X5 and Range Rover pros & cons
 

So, now that I have been living with my new Full Size Range Rover HSE after selling the X5 4.8i, I have a pretty good evaluation of the pros and cons of each car. I think I am to the point, where I can almost say "I love my Range Rover".

For sure, the X5 handled better, was faster, braked quicker and was sportier.

Both the 4.8i and the RR drink gas like there's no tomorrow. When I got the RR, I never expected it to be economical with gas usage though. It is somewhat better than my 4.8i actually. The 4.8i was about 10mpg in the city, and about 15/16 on the highway. The RR is about 12-14city and 16-18 highway. Not bad, considering the RR weighs in at just under 7000lbs! Yeah, she's a big girl!!

The climate control is SO superior in the Range Rover, I don't even know where to begin. It is even, consistent, strong, whisper quiet, logical and just works. Just hit the "Auto" button, set the temperature(s)...and perfect A/C or heat. Vents are automatically distributed, even and basically perfect.

Although the E70 has some preset buttons, that can be assigned for the radio or Sirius...mine unprogrammed themselves or set new stations all the time (not a welcome feature). The Nav screen is also the radio screen in the Range Rover...and it's touch screen (same supplier as Lexus). Flawless, easy and to the point.

My biggest (daily) joy is the RR key. Unless you have Comfort Access on the E70, the key fob is a joke and annoying. Why must you insert the key fob, push a button to start the car, and then for turning off, push the button & then push the key fob to release. WHY? If you want a key chip, then make it like MBZ..insert the key, and turn it. 1 step. Period. The Range Rover has a thick (drop and waterproof up to 75 feet) fold out key (kinda old school) but it feels good in the hand!

While I always thought the new gear shift selector on the E70 was cool, I do find the traditional lever (like in the 3 Series, or the old X5) to be easier and practical. Never a problem in my 2 E70s, but the RR is easy too...and manual shifts "feel" more tactile and engaged.

I do miss my Auto tailgate feature on the 4.8i. The RR is not hard to open & close, but it was super easy in the X5.

Heated seats in the X5 are much better. The RR uses heat from the climate control pumped in. It's nice & dry, but it takes minutes & minutes to feel any warmth. Also, the X5 has more even heating in the seats. Not bad at all in the RR, and since I'm in Southern California...it only gets used a few weeks out of the year.

While the seating position is good in the X5, it is awesome in the RR. You sit so high, you can see everything. Side and front visibility is great, as the glass all around is expansive!

Ride comfort, oh Ride comfort. My X5 felt on many roads as if my fillings were going to bounce loose. The RR is smooth, soft (not spongy though), poised and so comfortable.

The transmission in my 4.8i was terrible. Rough, jerky, held gear to absurd RPMs and downshifted miserable. The 6 speed transmission in the RR is silky smooth, responsive and pretty perfect.

Most importantly, in the first 30 days of both my '07 and '08 E70 ownerships...I had many, many visits to the Service Dept (both minor and major). So far, the RR has been perfect. No warning lights, messages, faults, snafus, quirks, etc.. This is the best part of the new car :)

So, I know I wrote a lot...just thought some members might enjoy reading about the pros & cons first hand.

Congratulations on the new ride! It seems like you have found a keeper! :thumbup: Post some pics!

Thanks, what my car looks like!

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...erInterior.jpg

Range Rover looks like an awesome machine. From what I've heard, seems like they are also prone to being in the shop for various issues. I think its get what 'spins your wheels'. Other than that, with the auto sector hurting as it is, lets just hope Tata makes it through... supposedly, they are also running tight on cash (was in the news today) as they spent alot of money on the purchase of Jag & LR.

Yeah, I had a 2006 Range Rover Sport Supercharged...and it was a total nightmare. Bought it on a Saturday night, and it was in the shop on Monday (and Monday of the following week, and Wed the next week, and Friday the next week... :) :( From all the exhausting research I did before getting my new Full Size Range Rover (and talking to many owners)...2007+ has been actually excellent. Since the current model debuted im 2003, Land Rover has had plent of time to work out kinks, glitches and issues. So far, I am really impressed & happy. I hope Tata makes it, as I think they are a good fit for Land Rover-Jaguar. They understand British Culutre and Automobiles, and they have many times confirmed that they plan 100% to let LR-Jag carry on with business as usual. With 2 famed, historic & iconic companies, you don't take a chance messing with them. People who spend $60-120,000 for a car, will not accept some "Indian" British car.

Nice writeup on two great machines, very informative.

