Stainless Exhaust E70
 

Hello to all X5 Owners,

My name is Brent I am a project co-coordinator/sales rep for Stebro Stainless Steel Performance Systems. We are located in Greely Ontario Canada and specialize in custom stainless/performance exhaust systems for BMW X5 E70. All our systems come with a lifetime warranty.

Here is a video of the E70, comments and feedback are more than welcome

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--kG7...&feature=email


We will be doing group buy for the BMW X5 E70.

PIPING WILL BE 304 STAINLESS,MANDRAL BENT AND THE MUFFLER MADE FROM 304 STAINLESS

X5 E70 list $2500.00
For X5 World Members
1-5 $2250.00
5-10 $2000.00
10-15 $1750.00
15+ $1500.00

Please contact me either through PM or Email for further details

Brent Fortin

STEBRO PSD LTD.
6939 MCKEOWN DRIVE
GREELY ONTARIO
K4P1A2

MSN Messenger [email protected]

FAX: 613-821-0780
TOLL FREE: 888-878-3276
EMAIL: [email protected]

Nice. What is the sound like inside the interior especially at cruising speed? My Denali had a custom exhaust and I loved the sound, but after a while I tired of the noise inside the cabin. Sometimes it was even hard to cary a conversation because of the noise. How is this shipped? Who do you recommend doing the installs? What is included in the kit? Do you guys manufacture the muffler? What does the warranty cover exactly? Are the pipes Mandrel bent? What grade of stainless is used?

nice sound....

any performance gains??

Check around on other forums, seems to be real CS issues with them!

Yep, and QC issues as well. On the E46 M3, their midpipe didn't use mandrel bent pipes and they also used some less than ideal stainless, which ended up rusting. They've since changed the design, but not until people complained and their competitors steped up with superior products.

I'll just wait, there's going to be a few coming down the pipe.....
:popcorn:

I agree, I think I am with you on this :drinking: Let's wait for a response and see how these are addressed.

Q. What is the sound like inside the interior especially at cruising speed? My Denali had a custom exhaust and I loved the sound, but after a while I tired of the noise inside the cabin

A. I drove the vehicle and the cabin noise was not bad at all I was able to carry on a conversation and did not have to raise my voice. You can hear and feel the sound but it is not over bearing. When you punch it you know its there but again not to the point where it’s too much. In the video there are two shots one just cruising and one where the vehicle was pushed. You are getting this for the sound so it will increase but again its not overbearing like the tuner cars or muscle cars. In the video and its hard to see but we did a decibel test and the reading was consistent at the 92 mark.

Q. How is this shipped?

A. We can ship by any courier the customer wishes. We shipped a few systems on customer’s business accounts as it will save him some money. Other than that we will UPS or FedEx.

Q. Who do you recommend doing the installs?

A. The rear muffler and all piping are made to OEM specs and will bolt into the stock locations. If you have the ability you can do it yourself or any muffler shop or dealer can do it.

Q. What is included in the kit?

A. Everything needed for the install will be included. Depends on what system you get all have different parts but all parts will be included for the system you buy.

Q. Do you guys manufacture the muffler?

A. Yes we are the manufacture. Everything except the tips and mounting hardware are made right in the shop.

Q. What does the warranty cover exactly?

A. Lifetime on the muffler.

Q. Are the pipes Mandrel bent?

A. Unless requested the pipes are NOT mandrel bent. It is more expensive to mandrel bend the pipes so as standard practice we don't but we can if requested, and a different price will be the result. Plus unless you’re building the vehicle for show or make HP gains over 500HP it’s not necessary. I also own a performance company dealing with Mitsubishi and have done exhaust testing, on most applications there was minimal to no difference in performance from mandrel bending unless you get close to 400-500HP. From my own personal testing I had an exhaust system that was mandrel bent and we just swapped out the mandrel bent center section (2005 Mitsubishi Lancer Ralliart) dyno-ed it before and after...no difference....we did get the gain and sound quality when we changed the muffler as the Stebro is a flow through design and best of all it no longer sounds like the average screaming tuner car out there....you all know what I mean.......

Q. What grade of stainless is used?

A. For the pipes we use 409 stainless. You will get surface discoloration but it will not penetrate the metal. The really shiny piping has higher nickel content and is brittle compared to the 409. The muffler is 304 stainless

I am not aware of any issues but as I have been reading there seams to be an issue. We can't please everyone but when there are more and a few concerns then I agree there is a problem. I can tell you that one of my job descriptions is CS and QC and I can assure you I will do my best to address any of your concerns. You all have my email and I would like to hear any feedback you may have positive or negative, how else can we improve if don't hear the bad and the good.

On the E46 M3, their midpipe didn't use mandrel bent pipes and they also used some less than ideal stainless, which ended up rusting.

I addressed the mandrel bending on a previous post and again we can do it its costs more but we can if requested. As mentioned there will be surface discoloration/rust but it will not penetrate the metal. Did it rust right through or did it change color? I don't know what was used before but as mentioned the piping is 409 stainless and the mufflers are 304.

Ok, let's make this clear:
-For a list price of $2500 you get non-mandrel bent tubing and 409 stainless for pipes?
-Just for comparison, the Eisenmann Race exhaust for the E70 X5 uses all mandrel bent tubing and 304 stainless on the entire exhaust and has a list price of $2437.37.

While I agree that mandrel bent tubing is not going to make that much of a difference performance wise, but at this price point we come to expect that level of thoroughness in the manufacturing process. Pressure bent tubing is what I would expect from my local muffler guy, not an exhaust manufacturer that is in the business of making exhausts for high performance cars.

Why use 409 at all? While I agree that 409 is only going to rust on the surface and has no affect on the integrity of the metal, wouldn't it be worth it to spend a little more and use 304 throughout the entire system? I would hate to show someone the exhaust that I paid $2500 for and have it be rusty. People like to see shiny muffler cans and piping, especially if they pay a huge sum for the product.

Here's an example of what 409 will look like after some use:
http://www.rebmw.com/Merchant2/graph...o/rust3_lg.jpg

Who wants to see that under their car? On the e70, you would definitely see the tubing leading from the can to the tips.

I would take a look at the aftermarket exhaust companies making exhausts for BMWs and see what they're producing for the same price, if not lower.

We use 409 for all production systems some don’t mind it. Many of or customers are not worried about the looks and 409 will be just fine.

Harold you’re absolutely right! I personally agree with you and I brought your concerns to the owner we can and will use 304 stainless and get the pipes mandrel bent for this group buy (or any systems bought on here) if that is what you want. Remember we are the manufacturer and can do just about anything when it comes to custom exhaust work

We have a standard practice in place but that does not mean it wont change to suit you needs and wants. Your input is great needed we have a fantastic product and with your help we can make it better....such as in this case.

The main thing is get the word out about our systems and please by all means voice your concerns we can and will make changes as our customer’s request.

This change won't affect the pricing. I will make the correction on the main post.



Tks Harold C

2 confirmed need 3 more…to get the ball rolling....wo wont be dissapointed I will see to that......there will be no CS issues or QC as it is my job and I will NOT let any system out the door without my personal inspection....


FYI all information will be kept confidential for privacy issues, well policy reasons.

Any Dyno testing planned?

Any drone at cruising speed?

Interior noise seems a little too loud for my taste.

Next local E70 we do we would like to dyno it, all depends on the customer. The interior noise is not bad from my point of view. It is not Muscle car loud and as mentioned you can carry on a conversation without raising your voice. We can customize your sound if you find it too loud. Our systems are free flowing but we can add a baffle to quiet it down if that is your preference.

Reviews
 

Thank you all for your emails and PM's regarding QC and CS. Here is the link to our Ebay store, have a look an judge for yourself. We have a 100% rating that speaks for itself.

http://feedback.ebay.com/ebaymotors/...k&myworld=true

Brent

what the heck... might as well add you to my exhaust reviews...

