have read on TireRack's website.