My turn to do valve seals
 

I took our X5 to get smogged last week, the technician called me out after about 5 minutes and said they hadn't tested it because it wouldn't pass anyway because of the burning oil. I didn't even realize it was burning oil. He said on V8 X5's they always let them idle for a few minutes to let the oil buildup and then when he blipped the throttle sure enough, there's the blue smoke.

On the advice of a BMW mechanic friend I replaced both pressure regulator valves. Kind of a long shot but they are cheap and easy to replace. I couldn't tell if they were bad or not but they did fall apart when I removed them. Unfortunately that didn't help so I've ordered new seals and spark plugs and will tackle that job this weekend.

I'm not one for step-by-step DIY's but like with my rear diff repair I will update this with general steps and some details of more difficult steps.

Wish me luck!

Good luck and subscribed! I'm at almost 93,500 miles on my 2009, and have been putting this off. I, however, poured in a quart of Lucas oil leak stop when I last changed my oil about 5k miles ago, and it sure seems to be helping. I only lost about a 1/4 of a quart within the last 2500 miles. There was a thread about it on here.

My smog shop wouldnt have been so "helpful'....

GL

I know you're being sarcastic, but I really don't know if a 100k mile V8 X5 could pass the California smog test if the valve guide seals had not been done.

Would the typical symptoms of bad valve guide seals cause a car to typically fail the CA test? (I know mine would smoke ALOT if you hit the gas after an extended idle.)

Here in NY, (where the emissions standards are as tough as CA and MA,) there's no emissions testing on OBDII vehicles. The presence of smog equipment is checked, and as long as there's no CEL or pending codes, you're good to go after the safety check.

I didn't even think about it at the time but we no longer do tailpipe tests either. A little Googling and I think it failed the "Visible Smoke Check":

https://www.smogtips.com/visual_inspection.cfm

I forgot to mention it's a 2008 X5 4.8i with 96K miles.

I’m having the same issue. It’s worse when hot and very notable in fast food drive-thrus. I may tackle the job this summer when I can borrow a car. I have tried Liqui-Moly Motor Oil Saver and ATP AT-205 Re Seal with no luck. I’m at 103k miles.

Did you go with OEM BMW seals?

I did not. I went with Elring. Good quality seals and I couldn't justify spending 3z as much for OEM that never last more than 100k miles.

Do you have reports of the new, revised OE seals failing?

I saw some threads discussing it but none of them met my bar for anything definitive. The BMW part number for the seals never changed and there is no mention of it in TIS or an SIB bulletin. I did find someone talking about the N63 seals being exactly the same dimensions but lasted longer. This sounds plausible as the turbo N63 is going to run A LOT hotter on the exhaust side and the rubber on the seals may be a different / better material. I decided not to even go that route as I had no way of verifying they are in fact the same dimensions.

Both Elring Klinger and Victor Reinz are OE suppliers for BMW. When a seal is first introduced they are typically all from the same supplier, but that doesn't last long. Within a very short period of time, all the OE suppliers will be making the seal and the only people who are going to know what supplier they bought them from is the buying group. If they meet the specs BMW considers them interchangeable and uses the same part number. If anyone at a dealership tells you otherwise they are just guessing or passing on hearsay.

That's just my $.02 though, take it for what it's worth lol.

According to AGA's website, the Elring seals are the way to go. They are an improved design. I think you made the right call.

Which tool are you using for the install? AGA?

It is my understanding that BMW updated the seals (shape and materials) about 3 years ago, give or take. So the new BMW seals and the elring are the same.

BUT...Im not going to argue with AGA. ;)



Am also wondering what tools OP is using..... timelapse vid somewhere, worth watching...

Generally BMW part numbers coincide with the specs for the part. If they update the specs, it gets a new part number. This doesn't mean that newer parts aren't better, if a supplier improves it they may use an indicator like color to distinguish them but since the old and new versions both meet BMW's specs they are interchangeable in their mind and will retain the part number.

I rented the AGA tool kit off of eBay, $175 for 2 weeks. Supposed to arrive today.

When you try to remove the valve covers, just a tip that worked for me (on install, my experience with removal was before this method :D )...

No brute force or fighting is necessary if you angle them just right.

1. Once you have them free (e.g. spark plug tubes clear, unbolted) and ready to lift off
2. Turn the front of one cover up and towards the other side of the engine so that the top-back corner is the only thing you need to clear the eccentric sensor
3. While looking/feeling along the top-back corner, gently slide the cover over the eccentric sensor

if you have a second pair of eyes, it's much easier of course.

If you do it right, it will slide right over the top of those sensor ears (that everyone breaks) without too much trouble, strain, stress or words you wouldn't normally say in mixed company. It also may take some time to figure out the correct angle, but it can be done.

Again, as I understood it, the new BMW valve stem seals are a different part number than the ones they put int he motors when first built.

Here ya go:
50i N63 valve stem seals job. Timelapse video - Bimmerfest - BMW Forums

That's for the N63 motor that I mentioned above.

Here's the video for the N62:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AE5PsbHgzM4

You make it sound easy lol.

That's pretty much the way I do it. The passenger side isn't much trouble. On the driver's side:

I get the wiring harness and the heater hoses on top of the VC
Pull it straight up about 2 inches
Rock it towards the drivers side
Push the wiring harness under the VC
Rock it back over the wiring harness
Push the heater hoses under the VC
Then rotate front of VC to the driver's side and up

Unfortunately, no matter how careful you try and be you're dealing with old brittle plastic and I now have one broken ear on each sensor.