I, like some of my brethren sometimes sneek over the fence (to this forum) and amongst other issues have followed a few threads on the dissappointing back up camera on the E70.

So I guess my question is; How does the b/up camera compare on the RR and while I'm at at it how does it compare with tailgate / rear end rattles ?? as again I've read with astonishment that the E70's still have that inherent bloody rattle that I think every E53 ever built has got at some stage in its life ??

Before I bought my car, my main options were X5, Range Rover Supercharged, Cayenne Turbo S, and Lamborghini Murcielago LP640(Main choice before something changed my mind). All three had their PROs and CONs IMO but I found the X5 to be best.
IMO, Cayenne had the speed but nothing else, Range Rover had the looks but lacked the speed, and X5 had the looks and somewhat the speed. (I was considering the G-Power Supercharger at the time). I am happy although I will probably get the Range Rover Supercharged as well in the near future.

Thanks X Foomph! Funny username...trying phoenetically to say 5 in German? Fünf!! :) The backup camera is/was awful on the E70, I mean truly dreadful. I have a feeling it is the same supplier for Range Rover...although daytime clarity, colours and focus is about 25-40% better on my Range Rover, than on the E70. Nighttime camera usuage on the Rover, is about as bad as the E70. Both the Range Rover & E70 started offering the backup camera at about the same time, so that is why I think it is a shared part, and also when I start to drive away, the camera stays on for a while, just as in the E70. MBZ and Lexus turn off right away, once the gear is selected in D (and both MBZ & Lexus are crystal clear, day or night!). So, my camera is somewhat better in the Rover, but still subpar, IMO. NO rear rattles at all in the Range Rover!!! Knock on wood/Touch wood! We had 2 2004 X5s, and no rattles either. My '07 E70 rattled like crazy, but my '08 did not rattle at all. So far, my Range Rover feels so tight, solid, quiet..and the interior build quality is leaps & bounds above the E70 (which is by no means bad)!

You are comparing a 1st year model in an '07 e70 with an '04 e53 that had been through 5 years of bug fixes, being able to fix rattles, etc--same holds true with the RR that design has been around for ages. First year model runs always have issues. You do hear a lot about the bad camera quality on the e70--sounds like BMW needs to do some more R&D on that. The RR is not a good comparison to an e70 in my opinion--needs to be more compared with a Land Cruiser as they are not performance they are more for luxury and off-road capabilities. Like it was mentioned above LRs and RRs have bad reliability history.

Not for nothing but you're comparing and evaluating a full size RR vs. an E70? They are in 2 different class of SUV so comparing the 2 does not really do justice to both. I can understand comparing it to RR Sport.

Kind of like comparing an X5 vs X3 or ML vs GL and so on. Does not make sense.

I did say & point out that my '08 X5 DID NOT have any rear rattles. So eventhough I said my first year '07 had rattles, I did give BMW props for addressing it so quickly, although I know quite a few 2008 E70 owners, that still have rattle issues. I think the RR is a great comparison to the X5. The Land Cruiser is not a Lux SUV like the X5, ML, GL, Range Rover, LX, etc... Range Rover Reliability since 2007 has been excellent, and I've spoken with SO many '07/'08 Range Rover owners, and it seems like the E70 has more issues (warning lights, battery issues, transmission isssues, Climate problems). Yes, the Range Rover has been around "for ages" in automotive years, but the design and especially the interior is gorgeous!! :)

I had exactly the same options, and conclutions.... (except for the lambo):thumbup: :thumbup:

I think it is important to keep in mind that the current Range Rover was actually designed by BMW before they sold Land Rover to Ford. This is why some of the interior parts (seat controls, etc.) match some BMW parts.

:iagree: RR was basically a very capable off road dinosaur. Perhaps a luxury version of a Toyota Land Cruiser until BMW came along and brought it into the 21st century! The squared off modern boxy yet macho looking design was the work of BMW designers. The full size RR has many of the E53 X5's electronics and NAV system. Ford came along and built on that design with the RR Sport and S/C. I truly believe RR would not be what it is today if it wasn't for BMW! :thumbup: A lot of RR owners don't know that and some how think it is 'better' or more superior than the X5 in some way. I had the chance to buy a new RRS S/C that was almost $15K cheaper than the X5 and I still went with the 4.8i.