PM me pricing info and i'll make sure you get the most honest write-up...

Thank you all for your responses. I just got back in town today Sunday April 13th 2008. I will be at the shop tomorrow to finalize the deals that you have inquired about. For thoes of you I have not replied to I will tomorrow morning and get your deals finished up....

-Brent

Ok I think I answered all the emails and pm's. If you sent either and did not get back to you please email me again and I will answer back ASAP.

As mentioned we will be doing our production run starting Monday April 21st 2008. I will post payment methods by tomorrow on the forum.

Thanks again for all your support you guys won’t be disappointed...



-Brent

Production starts today. I am still waiting to hear back from a few of you but production goes as planned. There is still time to get orders in as the assembly should take place mid week.

-Brent

Any upgrade for Diesel engines?

We don't have the X5 Diesel here in Canada but we are looking into it. I will keep you posted.

-Brent

Thank you!

Hi all, I am based in Sydney and ordered mine.
I will let you know how it all goes from arrival to install and running.
The Customer Service to date has been fantastic and I cat fault their communications, response times, easy of ordering or quick shipping time.

more soon.
juicer

Why the conflicting information? The following is from post #1 above:

Greg,

For piping we dont unless requested and one of the members requested so we filled the request.

Too be perfectly clear ALL piping will be mandral bent.

-Brent

The guys at Stebro have listened to us at X5world and put together a deal for the 304 Stainless and Mandrell exhaust - I assume they will lean this way for all products of this type now, even if they cost a little more
Its a better product overall, even if there is no real nd for it.
Good on them I say!
I wish more manufacturers listened to all our needs!!!!

I don't understand why it's so expensive.
Eisenmann and Remus offers better quality, and the latter is half the price at way less than 1300 and Eisenmann is equally priced to your exhaust.

Both are 304 SS and the Remus has chrome plated tips
Remus:
http://www.remusexhaustshop.com/from...49-p-1314.html
Eisenmann:
http://www.ind-distribution.com/deta...make=44&part=1

Yet you have none of the R&D capabilities of these companies.

Lower your price below that of Remus and I'd be in. Twice as much for half as much? Doesn't sound like a bargain to me.

We won't comment on what other companies are doing I am sure they put out a great produce as do we.

I don't know what guage of steel or quality of steel is being used buy other companies, not all 304 stainless is the same quality.

I can tell you we use stainless streel made to north American standards and not some mill in a country where there are no standards. Actually the acoustic material used in our systems is very expensive and that is what gives us our sound quality that is second to none.

There are alot of variables that go into the price, every company does things differently and that will have an impact on price.

We also make systems for Lamborghini and we get requests from owners that bought a competor's system because it was cheaper and now want ours for the sound quality.....all I can say is cheaper is not always better.....especially when its your vehicle....

-Brent

Brent,

I am unimpressed with your answer.

You first suggest you will not talk about other companies but you are. Eisenmann is in Germany, Remus in Austria, I know my facts, so don't bs me! They both have to be approved by TUV inspections, there's nothing higher quality or equal or North America, and you're trying to tell us that your company, that usually uses low grade 409SS, is now using the top grade higher than those very respected German/Austria tuners?

Really? Do you have an accoustic chamber to test out your sound how it is out of your garage testing it with very scientific DB meters as in your video? Let's look at what remus does:
http://www.remusexhaustshop.com/images/chamber.jpg

You had me fooled there for a second. Come on, don't use the exotic argument when being compared to EISENMANN!!! http://ind-distribution.com/aboutus.html For chris sake! They're the OEM manufacturer for Porsche, oh and Remus has a pretty nice list too : http://www.remusexhaustshop.com/why-remus-i-6.html


Make it at 1000$ and I'll buy a pair!!! Don't fool yourself, you can't charge imported good, top gun quality prices when you're in North America with average building standards. When I bought my Eisenmann, I was paying for quality, german quality, german craftmanship, hand made, top notch materials and a german name lol...!

I'll keep it at that as you're a vendor here, but if you plan on lowering price, hit me with a PM please:D

Our price is our lowest price I can go. We can't please all but I know when is said and done our customers will be very happy with thier purchase.

-Brent

That's like saying : Do you drive on a dyno? Why bother?
You referred to those 2 companies as the "other companies that might use stainless steel from mill out of nowhere"...

I'd like to buy from a fellow Canadian entreprise and help the economy here instead of over there in Europe, anyway, what does that matter, I'm a consumer, I'll do whatever I want with my money.

X5E70,

Find a statement where I referred to those companies by name. I know there are more companies than us and the two other companies you mentioned that make exhausts for the X5. It was you that made that connection, the only reason I am responding to this is I want the members of X5 world to know I won't say anything negative about any specific competing company as its not my personal character nor would it be professional.

If you or any member has questions about our product I will be happy to answer them. As you said its your money so do your research on all companies and make your decision......moving on....

-Brent

GRRRR
I ordered a few weeks ago and I have been chasing Stebro
They promised delivery last Tuesday, now Tuesday of the followign week
I am now not getting responses from Stebro
I fear the worst now!
If anything chnages, I'll let you know!!!!
But right now, i reckon Ive done my money:dunno:

Sorry to hear that. There were warnings with dealing with Stebro. Looks like all talk and no action! I hope everything works out. thanks for the report.

Sorry to hear that juicer. I would have never bought anything from them in the first place. It didn't sound like a quality product and with a sketchy CS record, why bother when there are many reputable manufacturers out there at similar or better prices?

Good luck.

thanks guys, i am chasing.
have sent numerous emails to various people at Stebro Canada - NO RESPONSE FOR 8 DAY
called Canada this evening - asked for my name then wouldnt take the call, NO RESPONSE yet

I am contacting financial organisations tomorrow to inform of bad charge to my credit card if they do not contact me

I am so disappointed after they started so well:(

Thanks for posting your experience. This, although upsetting really helps our members stay clear of shoddy and misleading dealers. I know this takes a lot of your time to chase down and rectify. Hang in there. You may want to report this in other forums you may be a member of and call the Better Business Bureau http://www.ccbbb.ca/complain.cfm . We don't need vendors coming here and playing games with our members, making promises, taking money then Houdini out of here. Keep us posted.

That really sucks!

Unfortunately, Stebro is living up to their reputation. I was hopeful that with the new staff that things would be different. But it seems like more of the same from them.

If you paid by credit card you can refute the charges and the CC company will credit the purchase back to you. Good luck!

Juicer,

I just got your messages and I looked into the issues. First off as this is my project PLEASE contact me directly via email or pm. Could you let me know who you were talking to so I can correct this issue as you did not contact me.

As mentioned This is my project and my responsibility to over see it. Obviously there has been some kind of communication issues and I will correct it.

All orders have gone out except the ones we just recieved. You should have your orders by weeks end depending on where you live (shipping) Its been my experience with cross border idems that some "big hollow" idems may get looked at a bit closer.

All My contact info is there. As I mentioned via your email this is my project and everyone needs to come to me with issues so I can get you direct answers. I am doing my best to get you the answers you are looking for but when you deal with someone at our shop that does not know what I am doing you will get mixed answers.....example on this project I coordinated it with the owner and got the go ahead...I made my posts you guys responded (thanks to all for your orders) ....orders received and processed......time goes by you want to know your order status you contact the shop, not me (you guys need to contact me as I have always responded)....in this case I have been out of town (I still check my emails) doing R&D work for Lamborghini, no issues come to my attention thus I think everything is on track.....now I get bombarded with upset people and I understand why....so I am doing by best to find out what is the hold up....the issue is the clamps we ordered are not here when we expected them to be thus holding up your orders...

I apologize for the hold up. I spoke to both the owner and production mgr and we have ironed out the communication issues....again I am sorry for the lack of response.

