Transmission Flush - Do or DON'T??
 

I'm the second owner of the X5. It's a 2008 with 252k on the clock. I'm chasing down a shudder issue I'm experiencing only after the car is warmed up after bout 20 minutes of driving and typically only manifests itself in stop and go traffic. Primarily the issue is when the car shifts from 1 to 2 this is followed by a shudder / loss of power. If I press the gas more the transmission kicks down and it accelerated without issue. Also, I can't typically eliminate the issue by switching the car into sport mode.

The transmission fluid has never been changed because I was told not to at around 125k by local shops and the dealer. They said flat out don't do it because the friction material would be lost and the transmission will slip. So, I didn't.

It's been great until recently where this shudder is becoming annoying. It's not horrible, but I would like it gone.

Now this could be fuel system, coils, spark plugs, vanos, injectors or valvetronic motor, eccentric shaft sensor, or torque converter or transmission related.

I've already ruled out vanos, check valves, spark plugs and coils. I've tested end stops on the valvetronic motor and it seems to be working. I'll be testing the injectors and fuel pump today.

My next course of action is as follows.
1. Replace the valvetronic motor because it could be failing as it heats up and degrades in performance. Others have seen this and it's very difficult to diagnose but it results in the same issue as I'm having.
2. Add Lubegard Instant Shudder Fixx to the transmission.
3. Drain and change the transmission fluid and filter and while in there inspect the seals and other parts replacing if needed.
4. Do everything in step 3 but also add Lubegard Instant Shudder Fixx.

Does anyone have any experience with this and could offer some insight / advice?

Thanks in advance!

You looked at transfer case actuator?

If the problem does indeed turn out to be trans related. At your mileage, servicing it could be the nail in the coffin. I wouldn't use a machine to flush if you were going to go forward.

Does that 3.0si use a ZF 6HP?

Thanks for the reply!

I don't know the exact model number of the transmission but I can get that for you today with a peak at ISTA.

I did replace the transfer case actuator gear a while back as well as the case fluid. Everything was pretty much mint at the time. I tested the case and reset adaptations / calibrated it recently as an attempt to fix this issue. I used ISTA+ but it made no difference. When I did the flush on the case fluid the fluid looked to be in very good condition.

I'm thinking that the case isn't the culprit but, I've read posts about disconnecting the actuator cable and going for a drive to see if this helps. I haven't tried this yes but I'm willing to.

Something else I'm thinking of doing is remove the transmission fill plug to allow a little fluid out and have it tested.

No shop wants to change the transmission fluid because most people don't change it until issues pop up. Then the change gets blamed when it finally seizes or reverse goes out.
ZF will tell you to gravity drain and change the filter no matter the mileage. Don't use a flush machine.
My E46 with a ZF has a Lifetime Fluid sticker on it but I actually emailed ZF and they said to change it. It now has 265,000 mi. with one of the worst transmissions put in a BMW. It's due for another change.
My E70 is overdue. The transfer case got done when the oil pan gasket was replaced at 185,000.
There may be some solenoids and seals that should be replaced while you have it open. I'm not sure. There are kits and documentation for the E46. I assume someone has it for the E70.
This may get into a long drawn out discussion on whether to or not to change, but there's no way transmission fluid keeps all its lubrication properties after 100,000 miles. I understand the argument about ports getting clogged, but that's really rare. It's normally the torque converter.
It's lifetime fluid because when the tyranny goes it cost more to replace than the value of the car.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

Have you done your differential fluids? Front/Rear? Not sure it fits your symptoms, but that front diff sees a lot of heat and the fluid gets really nasty.

As far as the trans. If it is a 6HP. You could attempt a service but just a drain and fill. Do not machine flush. If you are sure it's the trans causing your issue, I'd do the 4 tube seals, the bridge seal, and then fill it up with Valvoline Maxlife ATF (has to be multivehicle). Be sure to follow the fill procedure.