Even if you break both ears there is no reason to replace the sensor. Cut a 1 inch long piece of 1 inch diameter shrink tubing and shrink it over the connection and it will never just pop out.

We weren't talking about how to do it. He was commenting on the seals for the N63 that are different and a few people on the internet recommend using them and saying the are exactly the same but better / revised.

The N62 uses part #11340029751
The N63 used part #11340039494 which was superseded by 11340054492

It's important to note that the N63 and those seals were introduced in 2008. Our seals, 11340029751 were never superseded, and continued to be used on various engines all the way through 2015!

If they are exactly the same but "better" why would BMW keep both part numbers active?

Unless you have a definitive answer for that I would NOT use OEM N63 seals in an N62 but that just my take.

Two hours in, removed everything necessary to gain access to the valves. So far nothing tricky. Will get back in there in a couple hours when it warms up a little.

It took me forever and I'm not done. Im going to pull the intake cams and re time one bank at a time.
There is just not enough visibility to zip through without losing a valve.

This is my eBay cam timing kit for returning after cams off and seals done.
I'm at 1 month and only have bank1 donehttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...ac61563079.jpg

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Wow. I wouldn't say this is a particularly difficult job but it's unbelievably tedious and there's 32 frickin seals to do!

I'm about 10 hours in and have only completed passenger side.

How the heck are you guys so fast???

And i'm sooo slow!!

People in Washington never get anything done

Probably comes down to previous experience + work area + available tools? I rented the AGA tools for two weeks and didn't return them till the very end. If I compressed all the time down, it' probably took me a week overall (although my 13 year old daughter helped a lot, so that probably added quite a bit of time to give instructions, etc).

Two hours to remove both valve covers?

You are my hero. :bow:

I am really not looking forward to this job.

That's about the time it should take for someone experienced with the job according to AGA. 20hrs start to finish.

So you're on right on track. Be patient. Keep reminding yourself you're saving yourself about a $2,500 bill from an indie repair shop.

Halfway through second bank now. If I were doing this again on my own car I would seriously consider just doing the exhaust valves first and see if it still smokes. Just those could easily be done in 8 hours, the intakes really are that much more difficult.


**** EDIT ****

Scratch that idea. I measured one of the valve stems and then with a rod that exact diameter started checking how snuggly it felt in the old seals. Basically ALL of them were worn out. More later in this thread.

Interesting. Does anyone know if the problem-child is usually the exhaust side? Makes sense due to heat. Would hate to have to put it together and take it back apart.

BWAHAHAHA! :bustingup:bustingup:bustingup:rofl::rofl::rofl:

On a more serious note, I decided to check with AGA on their price and time to do the job and they came back with "around $2800 and up to five days! So I don't think anyone is going that slow.

I never did make friends with the AGA valve keeper tool. It's a marvelous bit of engineering but for most of the valves I found it too difficult to maneuver into position and if anything, took longer.

I went back to the old school long thin magnetic screwdriver method

Took me a total of 22 hours over 3 days. It's a long tedious job but the AGA toolkit makes it fairly easy.

Car runs great and passed smog

Only other common problem I haven't had is rear main seal, knocking on wood.

I had issues with that tool, I figured out you have to use just the right amount of grease, make sure you go on properly aligned, and use a very quick on/off method. Then it was perfect 30sec max job to load it with new ones and then get the keepers on.

Glad you got it back in good working condition!

I love the tool but it is sure difficult maneuvering around those lifters and rollers!!!

I've started bank 2 with the cams off. It's soo much easier. But yes. I did have to buy a cam timing kit. $50 dollars to save a bunch of time and effort is a no brainer for me.

Albeit, I'm not done yet and have not started the car.

What's involved with removing the cams?

Cams come out easy, it's getting back in that's tricky as you have to time them.

While I was taking a break and staring at it all I came up with two ideas:

1 - if you just need a little more room on the intake side I don't see why you can't just pop all the idler arms off and just remove the bearing caps that hold the eccentric shaft and remove that whole piece.

2 - use the spring compression tool to press all of the valves down slightly one by one with each corresponding cylinder at TDC and remove all of the rocker arms. At this point the valves are all closed on all cylinders and there is no need to rotate the engine. That means you can remove and install the intake cam without having to time it.

Does anyone know the cam cap torque?
15nm or
20nm

Cam sprocket is 80nm

Thanks

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I read 11ft lbs and confirmed that was what mine were originally tightened to

You're awesome!!

Thank you!

For future reference, to measure or confirm a torque value:

BEFORE you loosen the nut/bolt, draw a line with a Sharpie or grease pen down one side and onto the part.

Then put a socket on it and draw a line in the same position on it.

Loosen the nut / bolt about 90 degrees with a socket wrench or breaker bar.

Then with a bar torque wrench, double check the lines on the socket and nut /bolt still line up, then measure the torque necessary to get the lines lined back up.

Do at least two and if they aren't close do more until the proper amount becomes obvious.

Thanks.

First time using digital torque wrench. All it does is beep and light up.
I like my mechanical torque wrench better.
But I don't have a mechanical one that goes down to 11ftlbs.

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