:fired:I can't believe that a company like this can not get the comunication down especially after the terrible history of CS. HELLO! anybody there!! This is just plain same old same old. So no one forwarded the messages on to the appropriate person:dunno:. It's not like this is a huge conglomerate that has to channel messages from office to office, and then there is still no excuses. We don't want excuses we want CS and the product that was promised on time period! Seems like the Principals of this company are so far out of touch with the marketplace and customer service they don't deserve the business. Time and time again Stebro has shown there ability to break promises and disappoint the consumer. Eight days and no response...shame on them. God forbid that anything goes wrong under warranty, now that's scary. If the item has gone out demand a tracking # so you can see for yourself. There are several other high quality options and Companies that offer an par or Superior product that know what it takes to succeed in the marketplace and put value on CS and the customer. Take your money elsewhere and spend it where you will be taken care of and respected as a consumer.

For all that have placed and order you should receive by weeks end, if you do not....PLEASE CONTACT ME DIRECTLY....as I have been on other projects and this has just come to my attention thanks to Juicer....up until then I think everything is on track as I am not in the production room or shipping room on a daily basis.

This is a new venture for us and well there is obviously some communication issues between X5 world and Stebro. To be fair you guys NEED to come to me with your concerns and I will get to the bottom of the problem.

Another issue will be two answers to one question. Take Chris “Juicer” he contacted the owner and he got the answer for another order from the US. If he would have come to me directly I would have gone to the production and shipping departments to get the answer for him. He would have got one answer and not two answers. As I am the project coordinator the Owner has no idea of where the orders are coming from via X5 or another forum. To be fair to us and the members of X5 and no I am not trying to pass the buck….since I am the coordinator and I started this project and have been dealing with your PM’s and emails would it not make sense to come to me directly as I know who and where to go for answers?.......

HELLO, I am right here. I have to disagree with most of your comments and I believe them to be unfair and some what misleading. Yes this is a rather larger company as we do many systems for different vehicles. As far as CS goes anyone that came directly to me got an answer for THIS project Drod was the only one that emailed me or called me. I believe I have been very good with CS and those that pm'ed or email me got a response as soon as I could. If there is any warranty issues again CONTACT ME DIRECTLY.....I will look after you guys as I have to this point.

As this was a "group buy" I got the information out X5 world we took orders for about 2 weeks then did our production run...there was a hold up with some hardware that took some time but all is good and your orders are out.

We took order up to and were supposed to started our production run on April 21 2008(As I mentioned to Denalio in a PM) but we extended it by a week (but were manufacturing the ordered systems) as I was still getting orders. We started production for this "group buy" not individual orders....there is a big difference and If I did not make that clear then its my fault and I apologize. Production was completed on May 2nd 2008. We learned that the hardware was going to be late so shipping was held up. Now that the hardware is in and all ordered system are complete and shipped you all should have by weeks end depending on your location.....take longer to get to Australia....sorry Juicer.

What the main difference is that this was a "group buy" and for guys Like Drod that paid the next day his order takes longer to get to him as we set a deadline for your order to make production easier and keep the cost down.

I hope I was able to answer your questions for those of you that ordered our systems and for those of you that did not order but still find a need to complain on behalf of others please be fair and take all factors into consideration…….

Brent

Well may be you should be checking daily, given the track record of this company and after all you are the PM.

I don't think this is an issue between X5world and Stebro, this is an issue with Stebro and the customer. X5world is just the portal for initial comunication it is the responsibility of the vendor to take care of the customer not X5world's or it's members.

What's a guy to do he called the Company that took his order? This is the normal procedure. There is even a Customer Service number listed on the website. So the PM is the only person that knows what's going on? The owner does not even know what the heck is happening and doesn't even know his own company system.

That's right ultimately the responsibility of communication lies with you. I believe Stebro has been doing this long enough to get thier #$%@ together and fix the problem, period. And no that would not make sense why can't anyone else take care of this problem. Now you want the customer to do your work for you? Now your putting the blame back on the customer.... give me a break!

Juicer, cancel the credit order and take your business elsewhere no need to put up with patronizing BS.

Maybe I am out there on this issue, this is just my opinion. We will wait, see and hear from the member's feedback. Perhaps something will change the perception.

Rob,
I am sure you're trying. It's just to bad the rest of the gang is not stepping up to your sevice level and expectations. Hopefully your example will rub off on the rest. it's nothing personal against you.

Bottom line is that Stebro appears to be a very unorganized company, large or small. I wouldn't put my money down on a company that was using me as a guinea pig to break in their customer service protocol. There are too many established, smooth running exhaust companies that offer equal or better service and products to waste my time with Stebro.
It sounds like Brent is making an effort, but it may be too little too late and it sounds like they need to get everyone on the same page over there or I don't see how they can stay in business competing against companies like Remus, Eisenmann, Borla, Super Sprint, Active, etc.

$2250 for an exhaust system? I could have my local shop build me a full custom setup with headers and even have left over money for a small turbo at that price! On my SS Camaro they built me a fully customr 304 Stainless system with x-over pipe no cats Borla XR-1 mufflers and 1 5/8 long tube headers for just over $1K

Where is all the cost? Materials, labor or markup?

Easy - its in PROFIT.... how hard it is to bend some steel in an oval and weld in a couple baffles?

Meh, not only is your product inferior to companies that I already named but so is your CS. Why are you guys keep bothering to order this?

Can somebody please get IND or Remus on here?:thumbup:

i can't speak on the rest of this group...but for all its worth my order was placed three weeks ago and i have been in constant communications with stebro ever since...(with no problems getting responses via phone calls or emails)

I have Brent's direct number and i've never had to leave a voicemail..

first and foremost, i am not on the stebro payroll nor am i a personal friend of anyone there...

i am simply another potential customer who has already gone back and forth with a few other manufacturers on trying to get a descent exhaust kit for my 08 X5.

I started off with exhaust tips and became an expert on what fits and doesn't fit...(to the point where i decided to go the full or semi-full exhaust kit route)

I have reached out to IND, Remus, ACS, Dinan, Hamann, and others who I believed were offering some very nice products for the X5.....

I have placed order with them and have been given tentative delivery dates...

Most, if not all of them had stories to tell when it came to actually delivering the final product.

seems like everyone in the world has an exhaust kit for the E70 (and i'm not talking about exhaust tips) but there seems to be a story behind mass producing them...

is it because it takes that long to design and produce an exhaust system for a model that's been out for over a year???

The new E70 design came out in 07 so of course i wouldn't expect anyone to have an exhaust system right away... but for 08 wouldn't one be ready by now??

some manufacturers (whose name will remain anonymous in order to eliminate any embarrassment) are still working through the design approval process just so they can start production... i"m told it could be a few months before the design team gets the approval from senior mgmgt.

i can't begin to tell you how many times i've heard this...

In the end i decided to give Stebro a try... who I believe will deliver this week...

we'll see what happens.... and i will post pics as soon as i get it as well as comments on fitment, sound, and quality..

i believe by year end you will see alot more products exhaust kit for the E70..

but today.... I consider most of them "vaporware"

i'll keep you posted...

drod, I thought you were originally going with a different exhaust. I forgot the name, but it started with a 'B' What happened with that test trial?

Exactly! Also, if you are not adding power by a different cam, forced induction, or N20 gains will be minimal. Most catback or even full cat-less systems only deliver 0-15 HP. I usually do exhaust for sound and looks, UNLESS I am going all out, like on my SS ( a low 10 sec 1/4 mile car) then that's a different story.

For the X5 if all you want is better sound and tips weld in a Borla or Corsa muffler and add some tips. Most of the restriction in exhaust systems is in the muffler anyway. Gains from smoother bends, and oval pipes are minimal, unless you are really moving more volume of exhaust due to other supporting mods!