^ But that's only if you have exhausted other possibilities. If the trans dies (mine did when I threw a hail mary at it after the E clutch bushing failed), paying someone is very costly, if anyone even wants to touch it. Shops act as if ZF transmissions are magic black boxes. I did it myself to replace on my wife's diesel and it still cost near $1200 in parts. More if you include the "while I'm in there" parts list.

So, if I bought a tube of the shudder fixx stuff, and put that in without loosing fluid, that would tell me definitively if this is from the transmission or not wouldn’t it? It seems like that would be a very easy and inexpensive thing to rule it out.

If that tells me this is from the trans, maybe at that point it would be safe to change the fluid? Thought on that?

Thank you!

It depends on what the shudder fix purports to fix, how it does that, and if your transmission is actually experiencing that failure mode. It might do nothing and it shouldn't need an additive like that to operate somewhat correctly. If it does something, how long will that effect last and what does it mean diagnostically for your transmission? What are your planned next steps then? Fact is, your transmission has 252k miles on it with probably zero service events which isn't half bad. All that to say, I don't think the shudder fix is a good discriminator for a transmission with this many miles on it.

ETA: Do not flush it.

Yes, in fact I have ISTA and scanned the entire car and there are no fault codes whatsoever in the transmission module.

My thinking was that this additive won't do harm to the transmission if it is in fact performing properly. But, if it's not performing properly, and the fault is with the clutches or torque converter, it will be an immediate and apparent improvement in drive dynamics and I'll know at that point that the transmission / clutch are at fault.

If I add it and nothing changes I'll continue to dig. But if it makes an improvement or "fixes" the issue then I would target my efforts on a fluid change followed by a transmission replacement if needed. I can do the work myself.

This car is so smooth and feels new. This is the only issue I'm facing. Low speed -> Mild throttle -> Shift -> Shudder -> Hesitation

The additive could "fix" the trans, or it could grenade it. No way to tell before doing it. It shouldn't... but we all know how that goes.

No codes at all eh in the EGS? If you are sure the trans is the source, and you are comfortable doing the work, and you really want to keep this X5, then I'd follow:

Step 1: Replace tube seals, bridge seal, mechatronic sleeve, trans pan/filter, and fill with Valvoline Maxlife multivehicle. Clear adaptations.

Step 2: If the above doesn't help. Or it hurts and makes it worse. I'd have the valve body rebuilt w/ Sonnax zip kit. ~$750 service, or $300 in parts if you do it. I paid WorldWideSpecialties to do it for me. Clear adaptations.

Step 3: If above fails. Source low-mileage transmission w/ torque converter. Found mine for $800 shipped with 88k on the clock. Confirmed by getting VIN of vehicle it came out of and running it. Install your rebuilt valve body into it with original EGS (so no coding involved). New seals, pan, etc and clear adaptations.

Those are the steps I went through with our 35d and it shifts/drives like new. All in with PM parts (motor mounts, trans mount, vacuum lines, DPF cleaning, rear main seal, etc) I think it was ~$2000. We have 168000 on the truck. Remember, logically your truck is only worth $4000 at that mileage and with that issue. With a totally crapped trans... worth even less. So make sure to factor that into the value proposition. Ours is pretty nicely equipped and I couldn't send it to the scrap yard. But holy crap did it cost me time and back aches. ;)

Note: Anytime you clear the trans adaptations it will drive like absolute dookie for 10-20 miles while it figures things out again. Mine bucked and even failsafed once. Just restart and keep driving. After a few miles it will get smoother and smoother.

I have a little update. Yesterday on a trip out to get some much required pizza I noticed the car was shifting and driving much smother. It wasn't perfect, I'd say it was about 80%. But that's a step up form like 50% prior.

Today I took it for a long country drive under pretty much all driving conditions. The shudder only happened a few times on the entire trip and the trip was extensive with stop and go, hills, traffic, smooth country roads, dirt country roads and highways. I wanted to cover everything.

I'd say the car felt like 95% - 100%. I had reset the transmission adaptations a few drive cycles back so this maybe the adaptations are getting sorted out? Regardless, it is improving a lot.

