Hot start issues with Codes P2177 and P2179 - FIXED
 

FIXED SEE LAST POST. Faulty Hengst fuel filter.

Hi Guys,

I've been battling a hot start issue with codes P2177 and P2179.

When the car is cold it starts fine. Once it is hot, the car just cranks and cranks with no start. I then turn the key off for a few seconds, try again and it will crank for about 5 seconds, then fires up. Idles a little low for a few seconds and then starts to idle fine.

I've replaced the fuel pump, fuel pump relay, fuel filter, cleaned the MAF and the throttle body this past week. Can't see any obvious vacuum leaks. Hose and clamps for the MAF look prefect. Still have the problem. Any other suggestions?

Thanks!

Instead of throwing parts at the problem you need to do some investigation as to what is the problem. P2177 and P2179 mean you have a lean off idle condition. A lean condition can be caused by a bad fuel pump, clogged filter or a vacuum leak. I would determine what type of fuel pressure you have at the fuel rail when you turn the key on without starting the engine. You should be in the neighborhood of 45-50 psi. If you have this type of fuel pressure I would look at a vacuum leak, possibly from the pressure regulator to the engine.

Hopefully when you replace parts you buy decent parts and not cheap parts off eBay or Amazon. There's a reason why the parts are cheap, they don't have a QC program so all their parts made are sold, none are rejected

Thanks for the info!

The parts I was replacing were all things on my preventative maint. list anway, we've been slowly chipping away at them. Just bought the car last month so we are going through everything eventually.

I'll need to pick up a fuel pressure gauge. Harbor freight time! Thanks. :thumbup:

Unless you want to be a mechanic or just like to own tools, you can rent a pressure gauge at Autozone, Pep Boys, O'reilly or Advance auto. Some offer a free loaner program if you are a good customer with them.

Autozone charges the cost of the pressure gauge that is 100% refunded when the gauge is returned in good working order.

Cleaning the MAF doesn't always work. Did you spray the wires that are somewhat hidden?
Try removing the MAF connection and see if the idle improves or at least changes.

I tried disconnecting the MAF and it did not help.

I sprayed the MAF sensor pretty well.

I forgot to add that I had also replaced the fuel pump relay and it did not help the issue.

I'll be testing the fuel pressure this weekend and will post my results. Thanks for the suggestions guys.

The idle didn't change at all?

Fmugur, a member here had a similar issue a while back with his 1st e53. The injectors were leaking once the car was warmed up, and were flooding. Cold start no problem. Once the injectors were replaced, no more problems. PM him, see what he has to say.

Yep, the injectors was the problem in my case but try to rule out the fuel pressure as these guys suggested although why you would have the right pressure when is cold vs. warm.
Can you find the exact pattern start vs. no start?
If you try to start the car within the next few minutes after it was stopped, will it still start?
I believe for mine it was around 20-30 minutes to flood the cylinders. The car would start almost with no issues during the first 20 min or so.

http://www.xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-foru...njector-4.html

The same discussion here:
http://www.xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-foru...d-weather.html

While testing the fuel pressure you can start the engine and stop it and observe how long it takes the pressure to drop. Try starting the engine and if it doesn't start note the pressure reading. Once the engine does starts note the pressure reading. With an assistant observing the pressure gauge snap open the throttle and observe the pressure gauge. If the pressure doesn't go up when you snap the throttle open you may have a bad fuel pump or a leak in the vacuum line to the pressure regulator. If the pressure reading goes up you have another issue that is causing a lean off idle condition like a vacuum leak.

Awesome. It feels good to not be alone! :rofl:

Finding a pattern has been tough. I think I'll start documenting my start and stop times to see if I can find the pattern. I feel that when the car is warm and it starts after a couple of tries, then I shut it off and try again it will still struggle to start.

The car does always start, it just takes some time. Sometimes it takes 2-3 seconds of cranking sometimes it can crank for 5 seconds and won't start until I try again. Usually 2-3 attempts.

I'll review your threads, thanks for sharing them.

Nice! I'll be following your recommended steps this weekend. Once I do, I'll post my results. Thank you!!

Any luck?

Just had my valve cover gaskets and CCV replaced and threw these codes on the way back from the picking it up.

Hi Hudjase,

Not yet. I haven't done the fuel pressure testing as described in this thread. I pretty much parked it until I have time to dig into it further. I plan on doing the fuel pressure and scanning with a Gt1 this Sunday. So I should have more updates Sunday evening.

Best of luck on Sunday,Curious to hear what you find out, the service engine light has been on more than off over the last year and that's even after replacing the engine.
Looking forward to you update.

Thanks for the reply btw... It's the worst when your reading a thread and someone's having the same issue and the thread just ends....crickets �� hahaha

Totally agree. I won't let this thread die till it is solved!

Exact same issue with my 3.0/6spd... had an independent shop look at it, and they tested everything they could (MAF, fuel pump, etc...) and found no solution to the problem. Please let us know if you figure this out... its the only issue I have with the car!

Thx

Hi Guys,

Not much to report. Driving the X5 a little more and have found a sure way to start it every time. For warm starting, I turn the key to crank for 2-3 seconds, turn it off and the second start up has worked like a charm every time.

I tried the rental fuel pressure test kit from O'Reillys on Sunday. The schrader valve attachment did not fit well on the fuel rail. There just wasn't enough threads on the attachment to get a good seal. The valve attachment was listed as a Ford schrader attachment. I then checked the AutoZone kit and it was the exact same set. I read that people have used teflon tape to get a better seal so I may try that and just buy one from HF.

I also scanned it this weekend. The good news is that helped me fix an intermittent misfire issue. I thought it was related to my starting issue but it pointed to a possible bad coil. Swapped out the coil and so far so good on the misfire issue.

I'll post again once I have the fuel pressure test done.

Thanks for getting back with the update, I have been researching the issue non stop. A few things I noticed on your readings.
1) before throwing the 2177 2179 I was receiving the fuel tank venalation code, which mysteriously went away.
2) CCV valve malfunction/ replaced breather valve and hoses/ valve cover gaskets and manifold gaskets
3) replaced O2 sensor/ rough idle/ ran smoother after O2 sensor was replaced

4) I am not having the hard start issue, just a shudder at a times when accelerating and bogs down when accelerating until I give it more gas. Also bad fuel consumption
5 not sure what HFM is..

Not sure if any of information helps.

I will post anything I may find, I maybhavento take it back to the Indy to see if it has anything to do with what was repaired.

I know this isn't for our bmws but has good information

FIXED
Finally fixed. Took me awhile mostly due to me not committing to the issue as much as I should have. Anyway... The culprit was the newly replaced Hengst fuel filter. I am assuming this filter had a faulty fuel pressure regulator in it. I swapped it with a Mahle filter and the problem completely went away. What a relief. Car is running and starting great.

Hope this helps for anyone else who may have this problem.

Great to here!!! Thanks for posting back! Greatly appreciated

This is why in my posts I warn people about buying cheap part to fix their X. Fix it right or do it twice.

http://www.xoutpost.com/1028585-post2.html

Very true! The good thing is I can now swap a filter pretty proficiently. The first time had me scratching my head. The how to write up on this site was extremely helpful. Especially with the fuel line hose clamps.