Backup camera. Anyone seen any improvement?
 

I know that there's been multiple threads on the poor backup camera on the X5. The most recent is here

I've had my E70 X5 for just over a year and the only problem is the light in passenger side visor flickering! BMW will fix that. Have really been pleasantly suprised by the quality of this SAV!

I decided to have BMW service review the backup camera. I told them it was blurry. They said that it might be fixed by software update. I'm taking the X5 in next week.

Just wondered if ANYONE had ever seen improvement in picture quality after taking it in for service? Also, what do the service advisors say when you complain about it?

Maybe we should take this to BMW to get them to do something about it? Not sure how we would do that apart from all of us, that have it, complaining about it. Haven't seen the BMW rep on this forum for a while now.

I agree we need to raise more of an issue with this. The years of complaining here (and we know that's the right term) has not done anything for us. When I took delivery, I asked my SA about it but he said no it should be fine, but of course we were indoors with good lighting. They don't admit to any problem whether they know it or not. If we raise enough of a red flag with this, maybe they will start recalling. I don't know if a software update can fix hardware issues. Just look at the poor resolution. This seems like a poor camera issue much like if you were to buy a $10 webcam as opposed to a $100 one.

What are our options? Petition to BMWNA with our signatures? Pointing them to every one of these threads?

Does anyone know if the camera works any better in newer models (X5, X6)?

Just to think of it, I have not complained to my SA about it but I will on my next service visit.

I agree, maybe we should all complaint as a group and see if we get any type of response.

As much as I have learned to live with the poor camera quality for over a year now, the fact still remains that we all paid a lot of money to drive a BMW and it's irritating to find out that my neighbors Honda Odyssey has a better camera resolution.

my wife has Honda Odyssey and the backup camera resolution and picture quality is way better than what I see in my X.

I am in favor of a petition. What is the best way to do it using the tools of this forum? I suggest we all put our last names and the last 5 numbers of our VIN and send it to BMW. Ideas? :popcorn:

i'm inn....

That would be interesting to know. Especially in the X6's --- with the rear visibility that they have, they need the backup camera even more...

my X5 will be delivered in February 2009 with the backup camera.
I also had one on my testdrive X5. I must say that the camera worked ok during the day (have not tested in darkness) but not as good as on my brother's Q7. Based on all the comments that I've read here, I'm considering installing an auxiliary 55w beam next to the retractable trailer hitch to improve night visibility.
This should be a pretty straightforward installation and I hope to be able to make it a discrete installation.:dunno:
Can this work?

i think that would look really really bad....

I'm sure BMWNA is reading, they know X5 owners hate their camera's. The company I work for (not an automobile manufacturer but a Fortune 500) watches the internet very closely for bad press and when there is, everyone involved in whatever it is that's being complained about has to explain. It's a huge pain in the ass but good things do come of it.

The question remains, why is BMW seemingly ignoring this problem? My guess is, fixing the camera is an admission of a problem and they are worried they'll be forced to fix everyone's camera. That still doesn't answer why they don't fix in with a new model year. Probably a multi year contract with the camera vendor or they just don't care.


Tim

How about this for a possible future fix....the new iDrive has a much higher resolution viewing screen...that should help with the backup camera.

I'm hoping so!!!!

But the problem is the camera itself, the high res display wouldn't make any difference. It's like buying a 1080p LCD, but using RCA cables.

The camera works great in my Lexus LS 460. I didn't order the navigation for two reasons on the X5. One, old I drive, two, everyone says it sucks. I just ordered park distance control and left off the tech package...

Craig

I suppose we could all do a letter writing campaign. If we can get as many people on this forum and on other forums to write BMW, it may be just enough to elicit a response.

it probably would, but hitting another car when backing up would look really bad also...
I will fool around with a test setup first...

common, 5 years ago this didnt even exist and you wherent crashing anyone...

anyways, maybe try using some cool white leds, that may work! like the ones under the door handles...

you've got a point there
excellent idea about the LED's though :thumbup:

please let us know if the extra lighting helps any... because if you put extra light to a bad webcam all it does is wash out an already bad picture. Curious to see if that would help this thing. Still, the resolution is damn poor.

Anyway, I found this to complain with... it allows you to specify that you are an actual owner, etc. so should take you more seriously. If anyone has any better methods, please state it.

http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Conte...ntactUsPS.aspx

I think I will have to try several setups to find a decent location with sufficient but not too much light
but as I've said before, the car is scheduled for delivery early February '09, so it will be a while before I can report anything...:dunno:

i have a thought. since this isn't a Greyhound Bus we are all driving here, how about we just ask for better rearview mirrors. the existing mirrors suffer from ground cleareance blind splots. honestly, back-up cameras? i'll skip the fag remarks as difficult as that may be at this moment. an even more beneficial option would be a proximity alert in the rear bumper. oddly enough my 9K pound F350 crew/long bed has yet to back into anything. and lo and behold no camera.