The Polish say they make the best vodka; The Russians say there's nothing better in the world than their vodka. What they don't know is that the Polish invented it and had been making vodka for years using potatoes! I guess it's what eversuits your fancy and makes you feel better about yourself! :D

Exactly, maybe you and the other Member, never saw my original post, when I got the Range Rover. Tons, and tons of parts are from the E53, and the last 7 Series...and that's why I wanted the Range Rover. I loved my 2 E53s very, very much. Both my '07 and '08 E70 were very unreliable and troublesome! I personally, do not like to buy used, and since there are no new E53 X5s available, a new Range Rover was the closest thing. I feel like I am in a super posh, BIG, E53. Also, as someone mentioned, the Navigation was BMW until 2006, and then Land Rover switched to touch screen, the same supplier as Lexus. It's super easy, and very intuitive!

Is that a 4.8is I see in your Avatar? If so, then I would take a 2004-2006 4.8is E53 any day over my Range Rover. I had a 2004 4.8is, and that car was amazing! I hold firm, that my Full Size Range Rover is better than the E70! I know, fire away!! :stickpoke

Thats alright man! Its your car and you have evry right to brag about it!:thumbup: If you like it then its all good!;)

The RR HSE is a beautful vehicle, not doubt and a nice drive. But you need to have alot of dough to throw away as resale value is the poorest in the segment.

A frend of mine has two because he loves them so much. One sits at home, only to be used when the newer one goes in for repair - which is every two weeks to try and fix a problem that the dealer said he fixed last time.

Maybe X5's have problems too, but I want to drive my vehicle somewhere other than the dealership for a repeat repair.

I hope your experience is better than my friend's.

:) It sounds like your friend's experience with his Range Rover(s) was just like my experience with my '07 X5 3.0si and my '08 X5 4.8i and our 2007 750Li and my 2006 330i! Honestly out of the 25+ cars my spouse and I have had in the last 15 years, my 2 E70s were the most problematic, troublesome cars I have ever had. Nonstop warning lights, failures, electronic freezes/glitches, malfunctioning transmission, multiple repair "attempts" for the same problem again & again. I'm not saying, nor do I believe, my new Range Rover HSE is perfect, nor do I believe it will never see a Service Dept. What I do know, is that so far in the 40+ days I've had the Range Rover, I've had NOT one warning lamp or message, no electronic glitches, no breakdowns, no rattles or anything else that seems "off". With both my E70s, the first month of ownership saw multiple WEEKS of Service Dept. visits (with most problems not being resolved). With my '07 E70, I drove a Dealership X3 3.0si longer than I was able to physically drive my own X5. Serious!! Yeah, Land Rover is not known for their flawless reliability, but since 2006, especially 2008-2009, Land Rover (especially The Range Rover) has had superb reliability. Yes, I agree that The Full Size Range Rover has horrible resale value. Oddly, their LR3 has pretty good retained value, but yeah the retained value on my Range Rover will be absolutely dreadful. Honestly, though, I buy and/or lease because I love the car, and don't worry about 2-4 years down the road. Life's kinda short, and not everything can be practical, and financially perfect ;)

Deutsch, I'm with you drive what you like and I'm glad you like LRs. But if you have had 25 cars in 15 years you are increasing the odds enormously of problems arising. That's like Russian roulette car buying. I bet you if you had even 25 Lexus (or is it Lexi ?) you would run into issues. It's just a numbers game at that point. I've had 2 cars in the past 15 years--I'm on year 8 on my e53 with no major issues. Congrats and glad you are happy. :thumbup:

Deutch100,
I find your comments truthful, very fair and to the point congrats on your choice of the car. I am still a big fan of Land rover & Range rover having driven just about every model they produced between 1965 and up to 2006, including driving Rangies in the military in England and Germany for many years. They truly are great vehicles to drive, glad that I didn't have to pay for the maintenance or parts though as we used to punish them with serious highway and off road driving. I hope you get the chance to put your range rover in to the situation that it was really built for, then you will really know what you have purchased. Well done and thanks for the writeup.

Bozz.

Thanks a lot Bozz!! Appreciate it! :thumbup:

Yeah BGM, had our small share of problematic Mercs and BMWs (and a horrible '06 Rover:( I still stand firm ground though, that the worst were my '07 and '08 E70s...although the '06 Range Rover Supercharged I had was a pretty big nightmare. I had 2 Lexi :) ...they were flawless, yet beyond boring (RX400h). It was basically like having a mattress on wheels. I'll take a problematic X5 or Range Rover any day over a perfect Lexus! My god, the Lexi were so boring! Here in L.A., you have to Love what you drive, because you spend A LOT of time in the car.