I bet I could swap mufflers, add tips for a few hundred and match the gains of this $2K plus system :thumbup:

And I speak from experience, as I have modified my exhaust on EVERY vehicle I have ever owned. The most I have spent to date was on my '04 Yukon Denali, which had a B&B Triflow catback ($900) and that was overpriced! Luckily I got it for only $200 used :) In conjunction with an LS6 cam, Magnacharger running 10-11psi and custom tune it put over 450 HP to all 4 wheels. It needed more exhaust flow because of the blower and cam, the stock muffler was holding it back.

I don't believe this X5 mod is about the odd HP gain .. its about a better sound.. and looks ... over BMW's own..... lets see who trials Stebros products .. then offers their judgement with experience rather than guess work and then we can decide who knows best ?

To see who's best we would need other sponsors advertising their products here.
Bastuck is way up there in terms of prices and IND and REMUS aren't present neither.

I've yet to see anyone with their systems here in the US even though remus is dirt cheap and eisenmann is hand madeé

guys, these manufacturers do not currently have their products available..

IND, Bastuck are not yet ready...

most others offer tips only and no muffler or midpipe setup...so there is no sound or hp gains...(and i'm not stupid enough to spend that much on just tips!!)

i was about to do a test run on one of these exhaust systems but it was cancelled simply because they couldn't get design approval for production...

Remus is another candidate... similar in price and design... i have reached out to them and haven't gotten a reply yet.

drod,

Just slightly OT, you should have bought a 4.8i with all the trouble that you've gone to to improve yours :) I'm happy with the sound of my 4.8i. I could do with a HP boost but I'll wait for Dinan to supply that...

When I did contacted Remus 2 weeks ago when I did my post on here about eisenmann and remus they did have multiple units in stock.

Still got the email, remusexhaustshop.com .

Remus has an axle-back system available and I think SuperSprint has the entire system for the 4.8.

i almost purchased the 4.8...but the lousy mileage and realizing i could get the exact same options on the 3.0si lead me to my decision...

the sound of the stock 4.8 exhaust system was also a little boring..believe me i would have changed the exhaust on that too!!

at the end of the day it's not so much performance since we really don't get too many chances to take her to triple digit speeds...

i live in the city... and even the little opportunities i have to take her up north doesn't compare to Europe's autobahn...so who am i kidding??

the extra horses don't do anything for me...

at the end of the day we both look exactly the same but you'll be a whole second faster!!

almost 15K for one second... and poor gas mileage...i don't think so...

thanks man!!

I haven't spoken to them yet...

but i'm also considering Remus if things don't go right with Stebro...

they seem to be the only one out there with a real off the shelf model...

i do however prefer the design of the Stebro over Remus...

the Remus looks too much like the stock 4.8.

my gut feeling is that stebro will deliver a nice quality product!

I already have BMW scheduled for installation... (yes, they have no problems installing the stebro exhaust)

Order Update & CS
 

Hi All,
I ended up calling Canada last night and left a message for Dan at Stebro.
He called me back about an hour later.

He reconfirmed the order had been despatched and was able to provide a deleivery date of this Friday for me (3 days time). He was apologetic that there had been come communications not responded to promptly.

I am understanding and patient of most companies, I dont expect immediate feedback/responses, however, I was getting nervous as many of us have nod dealt with Stebro before.

I am happy to be receiving the exhaust system this week and will let you all know when it arrives and what condition its in. I will book the install for next week and get video and written report ready for you.

All going well - many of you may wish to progress with confidence once Im done.

:D

looks like you and me pal!!

we'll compare notes!

for sure!!!;)

well Friday passed and no delivery!
I contacted a couple of people at Stebro, both apologetic and helpful, but at the end of the day, I still dont have the product I paid for a month ago.

I did get a tracking number however.
Curiously, the date I ordered quickly because as per their email to me:
"I have a shipment leaving for Australia later this week. I can attach it to the shipment at a reduced cost....." was 18/4/08.

Checking the tracking date it left Canada 13/5/08 "expedite"
So i don't think the product was shipped for nearly a month!!
I was told in recent communications that there was a delay in a particular part - but I have not been informed prior.

I now have a rescheduled delivery date of 22/5/08 - just in time for me to be away on holidays, GREAT!!!!! I am so pissed off I cant tell you.

Anyway, I hope t tell you some "good" news when A) the product finally arrives and B) it is the product they promised and C) whether it lives up to their claims.

Grrrrrrr.

Hey Drod, did you receive anything
My UPS tracking tells me the package is in-transit, I might receive it this week, even in the next couple of days

nothing yet... i was told this weekend but now they say it may be mon or tues.. i have tracking number but can't seem to get any info with it... not sure why...

juicer.....how did you track it??? was the carrier schenker?? what web site??

IT ARRIVED!!!!
 

The exhuast system arrived today.
Packaged well and seems to have been handled well by UPS
I am booked in tomorrow AM for fitment, so will advise tomorrow afternoon the results.

The system is being fitted by the most reputable company in this space, based in Sydney, they do all of Lambo, Maserati and Ferrari Sydneys work.

they have said they will advise on the quality of the stock and provide additional feedback that they think may help anyone when decideding on this product.

they sent mine by UPS, so i tracked it on the UPS website

If you can confirm who they sent it with, you can track on the couriers website, unless they dont providethat service.

IMPORTANT NOTICE
 

Guys, these exhausts are NOT mandrel bent, they are pipe bent and really rough looking. The welding is also very very rough, not a polished product at all.

When I opened the package I was shocked to be honest.

I have the exhuast being fitted THIS AFTERNOON, so will report on fitting/sound etc - and they have a Dyno, so will pay for the test.

More soon......

That sucks!. The Stebro guy said they are not typically mandrel bent in one of his earlier posts, but then later said they would be for this group buy. Hope you get it straightened out or get some of your money back.

Hi All, I thought you should all know what my experience and the end result has been with Stebro......following is an edited version of an email i have just sent them:

I received the system today, many thanks.
A month late, but well, it looks like your shipping dept didn’t send it until last week, when it was expedited. In any respect...
The packaging was great, got the unit here in one piece, safe and secure.

Unwrapping the system I noticed that it was pipe bent, not mandrel as promised, and with the old magnet check, noticed that the box was 304 stainless, but that’s it, again not what was promised. I will also add that the welds and general finish of the product is probably the worst I have seen in my many years and a dozen odd vehicles. I think you need to attend to this.

I thought, well, I have gone this far, I might as well go for the install as well.
I was lucky enough to be able to get this installed this afternoon and it was funny seeing my old X5 up on the jack next to a Ferrari and a Lambo.

Once completed, and an awesome job from the installers, we dropped the vehicle down for an inspection/listen.
On start up, almost no difference, in fact I struggled to hear the exhaust.
However running the car up to 4-5k revs, we could tell the difference.
Better yet, we took her for a spin around the block and she sounded great. Not exactly the note I was hoping to achieve, it doesn’t have the deep rumble that the V8 should have, but also have an X5 4.8is to compare it against. And that’s the sound I was hoping for.

In summary, I am reasonably happy with the sound of the exhaust, very disappointed with the quality (not as promised) and the general customer service experience/delays/misguided info etc was very poor.
I only comment on this as I know dozens of guys are wanting to know how this whole experience wet for me and I am going to be honest with them.

I have committed to installing a new system next week, which will be the quality I am seeking and may even be a closer “note” to what I am after.
I don’t know where this exhaust will end up at that time, but if you have another person in Australia, preferably Sydney, wanting a system, they can have mine at a very low rate. I know you guys stated we would be very happy with the product or money back, but given my experience to date I don’t think I would have any chance of getting any of my money back.

I wish you all the best and hope this feedback goes someway to helping your business and products develop.

:worthless:

So are you saying that the pipes are actually 409 stainless?
Which setup are you putting on next? Eisenmann? If avail, get the race version ;).

So sorry to hear about your experience :(. Thank you for taking the time to inform other members about it!!!!!!