I pulled the codes when I got back and I noticed a few new interesting ones.

2CFB and 5F78. Both have not occurred in the last number of driving cycles and both only happened once since resetting all transmission and engine adaptations and codes. You can see the faults and frequencies in the images attached. The one about the DSC I think was due to recently changing out my tire pressure monitors on all 4 wheels with new ones. The others were not working. I'll monitor and see if the DCS code comes back.

The other code about the throttle position adaptations struck my interest since I've seen others speak about that module failing in the pedal and causing a shudder issue. I'll keep monitoring that as well and report back with finding if it comes back.

One other concern is the engine temp. I grabbed a few screenshots form IMPA and the engine temp is in the green but near max after that long drive. Thoughts on this?

I'm also including a few others for the "Mechanical adjustment range VVT ​​from learning routine" and the DME Voltage. The battery was changed many years ago and at the time I didn't know about registering the battery so it was never done. Pep Boys sold the battery to me and didn't say anything about this while they helped change it in their parking lot. So I'm wondering if perhaps it's too close to overcharging?

Any thoughts on these things would be awesome! Thank you!

Throttle Adaptation Error 2CFB
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638666330


Can't Read DSC Error 5F78
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638666330


Injector Smooth Running Operation Values - LOOKS GOOD!
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638666330


Motor Temp - Looks Sketchy!
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638666330


DME Voltage - Looks Skethcy!
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638666330


Valvetronic VVT Value - I Have No Clue...
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638666330

Update, the car is still about the same as yesterday. But, if I come to a stop sign, slow down to about 2MPH and then accelerate, this causes a heavy shudder almost every time.

That's my update for today. Any thoughts would be highly appreciated!

Another update. This is getting very frustrating. The shudder has come back full bore like it was. For two days it was improving to the point of it not even being there. As of today, with no changes whatsoever to anything, including gas, the shudder is back. I don't get how the same car, with the same driving conditions and fuel can change over night like this. My head is going to explode.

I'm thinking maybe this issue is more engine / electrical related now because when this happens, if I press the gas the RPMs drop by about 200rpm and the engine bogs down and the whole car shudders! Then I press a little more and the car snaps to life and accelerated quickly. This is very concerning for traffic conditions since I will be essentially driving up on bumpers and slamming the brakes constantly because of this bogging down and shudder.

Any ideas?

At least it sounds like it's not likely your trans.

Unfortunately you are no closer to a diag. There aren't that many things on the N52 that causes driveability issues but doesn't throw a code. Though your accelerator pedal code, if it is an active code, could be a pointer in the right direction. Have someone drive around while you monitor INPA or ISTA live data to see the throttle duty cycle. See if there are any anomalies.

Emphasis mine

Still not sure what transmission you have, but....

I did this to fix my issues, which were exactly what this video said in the first 90 secs or so (found it after I did the fix lol) and my shudder issues are gone - https://youtu.be/aX0bhui8UXA

I've done a lot of work on mine with very little experience (just lots of confidence :D ) in very expensive areas but never ever ever wanted to touch the transmission. Finally got up the nerve to do it.

**IF** your issue is transmission related, crystalworks advice is the way to go.

Note for future readers: I bought my parts at thectsc.com, they sent everything except for 1 tube seal (they left it out of the order by mistake) but then promptly sent a whole new complete set right away after I let them know (great customer service, even over the weekend, highly recommend).

Great video I just watched it. He didn’t say don’t do it, he did say if you drop the pan and you see a bunch of metal you’re pretty much toast. But, I am leaning towards going for it.

One thing to note, the car felt awful today. It was almost perfect and then today it feels like crap. I got home and I scanned for Codes. There are two new ones. One is A818 RFK PDC invalid data. Another is 2C78 related to the oxygen sensor two after catalytic converter.

I need to look into those two as well. That just happened after the car is been running like trash.

Out of curiosity. How old is your battery? What is the voltage at idle being put out by the alternator?

The battery is at least five years old. I’m heading home now and I’ll load up INPA and check the voltage at idle.