^ hmm what's really the difference between asking for a better rearview mirror and a better backup camera? Aren't we still complaining then?

To be honest, I think people just want something of value after paying for it... I don't know how many ways there is to say this - the thing simply does not deliver. And we have many to compare it to.

no my friend i wasn't complaining. i was calling ya'll fags for bitching about your inability to back the vehicle with confidence.

now, with that said i agree that the visibility to the rear of this vehicle leaves something to be desired. larger mirrors would in fact make the process easier.

and as for value, well i have never felt i am not getting my money's worth as i blister the highways and by-ways. but then again "rh my bro" i did opt for the 4.8. :cool:

i have a couple of suburbans that have thrashed rear parts about them. apparently the female species does not have the patience or skill to drive in reverse without colliding with something when driving such a large vehicle. haven't you ever wondered where that stereotype originated?

honestly bro, if you are so disillusioned with your BMW shouldn't you trade it for a Honda Odyssey?

Wow dude, going a little off the deep end aren't we? No need to call us names for wanting a feature of our car, which we paid money for, to work as advertised and as well as other manufacturers have been able to do.

God: Timmy, you can have either of the following choices. a 12 inch penis or a back-up camera and a 3 inch penis.

Timmy: I'll take the back-up camera as i see no use for the 12 inch penis and i could use the help with my daily driving application in this vehicle.

God: you are a fag Timmy.

i am sorry, but what does the rest of the world do without a back-up camera? the mere fact that upscale vehicles offer cameras as an option should be the first clue to the pretentious nature of the option.

the E70 is not an overly large vehicle. as a BMW owner, ya'll should realize that some of the over-engineering provided is unneccesary. once the driver commits to every technology gimmick offered they have lost the part of their soul that makes them a driver.

the solution is simple. the camera is a piece of shit. stop ordering it.

Is this for real? It owns a Ford pick-up truck LOL. Maybe he or she also thinks Nascar is greatest racing on Earth...:clueless:

You skimmed over the value part by saying you paid a lot for your 4.8. /Golfclap for you, but maybe people spend their extras on other things. Guess what? You paid for things you think are gimmicks too - why? You still miss the point of people wanting something for their money even if you, yourself, do not care. I've been driving an SUV since I was 17, which was 13 years ago and have never backed into anything. It's not about depending solely on the camera. It's about getting something you paid for. With the tech pkg, we got nav, pdc, and the camera - the camera being a nice peace-of-mind for when your children are outside playing and you don't have a desire to run them over. The pkg was an easy decision with the camera being sufficient in daytime, but it is 100% useless at night (broken record inserted), which is NOT the case for practically every other camera on the market. And this is why the complaints persist.

BTW, does anyone of adult age actually say "fag"? I don't understand why that would play a part in being able to back up without assistance anyway. It's supposed to be used to ensure nothing is there (which you admitted was a problem), not to watch while you're actually backing up. But wait, we can't even do that cause it sucks hard (adolescent language for ya).

Oh you're one of those. Ever wonder why things are improved? Because people don't stand for it. Excuse me for wanting the perfect vehicle for me (honestly, it would be).

Thanks though, for thread crapping, because we can show BMWNA how mature of a board we are - to take us seriously because we are - by showing them examples of threads like this. Brilliant work.

rh71,

Do not listen to him. It is not worth it replying to a person who has a 2 inch dick, but think that buying a F350 will increase its size. Grow up "bro". :thebird:

ouch. i have a vette too. talk about compensation issues. :rofl:

Very well said. People like him are not welcome here. Go drive your F350.

I also have not heard anyone use "fag" in a very long time... entertaining thread none the less...

Let's keep it civil, gentlemen...

It sure can increase the size if you tie it to the back of the 350 :rofl:

We all agree, at least those of us with the backup cameras, that it is total rubbish. Every other auto maker (German, Japanese and American) have great back up cameras (for years now). There is NO reason that BMW would even release the camera on the X5. BMW is neurotic with details (even making sure their wipers sound a certain way in the rain, and that all models have that specific "Teutonic thunk" when closing the doors), so I honestly cannot comprehend how this camera made it into a production vehicle. It is also unbelievable how BMW is not fixing this problem. Are these cameras necessary? Of course not, but we paid for them! If our Satellite radio, heated or cooled seats, auto close doors or Navigation didn't work, would we just say "Oh well", it's not necessary? Of course not, we would be at the dealer in a heartbeat demanding they be fixed. We buy a BMW, Mercedes, Audi...becasue we expect & demand more!

Now for the whole "fag" issue. Maybe I'm the only fag on this board, or at least the only one comfortable & proud being a gay man...but we wouldn't play around with the "N" word, and I take offense of this word being used as a joke. It's not funny, and it is very insensitive and immature. Grow up guys!