Jiucer, Sorry to hear about your conclusions. Send it back! you didn't get what you paid for or was promised! Sounds like Stebro totally dropped the ball on this one. The welds, well that is just plain unacceptable. Also, thanks for the quick write up we shall see how many members here will bail out of their deals.

i just received mine today.... and on my way home to check it out!

I did get a call from Stebro though.....(in fact, they've been in constant communications with me since day one so customer service has not been a problem for me...)

they did say they sent me the wrong one... and offered to have it replaced with the 304 full stainless kit... (just not sure how long that would take)

i'm told the only part that is 409 (and that section is clear coated for additional rust protection) is the pipe arms itself... the muffler is 304 stainless and the tips are chrome... and the pipes are not mandrel bent.

i'm going home now to look at it and will take pics for you guys...

we'll see what happens...

It sounds like Stebro didn't follow through with their promise. I am not surprised, given their track record on other forums.

I would send the muffler back, at their expense. If they choose not to pay for the shipping, I would then have your CC dispute the charges since they didn't deliver what was promised.

Sorry you guys had to find out the hard way. I would give the hell, especially since they promised a product and delivered something half assed that a local Midas can build.

I'm glad they kept up the communicatiosn with you - I had to chase them every step of the way, although they were apologetic etc - but still had a very poor experience throughout.

Looks like they shipped really late, but no-one told me, had they communciated with me, I wouldnt have cared so much, at least I would have known what was going on. I am compassionate to companioes growing/expanding etc - but failure to communicate is a significant flaw and in this case there were major issues at Stebro's end. Brent to his credit tried hard to get things clarified for me, but ultimately it was Dan that provided the answers for me when I needed them.

The biggest issue is the quality of the product and what was supplied is NOT what was promised. For US and Canada customers, its easy enough to return/ship another, but here in Australia, I dont think they will be rushing me out another system with the right spec as they promised. So I really only had one chance of getting this right.

I will take some pics this weekend for you, bit hard right now during the week, dark when I leave for work and dark when I return. :)

I am considering a number of systems including the Eisenmann race and a custom system available here in OZ by the guys that do the Ferrari, Lambo and Maserati systems. I am going to the fatory in a couple of weeks. These are the guys: http://www.millemiglia.com.au/home.php they have an awesome reputation locally and service the major car companies in the city - always have big $$$ cars in there.

The quality of their product is unbeleiveable and their attitude is awesome - its all about quality!!!

Will keep you posted - if it works out for me, I will ask if they are prepared to offer a special deal for everyone here.

More soon..........

go cry... and do me a favor while "X5E70" is looking for that statement you made, how about you find me a post of your fantabulous exhaust being shown by a proud xoutpost.com member :stickpoke
:flame: do you need some ice for that burn.:bustingup

MESSAGE TO ALL THAT ORDERED AND DID NOT GET WHAT I PROMISED.

Please contact me at [email protected] as you are all now aware the systems were not mandrel bent and the pipes were 409.....

WE WILL EXHCHANGE YOUR PURCHASE FOR WHAT I PROMISED. AGAIN PLEASE CONTACT ME FOR AN EXCHANGE.

From my personal point of view there is no excuse for this error. I won't sugar coat this in any way this was our fault and we intend to make good on our promise.

-Brent

:lol:

We can't say we did not warn these guys.

Reputated brands FTW

At least I care enough to try and make this right.....

Do you really have a choice...?

Are you inferring "I" should go cry - or Stebro?

FYI X5E70 I have installed many name brands in the past, and those experiences have ot always been sweet and easy either.
Based on the information available I made a decision to give Stebro a go.

I must say that had the product arrived promptly and had it been made as they promised, I would be resonably happy. Just a shame they have had a number of issues and I am stuck down here in OZ.

I ope my comments and experience help those in the USA and hopefully when some of the systems are changed, positive posts will be made. Frankly, I thought they would offer to credit me for the system of at least a large % to make up for sending the wrng product and many weeks of inconvienience. The fact that they didnt means my business goes elsewhere now and into the future - as do my referrals and recomendations.

I did offer you the choice of either refund or an exchange. All systems that were sold here will be exhanged.

Brent

Exchange - Im not sure I have the confidence that the right product would be delivered, nor prepared to wait such a long time again - and sending the existing system back is costly and timely to repackage. Ive been inconvienienced enough.

Refund - As above. I think Stebro should be refunding a % of the cost of the unit as compensation and good will. I paid more than the agreed price and did not get the right product. Why doesnt Stebro extend a refund for a % of the system which help offset the loss for reselling to someone else locally?

I await your final response and offer

Kind Regards

Chris

Paid more than the agreed price?

why would i tell you to go cry. lol. im talking to Stebro PSD:cool:

yup, the price i was quoted was by someone different than Dan, and it was quite a bit more. As i was in a rush due to a shipment "leaving in a couple of days for Oz" i rushed it through without checking.
my fault of course, but is the principal of the matter

FOOTNOTE TO STEBRO EXPERIENCE
 

Guys,
I will add - whilst I have paid more than I should, it took time to get the system (being in Oz doesn't help), the system quality (stainless and welds) not being what it should be - there is a small upside to this whole Stebro exhaust experience.

It has been commented to me by a number of people now that they love the sound of the car. I am not tonally enamored, but the response has been 100% positive from everyone that have heard it.

So - if you can get the stainless product and want a good sounding system and what ultimately seems like a good price in the USA, i would suggest looking at Stebro. They seem to be getting their act together with Customer Service etc.

I am still going to be installing a few other systems in the next couple of weeks and will post videos/pics for each unit installed - so perhaps if your considering an exhaust system, wait a couple of weeks and I'll post some content for you to consider - I'll do my best to let you know in detail about each system.

Cheers

juicer

Juicer

I looked into what you paid and it was higher as shipping is alot more to get it to you BUT you did pay more than you should have. Dan did not know you were one of the X5 guys but thought you just ordered it on line via ebay and then contact him directly....either way again that is on us...pm me what you think is fair refund as you mentioned you dont want to ship it back.....We will refund a % and will work it out......PLEASE EMAIL me or I will see you on MSN......

Again if ther are any others that purchased a system through this forum please email me at [email protected] and I will take care of you. We will be doing a second production run in 2 weeks...this time it will be done the way it should have been in the first place......

Drod can be your testing platform......as he opted for a new system...thanks again Drod for letting us make this right....

-Brent

Has anyone had a successful delivery and install in the US as yet?
Does anyone in OZ want this system?

Stebro have offered a refund and I am awaiting confirmation of same as we speak. Will keep you posted.

Do we know how many systems ended up getting ordered due to their offer on this forum?

Photos of Stebro Exhaust Added
 

Hi All

NB -IF YOU WOULD LIKE LARGE VERSIONS OF THESE FILES, LET ME KNOW


This exhaust comes off this week, i have 3 new systems to install and try - all with the blessing of the installer and suppliers - no arguments if its not right.

So, in case you are interested, here are some images for you to review/comment on :dunno: - i will shoot some video now, but wont get it up on the site for another few days

Sorry, its been raining and couldn't lay on the ground :(

REAR VIEW OF QUAD PIPES
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/2...3353ed6.th.jpg

REAR QUARTER VIEW
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/1...3354rh9.th.jpg

CLOSE UP OF PIPES
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/9...3355zg1.th.jpg

CLOSE UP OF WELDS & DISCOLOURATION OF PIPES AFTER 1 WEEK
http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/7...3356mt7.th.jpg

SHOT DOWN THE GUTS - notice rough edges on box from welds
http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/8...3358qs1.th.jpg

CLOSE UP OF PIVOT ARM WELDS
http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/4...3359qz0.th.jpg

CLOSE UP OF BOX, WELDS & PIPES,
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/1...3360cy6.th.jpg

Over to you guys for comments - but this isnt what I thought I was buying!
Stero have offered a refund of some kind - i suggested 100% due to the ongoing issues. I have had updates, but no firm reply as yet.
Brent seems to be doing the best he can with senior management - so I guess its over to them to make a decision on how they compensate me for whats happened and what to do with this system.

Anyone else had any luck yet?

All I will say is that my Remus cat back system on my E53 looks better than that does after 6 years of use ;). Oh, and it cost me $800 at the time :). Thanks for the update Juicer, and keep us posted on not only your refund, but also the new contestants! Bigger pictures would definitely be appreciated. You have been extremely patient with Stebro, so hopefully they will take care of you. We all know that word of mouth on forums like this can make or break a supplier ;). Good Luck!

the kit i received from stebro is actually much better looking than the one you posted...

even the welds are neater on the unit i received...

but... i have decided not to take a chance on the 409 material and opted to wait for the 304 stainless that was originally promised...

i hope to receive it shortly and will definitely post pics and reviews!!

well, the end of the week came and went
i will wait till Monday then I'll set to work

Hi juicer. I'm another Aussie X5 owner (e70 4.8)... Please keep us up to date on the other brands you are trying.... Would you mind send me a PM to advise where you got the others, as I'm trying to find something as well ( I'm on the Gold Coast though... )

Cheers

Sure will, I have some pics to show already, but will have more on Mon/Tues so hope to put up a comprehensive post then

Stay tuned!!

PS - wanna buy a Stebro for $500?

Hi again... hmm very tempting... will wait and see how you go..... did you notice any power gain at all ?? or just the sound..... ??? :D

I'd like a bit more grunt, but also want a better sound.... standard system sounds like a dog trapped under a wet blanket...... could be SO MUCH BETTER........

sound is great and everyone comments
turns heads too
cost me over $2500 !!!

Juicer,

I just got back in town at 3am on Friday June 6 2008. I will be at the shop today as i was in Montreal doing R&D work. For you we will refund you a % of the sale price. As for Murray as he did not receive his system we will refund him 100%. Unfortunately you are in a different situation and won't return the system thus we have offered a partial refund. If all goes well the refunds will go out today or by mid week next week (our time, as you are a day and a bit ahead of us)

OK, will think about it... pretty keen I must say.... why don't you want to keep it ?? What other brands are you trying.... ?

Cheers

i look forward to you letting me know what the refund will be
Given you overcharged me, youve wasted my time and Im offering the system for $500 locally (all ist worth) I expect you will consider these issues before contacting me.

The alternative is that you find a representative locally for me to drop the system too and they will package and return to you - i dont see why i should be inconvenienced further.

:iagree:

Well thats been over 10 Days since I asked Stebro for my money back, and they still havn't sent me it :angryfire I never received a system as I cancelled the order before they sent me one. This is ridiculous !! It only takes a few mouse clicks to put the money in my account for gods sake !! I'm getting really annoyed now

That's horrible to hear. I be pissed as well. However, you have to give them some time to make up a good excuse!!:wtf:

Stebro better get their act together, they are starting to get a really bad reputation here, as well as other forums and communities
Hopefully they will do the right thing this week

Correct me if I am wrong but may I ask why spend so much money for stainless steel exhaust when you can have Eisenmann exhaust for same or less price.

Based on hollow promises I suppose, but this is the way I will probably end up going. Have a great system on the car at the moment which was custom built by the guys who do Lambo/Ferrari locally here - same sort of money - but proven and awesomely finished product

Bottom line here - is Stebro approached all of us and now they seem to have fallen on false promises

Its a lot more serious than that !.. I've received no product, but they are holding my cash and wont return it, despite my various emails asking for it

Muz, my brother in law is a lawyer here and has been kept in the loop. I am preparing to take action against Stebro and the bank has been notified of the charges they made which will now be followed through.

If anyone would like advice or assist in a group action against Stebro to retrieve funds, please PM me and I will assist with information as I can.

I have a very good friend who is a lawyer in Saskatchewan as I think a Canadian representative would be more appropriate,(but thanks for the offer) I also have some very close friends in Ontario its self, one of whom is a very experienced and professional engineer, who would only be too happy to do some poking about if I asked him.

Lets hope it doesnt come to this though, frankly.. this kind of conversation should not even exist.

This is their address

STEBRO PSD LTD.
6939 MCKEOWN DRIVE
GREELY ONTARIO
K4P1A2

I'm sorry to hear of your troubles. I'm hopeful that you guys can come to a solution, which at this point is a full refund of your money.

My suggestion is that you all start a new thread that warns others about Stebro and their poor quality and awful customer service. Many people are not willing to follow this thread far enough to see the problems. Also, if anyone does a search under exhaust or Stebro, they will see the complaint thread.

Good luck to you guys!

I don't think it needs another thread. The complaints and the issues have, unfortunately, been very clear.

Initially, it really seemed like Stebro was trying to change their ways and I was sympathetic to their efforts. Based on what we've seen recently about the inferior quality shipments and the difficulty that some are having getting refunds, I don't see how Stebro can make any more excuses (that might be believable).

There are several members here from Ontario, I am sure some may offer help.

Dan and I had a meeting earlier this week and and refunds will be sent out on Friday June 13 2008. As you all know I am rarley in the office so let me know via EMAIL [email protected] if this does not take place.

Brent

Juicer,

when are you going to advise how you have gone with your other exhausts ??

I visited the stebro website to hear to exhaust.... does yours sound as good as that ?? ( i mean the setbro unit ) Whilst the unit does not look pretty, is there anything wrong with it ?? ( seriously considering buying from you.... but dont want to have issues after two months....... )

Cheers
scott

i shot some video, so i will encode it and upload this weekend for you
anything up on a jack and pointed at a mic will sound good :)
But yes, the system sounds good, lots of comments on it
stay tuned.....

Give me a break .. what kind of customer service is that ? You were the guy that hawked your products on this forum !!.. so you should be fighting for your companies approval with us !!.. not us trying to get some service from you !

Seriously. How hard is it to find a computer these days and log on to X5World to see what is going on???? A really good customer service person would do that. Especially if they knew that there were issues of this magnitude and the companies already poor reputation was being brought down even further. Give me a break. I was out of the office doesn't really cut it at this point. It is very obvious they don't have things organized over there at Stebro.

Guess what Brent ?

NO MONEY !!!

So I mailed you !!

NOW DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT !!

I had an email from Dan saying I would have a refund by the end of "next" week. Lets see if they can meet their agreement then, although I am at a lost as to why they cant do a transfer overnight for those that are entitled to a refund. Not great customer service is it?

I think Brent is doing what he can, but get in touch with Dan, he seems to be owner/senior mgmt.

Wire transfer that's how real companies do it!! What's the problem?? Obviously customer service come last with this bunch!!

But they said this last week .. oh it will be next week. Thats not good enough.

Stebro is hanging on to my cash, and I want it back. They dont seem to feel any urgency about returning it.

I think the forum admins could correct the topic-starting message and link to these experiences here. I started to read the topic and almost decided to order. Good thing I've opened the last pages before sending the money.

What a sad experience...

Hey Juicer,

How goes the testing of other brands ?? pics ? info ???

Cheers

Well guys, I have sent a final request to Stebro to meet Dan and Brents commitment to refund my money by the end of this week. Its now Thursday night and I haven't heard anything. Tomorrow is Friday and I have offered multiple ways for them to refund me.

Im really tired of this situation and chasing them, hopefully I will have a positive response tomorrow and they will live up to their promises.

I suppose they have done themselves no favors to date and now is the time for them to start remedying the situation.

I'll keep you posted and for all of those that have been PM'ing me - I will contact you directly on my situation.

Cheers

Chris

yeah, really happy with my new system, sorry about the delays, been a huge couple of weeks at work and we have been renovating the house, so its been manic.
i will really try and get some pics and vid up this sunday for you
sorry for the delay

Hi Juicer,

Thanks, and no probs.... had one of those weeks myself..... still interested in the stebro...

cheers

I sure hope this gets resolved soon, as it's been like a month since the promises of a refund for you. It only takes a minute to post a credit to a card. Hey, did you hear whether drod received the replacement of their full stainless system as promised, or is he still waiting as well? Love to see pics of your custom made system whenever you get the chance :). I'll be crossing my fingers for you, good luck!

and the saga continues...

Let me just go ahead and respond for Brent at this point. I think I have his standard canned comment down by now.

I have talked to Dan and refunds will be dispursed by the middle to end of next week. I have been out of the office lately, so please contact me via e-mail.

Brent

You guys have way more patience than I do. I would have reversed this charge on my card weeks ago. Stebro didn't deliver on ANY promises. Shipped late, not the quality they promised and now piss poor customer service. What a company.

Guess what everyone - Dan flicked me an email last night after "I" chased "them" again.
He said refunds will be paid "NEXT" week again
So thats 3 months since I ordered the system, 2 months to resolve and get it - almost a month of unfullfilled promises of a refund.
I stressed that it needs to be completed today (Friday) as they said last week it wuld be refunded last week.

If this does not happen today, then i think we have enough unhappy people for a class action and I have everything ready to go with my bank (who are aware) and Paypal (who are aware).

If the refund does not happen today I will also cut n paste all the comms from this company that came as MSN private messages and all the emails so you can see a true history of what has been said and how I have been treated.

There is no reason that I can see, nor they have provided, for a simle charge back on my credit card to occur. Its totally bizarre that they would allow their company to fall into disrepute on this forum and others - not to mention the wider marketplace. My fear is that they are already winding up.

To those on the ground in Canada that have provided valuable contacts, and offered to help, I may be contacting you tomorrow - so stay tuned.

I am so disapointed that they couldnt have rectified this situation earlier and feel for all of you caught up in this - imagine - if it all went smoothly, judging by the number of exhaust topics - these gys culd have sold significant numbers of product!

well...i just got a call from them yesterday...

i do still have the original unit they sent me.... (the non 304 stainless w/o mandrel bent tubing)

i'm told they just completed production of a few of their newer 304 mandrel units and it was being shipped today...(should arrive early next week)

apparently their sub-contractor screwed up on the mandrel bending process and they needed to fix it internally...

the mandrel bent tubing was cut in half and welded back in place because the bend was off..

i received a few pics on the new design and it looks really nice if you don't mind the welds in the middle of the tubes...

it's all stainless 304 and looks to appear as a good quality product.

I will post pics and comments when i do receive delivery...

Unfortunately there is only so much I can do and what I could do I did. I take your comments somewhat personal, I know I should not but it’s hard not to. I am just as upset as most of you and I would make the argument that in most cases I am more upset.
I do pride myself on doing the best job I can and when things like this happen it make the whole company look very bad to say the least.

The real shame here is these systems do sound great and they do last with very few exceptions. I have talked with some MG and Triumph owners that tell me the muffler that was put on in 1974 is still there with no issues. As I mentioned before I have a performance company that deals with Mitsubishi and because of the sound quality I would not go anywhere else….no one wants to hear the typical “import” fart can mufflers I am sure you can all agree. Side note my Lancer Ralliart (not the EVO) put down 262WHP with our turbo kit from the stock 138WHP…..sorry had to toss that in here…

What you guys don’t know is how many times I put my job on the line over this project in order to get some people to take notice of what is happening here……so now FINALLY after almost getting fired a few times Stebro has produced what I promised in the first place (with the exception of the welded outlet pipes as Drod mentioned the sub contractor crapped the bed) is it too late for most yes I personally be very hesitant……I am hoping with this new “way” of doing things I can salvage this group buy……I am looking into a way where I can hold your funds “in trust” until the product is shipped and you are satisfied with your purchase….Only way I can think is the funds go to a local Lawyer……let me know what you think……

For you guys that are going to ask me if I am insane save it…..this is for the guys who want the best sounding system on the market and the system I promised in the first place….and the way is should have been done from the start…as I said it NOW all 304 Stainless polished pipes, 304 Brushed for the can and chrome tips….here are a few pics of the latest production run

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...motive/023.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...motive/021.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...motive/027.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...motive/026.jpg

:rolleyes::thumbdown:wtf::band::blah:

:blah::blah::blah::blah::blah::blah::blah::blah::b lah::blah::blah::blah::blah::blah::blah::blah::bla h::blah:

Brent, I would give up mate. The reputation of Stebro has been shattered and whilst you have come out of this looking like a guy that tried to do the right thing, you still didnt as a result of the company you work for. Dan is a lier and a crook.

Not only here but across the community Stebros reputation is irrepairable, and your email comes across as desperate and try-hard. I would just walk away and focus on other things, you have made the situation worse for yourself.

I have so many PM's here from other people with bad experiences, including those of us promised refunds over and over again without a result. I will add that Dan has now stopped responding to my emails, so I have no faith your company will do anything to assist anyone.

Given the poor customer service, inferior manufacturing and delivery of non-areed/ordered parts to myself and others, we are now forced to take other actions to recover our money. I have already contacted the banks and someone on the ground in Ontario has been kind enough to take up the legal position for us.

I will also be posting a detailed summary of communications from Stebro (emails, MSN & PM's) on this forum and other communities to show the, frankly, bullshit, that Stebro spins to con people into a product, lies regarding shipping and the product and unfulfilled promises to refund or assist your customers when things go wrong.

Bottom line - stop posting on this forum and others - you will save yourself further embarrassment and hopefully as a community we can all be saved from the lies, deceit and financial loss that is endemic in Stebro.

PM sent,

I still have a job to do until told other wise and I am sure you can understand that. For the most part I agree with you.This has not been a good experience for me either but as mentioned I have a job to do. I know your pissed (and I personally would not be as patient as you) as I said in our private conversation and you have to agree I have gone beyond trying to help you and I think your a better person than to post private conversations on a public fourm. As I said in private I am prepared to help you....just do it the right way.

:rofl: :rtfm:

Practice what you preach!!! You have more than your share of opportunity. You should make this right with all people you ripped...then go away.

Thanks you Juicer for shedding the light on the situation for all the would be targets of the con.

I love these comments from those that don’t know what is going on behind the seen and what I have offered to do. That is between those who actually ordered a Stebro product and the shop/office. The whole story has not been told.

If I recall you bashed our product and then offered to buy it at a reduced rate??? What is that all about??? and my comment was why go through all the dramas just asked for a cheaper rate....if you don’t like the Stebro presence her don't read the posts......

Your are making this personal and there is no need to do this, I have done EVERYTHING in my power to get the powers to be off their asses and make this right.

Brent, I understand that "you" are trying to resolve this for all concerned.
But frankly, "you" are a face and voice for Stebro here - so don't get defensive when people voice their views and concerns directly at you.

I believe that posting the chain of events and all comms would indeed give everyone the "full picture" to which they can make up their own minds. I prefer to not waste my time and keep tings private, however if Stebro do not fulfill their written agreement with myself and others, I will indeed do so.

I received your PM and responded to the off topic issues as well.

Kind Regards

Chris

That's at outright Lie!!! Your recollection couldn't be further from the TRUTH. I did not ask for a reduced rate. As a matter of fact you contacted me asking me if I would be interested in buying a system at a substantial discount and give it a review. I declined because all of the negative feed back from other disatified and angry cutomers in other forums and reviews. So don't give me your crap. You come on to a public forum with your snake oil promises and can do. You did not deliver what you promised period. If you choose the public forum as a vehicle to market your product you should expect people to talk and exchange information, positive or negative.This is just another excuse for you to cry foul. Your actions speak for themselve. You have worn out your stay here as far as I am concerned. One up for X5 World's members for exposing another shark. Your busted, unfortunately it was at the expense of trusting Enthusiasts and for that I am sorry.


Here's the mesage:
E70 Exhaust
Hey,

I know there has been concern about the QC and CS in the past. I am willing, if you are seroius about getting a system, to sell it to you for (and one other X5 World member) for $1200.00 + shipping. Provided you give us an honest review. Let me know....

Brent

;owned; :fired: :tribe:

JUICER.

WHERE IS THE REST OF THE CONVERSATION??? I HAVE THE REST BUT WONT POST "PRAVATE" MESSAGES ON THE "PUBLIC" FORUM AS I RESPECT YOUR RIGHT TO PRIVACY AND EXPECT THE SAME FROM YOU......END OF DISCUSSION.....

YOUR RIGHT ABOUT ONE THING I DO EXPECT PEOPLE TO EXCHANGE INFORMATION AND I WILL BE THE FIRST TO SAY THAT STEBRO DID NOT COME THROUGH WITH WHAT I PROMISED THIS IS WHY I AM BUSTING MY ASS TO FIX THIS FOR THOSE THAT ACTUALLY PAID.....I PERSONALLY FEEL BAD ABOUT ALL OF THIS....I AM DOING MY BEST BEHIND THE THE SEEN TO MAKE IT RIGHT.....

Post it please. I would like to see it. You can't cause it does not exist !! Like I said this is a public forum and you are selling something. Stebro is making promises it can not keep and I am just letting members know what transpired during my encounter with Stebro. You acuse me of somenthing I did not do. I am just backing up my position with facts. Like I said in previous post I know you are trying this is a Stebro issue. It is too bad they will not allow you to fufill your committments and promises.

Sorry to hijack this thread juicer. Back to more important issues. I hope you get your money back.

WOW !! Handbags at dawn ladies......

Stebro, simple lesson to learn here, if the product is not up to scratch DO NOT ship it out the door.... as you know what will happen.... it's called the internet, and, word of mouth.....

I was tempted to buy one of your exhausts, until I saw this thread.... I don't really care, if you struggled to get the product out.... If you are positioning yourselves ( Setbro that is) as a high quality, high end, premium exhaust system, then why send crap out the door ?? Does Stebro have a Quality Control system in place ?? It could have saved an awful lot of pain and suffering for both sides of the equation.....

Just, my two cents, but, hey, what do I know ?? just a stupid customer...... NOT.....

I have never liked this product from the moment I saw the pictures. I paid for my ACS full system (remus) including the racing tailpipes for less than USD2500. Why bother trying on a system that none knows?

deetz, lets see some pics of your whip.

Can't post pics until end of July because these stuff are leaving United States on 7th July. They don't have stock in US for the ACS part and are currently being shipped out of Germany. While the wheels are ready end of this month and with 4th july holiday, it is only able to leave US on the monday 7th july. I will post pics by end of july or early august.

Sorry to go off topic. Good luck with your refund guys

I have been given a final assurance from Dan:
"It will be resolved to my satisfaction"
& from Brent
"Expect the refund to come through Mon/Tues your time"

We'll see what happens then

Hi everyone, I will post in more detail in a few details, but the good news is: Stebro refunded the agreed amount o my Paypal account today.

I beleive that they honestly do want to do thr gith thing my us all,and they have tried hard to communicate that they have created a great product for us - and I believe the early issues have been addressed and the quality with the systems is there.

i think this has been a HUGE learning experience for them and perhaps they were caught out with the initial positive response.

I have heard nothing but good things about Stebro from Porsche owners and I will add that the system when it was on my car was commented positively all the time.

I believe Stebro will work hard to remendy all the outstanding CS issues quickly and suggest you deal directly with them, as oppossed to group buys and ensure that you keep on top of shipping etc to get your system promptly.

It is great when your faith is restored in a supplier - but I will post in more detail later in the week with all experiences leading up to my current installed system.

Juicer I am sorry that this went the way it did. Thank you for your comments as I know from many meetings that the office/shop has been listening and do want to produce the best system out there. As you mentioned the sound quality is amazing but we fall short on customer service. After the last meeting it looks like there will be changes. As far as the systems go I know changes are on the way as Drod will be the first to get what was promised form day one. Next is to start using polished stainless for the can but if the customer likes the brushed look that will be available as well.........



Here is hoping.......

Stebro eventually refunded me last Monday, but the funds have still not cleared into my pay pal account :( .... And they only did this when I complained to PayPal that I was not getting the refund I was promised.

I was waiting until the funds cleared before posting, check you actually have the money Juicer :damn:

If they transfer Paypal to Paypal it should go through straight away
If they pay a cheque into Paypal, it may need time to clear.
I havent received cleared funds yet, but I did get a paypal receipt that the funds been transferred
I hope this goes smoothly for all concerned.

Hi All, the money came through to my Paypal account and I have receipted the funds. Took some time to get a refund and a lot of pushing, but eventually it happened.

Im not going to go back over old ground, I understand there are people here still having problems, so I wont say anything that prempts their comments.
Overall my experience was full of the poorest customer service, 2 month wait for the system, promised in 10 days and a poorly constructed product that was deleivered not to spec as promised.

If there had been a speedy remedy to the situation from Stebro, then I may have glossed over some customer service issues, however, it is obvious, that outside all the good intentions of people working at Stebro, they have significant sales/management/production/shipping issues endemic within the organisation.

This company is yet to realise that if their customers win, they cant lose.

My experience as a whole, has been unsavoury and I have experienced nothing like it before. It has unfortunately made me cautious towards other suppliers form now on.

The upside is that my installer and I worked through a few different systems (which I am yet to post on) and I really happy with the system I now have installed. Shame about Stebro exhaust which now hangs in my garage and awaits my eBay listing.

Customer Service 2/10 - i point for trying, 1 point for finally refunding

Quality of System 4/10 - not the materials promised

Sound of System 8/10 - people have been positive to the audio track, but not my taste - sounds deeper and throatier on the YouTube video

Quality of Packaging 9/10 - they packed it really well for shipping

Delivery Timeframe - 1/10 - 1 point because it finally got here

Juicer, glad you got your money back. What a pain in the ass and waste of time to deal with all of this.

Why is this company still a vendor on x5world?

:(

Okay.. Here is the deal for me

I ordered a product after reading Stebros promises on this forum. Quickly I realised that there could be trouble ahead due to Juicers posts et al.. I cancelled my order before Stebro sent me anything. That was on the 31st May.. I finally got my money back in my account today almost a month later. Promises Promises, I really thought I had lost my cash and lived in fear for a month that I had lost everything.

Selling on the Internet is something that can work well but its also something that .. if you dont get it right can be a total nightmare !

1 You dont know your supplier
2 You dont know what your going to get
3 you dont know if you going to get ripped off

4. You might deal with someone like Stebro

This experience has seriously dented my wish to buy over the internet, and I am very greatful for this forum to expose shoddy practice,. as exhibited by Stebro

Their customer service has been unforgiveable and I would strongly recommend anyone to consider very carefully before ordering from them.. unless you live next door to the shop. Thes guys are not an internet capable company .. Period

This post is not designed to malign their product, but it should certainly be held in some regard as to your potential dealings with them, Stebro hawked their products here for us to consider.. and this is my judgement from what I have seen, in the words of Ebay .. DONT DEAL

Had to happen
 

Well it had to happen. Sorry to open up old wounds BUT as of two weeks ago 3 of the 4 members of the Stebro production crew walked out. We have teamed up with a financial backer and are now doing making exhaust systems on our own........

I am now the production manager for X-Clusive Exhausts. For now untill we have the shop 100% operational we will be concentrating on headers....

I would like to make it very clear that we are no longer with Stebro. We got tired of the way business was conducted.....don't think I have to give examples.

PM for further details as this will be the last post under this ID.

Thanks again...

Brent