LOL, stop on your way home and buy a battery. I change them religiously at 4-5 years in any BMW.

But seriously, yeah when you get home check the idle voltage. If it's good (13.8+), I'd buy a battery. Might be a good idea to drive around a bit while monitoring the voltage output after buying a battery. Sometimes a failing alternator doesn't present itself at idle. Reset all codes and see how the truck reacts. These things are very sensitive to voltage dips/spikes or not getting enough current from the battery. If you notice anything dipping below 13.6 while driving, your alternator brushes are shot.

^Those issues might not be your shuddering issue, but the EGS in general is very sensitive to voltage/current. Your battery is definitely due for replacement so is an easy thing to start with.

Im using INPA now. At IDLE it’s at 14v exact. When I rev the gas the voltage remains the same. When I let off the gas the voltage dips to 13.7 or so then settles on 14 exactly.

The battery on his laptop is shot so unfortunately I can’t drive around with it I can only do this at home. Do those numbers sound like a bad battery? There is another 95 amp hour battery down the street I can just go pick up for 200 bucks. Since the age of the battery is five years plus maybe it would be a good idea to just do that today. I can use ISTA to register the new battery.

Good, sounds like your alternator is okay. Though driving around and monitoring it would be better confirmation, what you have looks good.

Definitely pick up a battery just as a matter of preventative maintenance. Cooler weather is coming anyway and if that battery is border line, it won't be for long. Was going to ask you if temperatures were falling there when you said the performance tanked after being mostly normal.

Ok The new battery is installed and I’m going to register it using ISTA. It’s a 95 amp hour battery, I had a 95 hour battery in there already. But the original OEM battery was 90. I don’t think it matters that much to register as a 90. If I have to program it I’ll have to take it to the dealer or get ISTA P which is like 80 GB.

We’ll see how it goes

Sadly the new battery didn’t correct the issue. At least I have a new battery though so for the sake of preventative maintenance that’s done.

At this rate I should just replace my valve Tronic motor for the heck of it lol

Did you get the battery registered to the car?

I wasn't overly hopeful on the battery and wouldn't have recommended it except you said your batt was 5+ years old. That's about the usable life span of a battery in a modern BMW from my experience.

@ 250k I guess the valve tronic could be getting sluggish, but with the codes you have it wouldn't be my first salvo in the parts cannon.

It’s all good man you gave me the inspiration I needed to replace it anyway. It was going to go bad at some point who knows maybe even this winter.

After the full system reset, and resetting all of the modules, that O2 sensor code came back as pending. There’s definitely something going on there I need to go look at the O2 sensor tomorrow. I read that a bad O2 sensor could cause shuttering and shaking during acceleration. I hope that’s what’s up!

Hey, thanks for the comment! Yeah, I used ISTA to register the battery. Took about two minutes to get it done!

Can you read out the current LTFTs and STFTs? What out about lambda outputs?

Hi thanks for the reply! Can you tell me what LTFT and STFT is please? I can do that this morning!

Thanks!

Long and short term fuel trim and also ignition adaptation values.

I'm not sure if this is exactly what you're looking for but I took pictures of ISTA before and after a 15 minute drive. This is from overnight cold to running temperature where the shudder starts. So far I still do not have a CEL but that O2 sensor code is pending. I could buy a brand new Bosch O2 sensor for $150 if that is an issue.

If there's a different data set you're looking for I'll grab it just tell me where to find it and I'll get it on here ASAP!


O2 and Adaptations Before
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985175
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985175


O2 and Adaptations After
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985175
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985175


Engine Values Before
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985304


Engine Values After
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985304


Smooth Running Operation Before
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985304


Smooth Running Operation After
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985304


Vanos Before
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985304


Vanos After
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985304


Eccentric Operation Before
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985304


Eccentric Operation After
https://xoutpost.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1638985304

Confirm that the O2 code is 2C78?
You aren't running any performance tunes?
Catalysts installed?
Have you disconnected the O2 sensors recently?
Confirm the last time you cleared any DTCs.
What work/tinkering/inspection has been done under the vehicle recently?