Well said. By the way, you're not the only gay man on this board, and I could not agree with you more. We may not agree on everything, but we must respect everyone.

Juan

Motor Trend, which is a magazine I do not like but was given a free subscription, has just done a review of SUVs that are new in the last year. Based on the X6 review, where the reviewer said "the backup camera is absolutely lousy", "Grainy, noisy, useless at night. The Japanese made better systems two generations ago.", it sounds like BMW hasn't improved the camera on the X6... :(

I'm still going to see what kind of response I'll get at my dealership next week.

Oh, and I cannot believe that there's always some bigoted troll that attempts to hijack these threads...

sorry about the "fag" remark. i did not mean any offense to persons of gay orientation. back before the hey-day of political correctness, the word was used more readily. albeit offensive even back then. i guess i should have just called the whining as wussie-esque.

as for my being a troll, well i do own an E70 & an E53 in addition to the oddly maligned F350. the ford is a stupendous vehicle when used as it should be, that being tow vehicle and work truck. talk about a stereotypical reaction to a percieved set of values and lifestyle. Nascar the greatest form of racing? wow, that was a reach.

i simply enjoy my 4.8 with minimal frills and gadgetry. i find it just as easy to walk around the vehicle to double check nothing is lying on the ground before i back out of the driveway. and PDC as an option is also kinda stupid in my opinion. that leaves the Nav, well there is Tom-Tom. so $3k later here we are.

was i out of line? maybe a little. did i mean what i said with just a touch of aggresive but joking ball busting in mind. of course.

i will always ask the question, "did you buy a BMW for the back-up camera or for the driving experience?" remember the E30 came to this country sans cup holder.

i am off to the track, in my F350 by the way. see you girls later. :D

Was that not clear by now? Both. Everything. If you just want all go and no show, you have your american cars as you've named. Hell, you have one in your name too. Didn't you love that plastic interior?

I guess being an american cowboy everything vroom vroom is the only way you can be a man, bro. Talk about stereotypes (hey you started it).

I do agree that the back-up camera is almost irrelevant, which is why I have not made a big issue of it. (I mean, what did we do before back-up camera? :dunno:) It's not a deal-breaker for me, and certainly not the reason I would (or would not) buy a car. I bought my X5 because of its handling and performance, its quality, and its diversity.

That being said, a back-up camera is not what I'd call new or leading-edge technology. The fact that a luxury SUV has such a shitty piece of equipment is inexcusable.

Can we end this argument, now? :)

Juan

Because of the holiday weekend, I decided not to write them until now (and even so they may have a slight backlog but whatever)... I urge you to do the same - speak your mind to them about this... or they'll keep putting this crap into production every year as it seems they are content with doing.

At the very least, I hope some 3rd-party manufacturer will see a need here if BMW decides not to do anything about it.

> The question remains, why is BMW seemingly ignoring this problem?

BMW often gets "married" to suppliers for some reason, often favoring suppliers close to them. On their motorcycles they had instruments with absymal reliability sourced from a German supplier. They continued to source these instruments from the German supplier for years, finally giving up and switching to a Japanese supplier for their instruments. Since then, their motorcycle instruments have be quite reliable.

But BMW seems to always give a strong preference to German suppliers, followed by EC suppliers, even if the quality is lower than alternatives from other parts of the World.

You could also get a couple of flush mount work lamps.
I believe these Hella Optilux lamps need you to drill a 25mm (1") hole mount. I suggest running fairly heavy wire (fused) from the battery and using a relay from the back up lamps to turn them on automatically.
There is nothing worse than bad lighting when backing up. It is what helps you avoid running over someone or ending up in a ditch.http://www.rallylights.com/detail.aspx?ID=4290

You can count me in for a petition, too!!!
Terrible and simply useless in a low light. Takes forever to turn on, too.
My previous car, Murano, had a rearview camera I now envy.
Shame on BMW's 65k car!

UPDATE: In short, they are not recognizing there's a problem. The phone representative that got back to me (after my reply to his canned response) indicated a few of them even drive the vehicle and don't see an issue. Essentially what we bought is all we're going to get and in their eyes we should not have chosen the camera if during the test drive we were not satisfied with it. Interesting idea from a company who produces great everything else. I have a hard time believing this person's statement about that represent the company's that the camera is perfectly acceptable but here we are. It is lost on them that nighttime produces zero picture - or they simply do not care.