Like I wrote earlier, if you don't mind blowing the dough with no resale, then enjoy. haven't owned a BMW since 2004 (540iA) and that car was close to perfect while the earlier ones were problematic in one way or another. It seems that BMW does a fair bit of R&D at the ownership level, which is too bad. The current HSE has alot of british engineering in it, some BMW dna and a change to Ford and now Tata. With all of that bouncing around and lack of resources to continue to R&D the product and improve it, the Range Rover has little hope of seing major improvement as time goes on. BMW on the other hand is well positioned in the current environment and the E70 of today is much beter than it was a few years ago when it was re introduced. I don't see too many major complaints on this board compared o the Range Rover forums.

It's a great driver though, so if it doesn't spend too much time in the repair shop I'm sure you'll enjoy it!

Great review:thumbup: I actually have the opposite experience from yours, problems with RR and now happy with the 09 X5 4.8i, zero problem for 4 months, go figure.... :rofl:

I went the exact opposite way as well.

My 07 RR TDV8 Vogue SE (the top model in the UK) got stolen and I just replaced it with an E70 35d Msport.

Although the Rangie was cosie and comfortable, it feels dated to the 09 X5.
The touch screen, although a nice feature, is too far away for comfort and always covered in finger prints. The X5 feels technologically a lot more advanced. More importantly, everything works. Bluetooth paring, ipod connections, things like that just work so much better.
I am not sure how it is in the US, but here in the UK the dealerships and their service departments are amateuristic at best. At BMW everything is so much more professional.

Plusses and minusses:

The RR had more interior space and the ride was more comfortable. Off road the RR is far, far superiour.
On the downside, rear passengers in the RR were forever getting car sick from the body roll. The front seats are not that comfortable.

The BMW handles so much better, there is no comparison, especially with the adaptive drive option. The comfort seats are the best I have ever sat in. I had them on an E60 and they were the main reason for getting another bimmer (bad back). And it is a far prettier car.
On the down side, the runflats are way too loud and too expensive. The other big issue is the options list on the BM. On the rangie everything came as standard and therefor does not depreciate as badly. To get a decent spec X5 you need to fork out an extra 50% over base price (in the UK at least). The moment you drive off the forecourt the options depreciate to zero.

Just my 2 pence. Enjoy your car!

Yes, the E70 handles much, much better than the Range Rover. Yes, the RR is much, much more comfortable (in terms of ride comfort) than the E70. I find the touch screen to be the right distance for my arm length, and once a week or so, I just swipe the screen with a small microfiber cloth sitting in the glovebox...and shiny & smduge free! I find the touch screen much easier and simpler for radio, settings, navigation and satellite than the iDrive (the iDrive actaully annoyed the hell outta me!).

I do agree that BMW Service is generally better, although here it varies radically from dealer to dealer. Our 3 local Land Rover/Jaguar dealers are all very pleasant, offer delicious lattes and fresh baked goods, pay for and provide loaners (Landies and Jags if available), wash the car after every service visit...but they are not as good as BMW. I wouldn't say amateur, but a little outdated, and not top notch. I think it comes down to BMW having a HELL of a lot more money than LR/Jaguar.

I do apperciate that almost every item was just standard on the Range Rover. You can choose HSE or Supercharged and Luxury interior package...that's really about it. Navi, backup camera, heated seats, satellite radio, cooled seats, 6 disc changer, bi xenon, f&R park distance control, etc, etc, is ALL just standard on the Range Rover. It makes it SO much easier buying and locating the colour combo one wants!

Congrats on your '09 X5. The E70 is visually a stunning car!

I am debating on switching out my 07 3.0si for the new 2010 RR. It appears that the technology has improved dramatically in terms on navigation and incld. an aux ipod port. I rode around in my friends 09 RR this past weekend and was quite impressed with the ride comfort and interior room. There are certain dealerships now taking $20M off of MSRP. (RR in Chantilly, VA)

I am also debating between the new X5 M and 2010 RR SC. I might get both.

BTW, the $20k of MSRP will probably be for the 2008/9, and not 2010.

Yep. Only $20M off being offered on the 08 models as of last month. I suspect that the offer will soon apply to the 09 model.

Remaining new 2008 Full Size Range Rovers can be discounted up to $30k!! Not sure about the 2009. There is NO difference between 2008 & 2009, besides from one wheel choice (and the 2009 one looks ugly, cheap and too thin & spidery for the size of the RR).

2010 is/will be the same body, with some new engines and upgraded dash instruments. Very nice indeed for 2010. New engines and technology with Land Rover can be a scary combo though :)