So no tunes or tweaks or mods are done. It’s bone stock. I love this car and don’t want or need to mess with it. I have not disconnected the O2 sensors and the cats are installed. The codes were just cleared yesterday when I replaced the battery I also went into that ECU directly and cleared them out. After yesterday’s drive that 2C78 Lamba Probe behind catalytic converters 2 signal code showed up as pending. The CEL is still not on however but the code is stored in the DME.

I replace the Vanos valves with brand new OEM valves I also replace the Vanos check valves with OEM ones as well. As mentioned I replaced the battery yesterday. A few weeks back I replaced the upper strut mount bushings.

About 7 months ago I replaced all of the coils and plugs with NGK plugs prevailed and checked for correct tolerance. I’ve been swapping coils out to see if that helps but there is no improvements there.

I’ve cleared transmission and engine adaptations in hopes this would help but it doesn’t seem to.

I will say that the valvetronic motor gets very hot at running temp. Maybe that’s normal.

This issue is directly related to temperature as well since when I start cold and drive for 15-20 minutes it’s perfection. But then it starts degrading to the point where sometimes the throttle doesn’t respond without me mashing the gas under load. I press more and more and it simply doesn’t do anything until I really get on it. Also it seems perfect at highway speeds and when I really press the gas to go there is no problem with immediate and smooth power delivery from what I can tell.

This issue is a troubleshooting nightmare lol

Thank you for the help!

I have no idea what it means, but that -2.2x% multiplicative value would drive me crazy till I found the source of it. May be totally unrelated though.

I could be wrong but I believe even though it's probably well with-in 'specs', should ideally be 0%. The fact that it's (in my mind) significantly different than the other bank makes me wonder if you have any air/oil leaks on that side.

2% +/- is not crazy for LT and ST fuel trims. When you get over 5% and 10% you have an issue. I believe codes trigger on BMWs at 10% +/- LTFT. At least that's how it was on the M54.

Must admit I've never really worried about fuel trims. If a code popped for one it was usually a vacuum leak. O2 sensor codes were usually heater circuit errors.

So at this point, do you guys think the O2 sensor code is a false positive? I'll inspect the wires tomorrow. I can just replace it if you feel I should.

Also, looking at the data I posted, it seems that there's nothing that really stands out as an issue. Even the smooth running data is all very close in the dead center of the spec.

My drive home today was the same. Beautiful highway driving, but jerky on normal roads. Typically the shudder / jerkiness occurs right after the gear shift form 2 -> 3. 1 -> 2 is pretty smooth, but 2 -> 3 is followed but jerkiness pretty consistently now.

Two days ago the car was 99%. The suddenly it just went to crap like over night.

Do you know if the fuel pump recall has been performed on your X5?

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/rcl/201...6V746-7192.pdf

RECALL CAMPAIGN 16V-746

I did a search fairly recently for any recalls. According to the site my vehicle has no more. They did the EGR and both airbag recalls. But apparently that’s all that shows up for my vehicle. Was there a recall on the fuel pump for a 2008 X5 3.0?

Something I just realized, if I’m accelerating lightly, and the shaking starts, the moment I put the shifter in sport mode the shaking immediately stops. There’s no change to RPM or gear. The shaking simply stops. That to me is leaning towards not a transmission issue but some other issue. Very strange! What do you guys think?

"This Recall Campaign involves F07, F10, F12, F13, E70, E71 and E72 vehicles produced from May 2006 to
July 2011."

Not sure where you checked, but if you look here: https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2008/B...DR/AWD#recalls you'll see all the recalls for a 2008 X5. You can also put in your VIN number to check specifically for your vehicle.

Hard to tell. When you hit sport mode your RPMs should jump as the trans drops a gear. So things are changing in the DME and the EGS that could be masking the problem.

If you drive in 100% sport mode, do you have the same shuddering issue?

Here's a little update. I finally had a chance to dive into the O2 sensor. It was failing silently so it was not throwing a code. Until recently. A few times the engine light came on then off. I replaced it and sure enough the O2 sensor was responsible for 95% of my issue. There's still a little something going on but it's incredibly minimal and may be due to residual or learning issues.

I'm going to replace the other matching O2 sensor as well since they tent to fail around the same time. But with 255k on the clock, with original O2 sensors, I'm not complaining. I'll b replacing all of them over the next few months but at $150 a pop I'm going to take my time.

Crazy that the O2 sensor could cause such an issue to feel like my transmission was dead. I learned something new.

Very cool.

Going back to changing Transmission fluid. IMO the fluid and filter should be replaced about every 50,000 miles. Since changing the fluid doesn't empty the torque converter I remove the pan, change the filter and refill with new fluid. Drive 25-50 miles and then drain the fluid and refill with new fluid a second time. I use only the designated fluid for the transmission.

So after totally derailing this post because of that phantom failure of the O2 sensor, and now that I have that fixed, the car is running beautifully. So I'm back to my original question, should I or should I not proceed with a transmission fluid change?

As mentioned, the X has 255k on the clock and the original fluid. It runs and drives mint! But I fear if I drain the fluid, and add new fluid that the transmission will begin to slip.

I know some say that there's a certain group that says no matter whet milage, change the fluid! But what are your thoughts?

I'm leaning toward doing it, but, I wonder if perhaps I can pull the fill plug, suck some fluid out, then have the fluid tested before proceeding with the full change. This will only loose a little fluid but will show if it's filled with friction material? Thoughts on this?

Thanks!

Change it. Do a 2x 'drain-fill-. Change all the rubber bits and bridges too.


It may die in 10k. If you do the fluid change you will declare "it was doing the change that screwed me" if you DONT, you will declare "a fluid change might have saved it"


You are doing a gentle drain/fill...and NOT a "flush". Dont associate issues that can come up with an aggressive power flush with a simple fluid change.


Also. O2s are a maintenance item. For a reason. ;) Wonder what that has been doing to your motor? AFRs? Fuel dilation? hydrocarbon loads in the Cats....who knows....

Agree with ard and others. DO NOT FLUSH ANY TRANSMISSION. EVER.

If I were you, I'd drain the pan, remove the pan/filter, replace the seals and sleeve, install a new pan/filter, top off with new BMW OE or real ZF fluid. I said before, you got good miles out of that transmission and you're on the tail end. When it goes, you'll never know if it's because of the fluid/filter change OR if you did nothing.

Now that I've established some level of service with my transmission, I've decided to replace the pan/filter every other "1/2" fluid change which will occur every 50k miles. My transmission is young but coming up on 200k miles with no issues at all during my ownership. I hope this continues.

I'd run some Liqui-Moly fuel cleaner through a couple of tanks. They offer a few different types: Valve Clean, Fuel System Cleaner, Speed Tec Gasoline, Gasoline Engine System Cleaner, Injection Cleaner, which are good. Lately, I've been using Archoil products in my X5d and diesel truck and am pretty happy. Read that as nothing has blown up. Yet. Chevron Techron is a great product, also. Maybe you live in a region where Chevron w/Techron or Texaco w/Clean System3 is available at the pump. Run a few tanks with whatever you choose and then change the engine oil and filter.

You can buy Techron at any auto parts store and add to a full tank of gas.

Nice that the o2 solved most your issues. Always important to eliminate other causes for possible trans problems first.

Change the fluid, rubber seals, and service with Valvoline MaxLife multivehicle. DO NOT USE ZF LG6! LG 6 should only be used on a vehicle that has had regular maintenance. I'm one of the few who have experience with LG 6 on high mileage, not serviced, transmissions (multiple vehicles). Do not use ZF fluid. It's a waste of money and is thin resulting in not maintaining pressures.

That said, at your mileage, as others have said, changing fluid (or not changing fluid) may result in blaming a fluid change for trans errors or other erratic behavior. No way of telling. At your mileage with no service history your trans is a time bomb. If keeping the vehicle, prepare for a trans change financially.

Were it mine. Change with Valvoline fluid, not flush, just drain and fill. Replace bridge, tube, pan/filter, and mech seals. Good luck.

Thanks for the reply! Yes I totally agree on the "time bomb" part lol Stupid me I relied on a "reputable" indie shop years ago when it only had 120. I called them and said I want to change the fluid and they told me "DO NOT CHANGE IT IT'S BEYOND THE 100K MARK". He proceeded to say that at that milage there's too much friction material in the fluid and it will ruin the transmission if I change it. In retrospect I should have just gone with my gut. But a trusted friend told me to call, and they were the "experts" so I listened. Never again.

I know at some point I'll need a new transmission. I have no problem doing that job myself and it will give me an excuse to but a car lift for my shop! Transmission + lift would still be cheaper than having a shop do the job and the lift will get countless uses so it's worth it.

For now however, I'll do the change. That's my upcoming project for a not so cold day.

Can you offer any advice on where to get the kit and a possible brand you would recommend? I know "BMW" OE is the desired but I'm sure there are comparable aftermarket brands some may have experience with.

I'll go with your recommendation as well and avoid the ZF fluid. If I end up having any slipping issues there is the "Instant Shudder Fixx" stuff I could try.

Thanks!

Also, I believe I have the GA6HP19Z transmission. Is that the ZF 6HP?

Again, just trying to find the correct service kit and possibly the mechatronic service pats as well.

Thanks

These are a few of the items I've found.

Service Kit:
https://www.amazon.com/Bapmic-6HP19-...d=WCZ5VZTKWEJR

Valvebody to Case:
https://www.amazon.com/AUTOKAY-6HP19.../dp/B07LFBWH6G

2 Gallons of Valvoline Maxlife Multi-vehicle Fluid:
https://www.amazon.com/Valvoline-Mul.../dp/B008QDV2JG

Does all of the above look correct?

Some time ago I spoke with the owner of a transmission repair shop that had been in business for 20+ years. They specialized in transmissions for European vehicles. His position was there is no such thing as lifetime transmission fluid and recommend changing fluid at least every 100,000 miles. He was clear to only use the fluid recommended by BMW or fluid from the transmission maker as it was part of the transmission design. For the diyer He recommended draining and refilling the trans and driving for 25 or more miles and then change it again. That draining the transmission doesn't drain the torque converter. That one draining leaves too much of old trans fluid in the new fluid. I didn't ask about flushing the transmission.

I agree with @bcredliner that it isn't lifetime. For ZF transmissions they claim six years on their site. My ATF looked new at 15.5 years, but it had about 40k miles then. So, his transmission shop's recommendation of 100k miles may be more relevant. I've seen others here recommend 60k.

My shifting problems and limp mode when cold were due to low ATF level as a result of a leak from the Mechatronic sleeve. A common problem, the o-rings were worn out, especially in a dry climate.

We did three drain / refills with Valvoline MaxLife red. I bought a Foxwell 620 Pro scanner specifically for this procedure. It's essential to have the ATF temperature correct when refilling to get the right amount of fluid in the vehicle. Also, essential, at least on some models, to start the engine and top the level off again after the ATF circulates. This is documented in other threads.

My transmission shifts like new with the MaxLife. Granted, I've only put on about 2.5k miles in the almost 2.5 years since the procedure.

Thanks for the reply! I appreciate this info. I'll look up the entire refill procedure and I'll run through it by the book meticulously!

I posted a few amazon links above for the service parts including the maxlife fluid. Does that all look correct to you or am I completely off target there?

Thank you for the advice and reply! If I'm using the Valvoline maxlife fluid it's about $18 per gallon so doing two changes isn't terrible. But the kit comes with all the bolts. I think they're one time use. Wouldn't I need to essentially get two sets of bolts if I were to do two changes back to back?

Also, I posted above a few links to some amazon kits for the service. Do those look correct for an 08 X5 E70 3.0si with the ga6hp19z transmission?

Thanks!

That's the same ATF I used. I have an E53 4.4i, N62.

The kit looks like it has what you need, but I'm not an expert. EDIT: It doesn't list E70, but does say X5's in that model's range. It will depend on your transmission. I like to use FCP Euro or ECS Tuning because you can search by exact year and model more easily. Is this the right one for your engine?

https://www.amazon.com/24117571217-T.../dp/B08FSPMF8L

I bought a kit from ECS Tuning because I wanted quality parts. It doesn't have as many parts. We reused the bolts for the pan. They were fine. No leaks. On mine, it's aluminum and it didn't need to be replaced either.

For E53:

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...t/24152333899/

Edit: You don't change the pan twice, you use the drain hole to drain it the second (and, possibly third) time. I did it three times to get more MaxLife to original fluid ratio.

Whoa, that kit does look complete, and it's prime! It's says E70 in the description as well as X5 2007 - 2010 so it appears to be what I'm looking for exactly!

I could get that with the sleeves and valveoline redline fluid and I should be good for the service.

I looked on ECS but there are so many option and none of the kits include the seals and bolts. They're all $100+ and don't include half of what this kit includes. Some are over $170 and include fluid but they don't includes seals or bolts either. I'll continue to dig but thank you for the help!

I have changed the fluid every 50,000 miles.

Are people seriously telling this guy no-name AT pans are a good idea?!?!

There are MANY complaints with non-ZF pans…. They LOOK similar, but they leak.

I wont comment on fluid. I’m a ZF guy, 2x drain and fill every 70k. Pan every second time.

Not sure who you're referring to here? If it's me, I wrote I used ECS Tuning because I wanted quality parts and linked to the Genuine BMW kit I got for my E53.

I read site reviews and forum opinions and make my choice. I spent double on a smaller kit for my transmission and about a fifth of the price for the fluid vs ZF. I don't regret either decision :thumbup:

I'm totally fine with getting a different pan if the aftermarket ones have trouble. That's not an issue but I was just asking for advice.

The kits on ECS and FCP are all sporadic. They have the pan and fluid or just pan, or the other parts. It's all over so I'm a little lost on what exactly to get.

But I'll keep digging.

Agreed. Stick with ZF pans and seals. I've read too many stories of leaks from non OE pans. Pricing is 2x on the ZF parts if bought from FCP but if you buy another one in 40k miles, it's free so the price will drop per service the longer you own the truck.

As for fluids... as said before, only use ZF LG6 (or Pentosin, Liqui Moly, Redline) on a trans that has been serviced at regular intervals. ZF recommends 60k-80k. In any other circumstance, use the Valvoline Maxlife multivehicle fluid you posted.

What are the last 7 of your VIN? Real OEM should say exactly what you need if looked up that way.

Here's ZF's recommendation, updated January 1, 2022:

5-, 6-, 8- and 9-speed as well as 4HP20 automatic transmissions:
ZF 5-, 6-, 8- and 9-speed as well as the ZF 4HP20 automatic transmissions are filled maintenance-free with specially developed
semi-synthetic ATF oils. However, due to the many factors influencing the service life of transmissions in individual operation, ZF
recommends an oil change after 150,000 km for its transmissions. In operating conditions with high temperatures and loads, or
with unknown vehicle use in the past, it can make sense to change the transmission oil at shorter intervals.


https://aftermarket.zf.com/remotemed...e-ml-11-en.pdf

150k km is roughly 94k miles, so in line with the transmission shop's recommendation earlier in the thread.

When I did my research 2.5 years ago, there was also a six year recommendation. As I noted earlier, my fluid looked pristine at 15.5 years, ~40k miles.

I got the transmission, front and rear differential fluids all changed at 95k miles. The transmission pan was also replaced at the same time. The indy who did it approvingly asked who suggested getting it changed, it's was a good idea. The X5 has been running fine, hope I have prolonged it's life. With over 250k on your odometer it gives me real hope :)