There's nothing being done about it from what he can find.... no technical bulletins, etc. I linked him to about 10 threads (including this one, others at x5world, and bimmerfest) about the camera so I don't know what kind of splash that made but I am just 1 voice reaching out to them.

i'm good. despite the sting of Mr. RH71's recent denouncing of my cheap plastic american car interior bits. that hurt me deeply.

sheesh, one would think this was a P-car forum.:cool:

yippie ki-aye mother****** :bustingup

Hey, "bro" why don't you refrain yourself to post your hilarious comments if you do not have anything to add to this thread? Or maybe a better idea: go leave your comments in a Vette or F350 forum. You will find a lot of red necks like you there and may even find your other half. Good luck and piss off.

a mean spirited lot ya'll can be.

but seriously rh71 try this link. [email protected]

if you can get the CCA on your side, BMWNA might be more inclined to listen.

I actually applaud BMW for using parts that are made in their own country. If the USA would start building and using their own parts, then maybe the economy would not be so horrific. I've said it for years, that if the USA does not start maunufacturing parts and items, then the USA will just become a very upscale 2nd world economy. I'm not saying that everything Germany builds is great, but at least they try to keep their economy afloat. I think the USA should start building, so we can have items that proudly say Made in the USA, instead of importing everything that says Made in China. I like when I buy a German brand, and it says Made in Germany. I hate & resent when I buy an American brand, and I see Made in China. My 2 cents!!!

Not sure why Penguin and deutsch100 are assuming this poor camera part is made in Germany.

Anyway, I left my car at the dealership today to look into this "blurry, fuzzy, grainy, useless at night" backup camera. No surprise that they said that "the blur is normal after comparing to other X5's". Guess I'm going to have to follow up BMW NA and see if they're ever going to do something about this -- I think it's a safety hazard. I don't need the backup camera to protect my car from dings -- I've never had that issue.

I'm going to look into after market suppliers that might be interested in addressing this issue and producing a replacement camera. If anyone has any suggestions, please let me know. I'd also be interested to know if people think that it most likely the camera and not the wiring or the display. It seems like it would most likely be the camera -- which is what lynstermkiii said earlier.

See if you can get a camera from a Lexus LS 460. The camera on my Lexus is great day or night...

Craig

> Not sure why Penguin and deutsch100 are assuming this poor camera part is made in Germany.


Penguin is not assuming this, and did not say this. Penguin is assuming that they are, as in the past, "married" to a particular supplier for reasons other than quality, and are showing their typical stubbornness in not switching suppliers. I am providing some past behavior example where BMW stubbornly refused to fix a quality problem for what appears on the surface to be a reluctance to switch suppliers. I am guessing that the camera/system is sourced from some EC supplier, such as Phillips or Bosch, and would welcome any information which would confirm, or refute, this.

OK. Sorry, I could have worded that better. Didn't intend any slight.

The interesting thing is in the OEM catalogue there are two different cameras listed with different product codes and dates. The earlier ones listed from 2007 are no longer available. I don't know what the difference is between the two.

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...39&hg=66&fg=05

Anyone know how the backup cameras in other BMW's compare to the X5? If it's BMW in general, we have a much larger voice ready at our disposal. If it is only on the X5, then we have some contention to say that if it works on other BMW's, why not on the X5?

None in the X3, should be just X5 / X6. Other vehicles aren't tall enough in the rear to warrant them. Should head over to the X6 forums and ask how they like theirs. Nobody from the '09 vehicles confirmed the same cam quality but we can assume at this point.

Hi, Folks,

I'm a new poster with a 2009 X5. I'm not sure if my camera is improved over previous years. It's still pretty generally lousy at night, but there is on my X an automatic high beam function when backing up. It's hard to explain, but the first image when stationary is the dark grainy picture, but then in gear moving backward, the light and image will appear to brighten. Still pretty lousy, but better than the first, darker picture. Does that make any sense?

:welcome:

I understand what you're saying but have a question. Are you saying that it looks like the image quality improves? I know you said the light and image appear to brighten.

I haven't noticed this behavior, as per what you said, but I'm going to check that out.

The brightened image is less grainy. But in a way, the brightening effect also has the result of washing out detail. Still, it's a bit better than just the dark, grainy first image.

Is it just the effect of the reverse light coming on that you're referring to?

It could well be.

I'm almost certain my brother has a camera in his 7. I'll have to ask him about the quality.

I came to my conclusion after going to "build my own" of every model. I did notice the 7 has night vision (frontal), which I would gladly take as a backup camera replacement.. it's simple black and white but it shows obstacles perfectly it seems and that's all I care about. I'd take that over a grainy/no image 8-bit color camera any day. As if that had to be said.

So the "night vision" would be infra-red camera. Right?

Yup I think it's like FLIR in helicopters.

i am so, so, so sorry about this post but it is oddly ironic somehow. i just read in the latest MotorTrend that the 2009 Mustang GT has a back-up camera. :confused: no word on the camera's overall performance.:smokin:

So i have to live with it?
 

Just got my 2008 4.8 and noticed the poor quality of the rear cam and reading this thread which had discussion ended in 2008 indicates that i have to live with it! Is that true?:confused: