Second thoughts on the Sport Activity Package - Need Opinions on these pictures
 

So I'm experiencing some hesitation on going with the Sport Activity Package instead of the Premium. I know it's only roughly a $1,800 difference and you get 20" rims, black headliner, and a cooler looking steering wheel (sport seats don't apply to me because I'm going with multi contour).

But one of the biggest positives is also a bit of a negative. I live in MN where 11 inch rear rims are not going to cut it in the winter. I roads stay plowed well but it doesn't seem wise to run an aftermarket rim with and winter tire combo that is 11 inches wide in the rear. I don't mind the look of the premium 19" rims and it is appealing to not have to spend another $2,000 on rims and tires and then have to switch them twice a year. I get it they are not the perfect snow tire but they're a lot better than an 11 inch wide rim with a snow tire on it. But the Oyster seats would look a lot nicer with a black headliner instead of light gray.

Thoughts, insights, opinions? I was deadset on the Sport Activity because I like the look of the 20" rims and the black headliner, just having second thoughts because I'm wondering if it's worth the hassle where I live.

Though I really like the look of these two.

http://i.ebayimg.com/05/!B5yEMdgBGk~..._id=8800005007
20" BMW X3 X5 X6 Matte Black Wheels Rims E70 E71 E53 - eBay (item 300539308283 end time Apr-20-11 09:52:10 PDT)


http://img.auctiva.com/imgdata/1/0/1...0815008_tp.jpg
20" BMW Type 215 Style Wheels Rims Fits Any X5 X6 - eBay (item 300441644142 end time Apr-24-11 10:45:39 PDT)



Another option is this aftermarket rim that is 20" x 9" with a winter tire. But it's hard to see how far in they sit as opposed to the 11 inch rims.
20" perf tires on snow? - XBimmers.com | BMW X6 Forum X5 Forum

Did some digging and apparently this is a 10" front and 10.5" rim in back with 275/40/20's all square. As you can see the tires are really stretched on the rim. This means that if I did the 20x9 version it would be considerably narrower looking.
http://www.xbimmers.com/forums/attac...1&d=1294270911
http://www.xbimmers.com/forums/attac...1&d=1294270911
http://www.xbimmers.com/forums/attac...1&d=1294270911



What really scares me is this look. This isn't ok with me since I'd need to have it on from December through March in MN.
http://www.xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-foru...18-set-up.html
http://www.xoutpost.com/attachments/...p-100_1829.jpg

I think you're doing it backwards, considering the steering wheel and headliner in determining which wheels to get.

IMO you should start from the premise that you need winter wheels, whether your summer wheels are 19" or 20". Buying an expensive fully optioned awd vehicle in a place that gets real winters, and running it on summer performance tires, just doesn't make sense.

If you don't like the look of fender flares with winter wheels, then perhaps that influences your decision whether or not to get the package that has fender flares.

Once you have the right size wheels on there for all 12 months of the year, the rest will fall in to place.

Well the stock 19" rims have all season tires as I'm sure you know. Granted that isn't as good as a dedicated snow tire, but MN is really good about plowing and I'm seldomly driving through deep snow. I've always had all season tires and been just fine.

The aftermarket rim look could work with a narrower tire/rim combo, but it's really tough to tell by those 20x9 fill out the wheel well. The real allure to this is getting to have the nice and wide summer tires during the 6-7 months out of the year where they could be used in MN.

Yes, I know. They aren't winter tires, and so for a third of the year your vehicle's performance will be seriously compromised.

It isn't about the depth of the snow, it is about the ambient air temperature.

We got the sport because my wife liked the black trim around the windows. Seriously.

I was dead set against the larger rims, so 19" square.

The aftermarket rims above seem so silly with the small and puny looking brakes/rotors. There is NO functional reason to upsize rims unless the rotors are upsized. Doing one without the other offends my sense of 'form and function'

GL

A

If the OP really likes/wants the 20s, get 'em...if not, get the 19s, imo.
But, as noted, a set of winter wheels with dedicated real winter snow tires, allows the expensive 'tech' one pays for in a new X car,
to show its best in winter driving, and provide for that inherent control capability.

I swapped a winter vs summer wheel/tire set for 5 seasons; it took longer to dig the 'other set' out of the basement and clean them up than it did to make the physical change over. Not hard work.

If I was dropping $70Gs+ on a car for use in real four seasons climate, a set of winter wheels & tires, regardless of how it makes the car 'look' for 3-4 months, would be the first thing I bought for it. My 50Cts.
GL, mD

Why not get the sport activity package and then pick up another set of wheels with winter tires. You'll need them.

So I think 335xray got the replica version of the stock rims that are just like these but in the regular finish. That should be a 9.5" rim up front and 10.5" rim in back. Then did 275/45/20 snow tires on all 4 rims. I know that will make the back tire appear a bit stretched on the rim but should help keep it from getting too wide. The pictures in his THREAD don't look too bad either (stretched or narrow in the back). I sent him a note to get feedback.

The black rims with Platinum Gray should look different and fun. That way I fill out the wheel wells almost as good as in stock trim, get to have the wide rims/tires in the summer and then have a better compound tire in the winter for around $2,000 extra.

I just realized my truck tire on the stock rims that I bought new winter tires for this year are 275/65/18. I believe that would make them the same width (275) as the tires 335xray used. Which means I shouldn't be too wide in the winter.

http://i.ebayimg.com/05/!B5yEMdgBGk~..._id=8800005007
20" BMW X3 X5 X6 Matte Black Wheels Rims E70 E71 E53 - eBay (item 300539308283 end time Apr-20-11 09:52:10 PDT)

HERE is someone who went with 275/45/20 (slightly larger overall diameter, but could be done with a 40) on 4 - 20x10 replica rims.

The upside is all 4 corners can be rotated vs side to side. Though doesn't look like he has the wheel lip arches. Anyone know how much further in those 20x10 non-staggered rims would sit in vs the 20x10.5 staggered rims would?

Looks like 335xray also has a second X5 that he did a non-staggered 20x10 X6m replica on with 275/40/20 rubber.

This might be an option too and would be nice because then I can rotate the rim/tires on all 4 corners.

Just not sure if the rims would fit my X5 though.

http://www.xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-foru...ire-setup.html

Dude, that's my X! I don't know if I should be offended :rofl: That's okay, my 214s are back on :thumbup:

As others have noted, you need a dedicated winter/rim set-up. Just spend the dough!!

BTW, if I'm not mistaken, the OEM 19" are 255/55, so your ass is actually going to look just as pathetic as that picture of mine you posted. I actually was getting use to the look with the 18s and it isn't that bad... You'll be thankful once the snow hits.

LOL, sorry Kief. So I do feel a bit bad about that. To each his own, just not exactly my cup of tea. I'm going to get the SA pkg now. Just going to figure out the winter setup now.

Just compiling a neater list of options which I'll do tonight with pictures. But it's basically (in no particular order)...

1. X6M replicas 20x10 with 275/40/20 winter rubber on all 4 corners
Questions -
a. Not sure how far out or in this will make the back tire/rim combo stick vs stock.
b. Not sure if the X6M replicas will fit a SA X5 (non M)

2. SA replicas in black (214 I think) 20x9.5 front and 20x10.5 in back with 275/40/20 winter rubber on all 4 corners
Questions -
a. Not sure how far out or in this will make the back tire/rim combo stick vs stock.
b. Not sure if 275/40 rubber on a 10.5 inch rear rim will be too stretched

3. X5 with web pattern in dark gray 20x10 front and 20x11 in back with 275/40/20 winter rubber front and 315/35/20 rubber in back
Questions -
a. Not sure if this would fit
b. I think 315 may be too wide for a winter setup

Why not try ordering your aftermarket winter wheels with lower offsets? The offsets in stock at a B&M tire/wheel store are higher in order to fit a wide range of cars/trucks. If you order the wheels with a lower offset, that will push them far more towards the fender and give you a more attractive look.

Looks should be the last thing you worry about for a winter tire setup. Narrow tires are better I think, less chance of hydroplaning on slush, and it cuts through the snow better.

I did factory 50i M Sport staggered 19s sizes for my winter tires, Pirelli Scorpion Ice & Snow. Yes even in Charlotte. It paid off for the 3 days of snow, plus the trip to WV.
Charlotte has more ice storms than snow storms. We had 1/2" of ice on top of 3 inches snow. I had to work to break traction even on the ice. Few people even dared driving that day but I felt I could go anywhere.

I believe they are 255/50 on 19x9 front and 285/45 on 19x10 rear. Plus the same look year around.

I am still debating which 20s to get. Until then I'll swap the tires on the factory rims.

Here are the pics after driving 1 day in bad weather in WV.

20" 214s with all-season rubber then. I do it fine here "never driving through deep snow" with 11" rears. Year round - that's the way I like it.

I run the X6M replicas in the winter with Pirelli Scorpion Ice & Snow tires. Staggered. You have to try VERY hard to get any loss of traction. I'm not saying 18 in thinner wheels/tires wouldn't do better, I'm just saying with OEM spec 20's and the Scorpions the truck was unstoppable through one of New England's worst winters in decades. That included several trips to northern Maine. Here's a pic of my setup...they come off this weekend though for the Summer tires on the 214s! I think I'm going to miss them...

That is funny that you would post. I was just reading your thread about these and said...hey I like the look of those rims.

How was it getting them to fit? I thought the X6M replicas didn't fit the regular X5s? Do you know how wide each rim is and the offsets? Any pictures from the back to see if the rim/tire combo sits further in from the fender than the stock 214s?

Not sure if I want to go 315 wide, might want to stick with 275 to have a slightly narrower/cheaper tire but then again 275 on an 11 inch or 10.5 rim might look too stretched.

Sitting in my local BMW dealer having the winter wheels removed and swapped with my summers. My rear winter setup are 265/40 -20 on 11" X6M reps and while they tuck a little bit unless you know whta you are looking for they are still very beefy.

The 20" have performed flawlessly for both my wife and I, so no regrets. I am glad I got staggered wheel sizes (9.5"/10.5" on wife and 10"/11" on mine) but that does preclude me from rotating them. I think the look is better than having 9.5" 275s in the rear with flares...and the benefit of the square setup from a deep snow/ice handling department outweights getting the staggered tires to match.

My 2 cents,
Mike

Duke

I think the X6M reps are one of the best looking rims for the X5, even better than my 333 style M-sport pack rims.

The 214s are timeless thought. Harder to clean too ;)

X

They fit perfectly. Same spec as the OEM 214s, except that the offset is 40 and 35 vs 40 and 37 (I think) on the OEMs. The OEM x6M wheels would have a different bore, but those are 21 in rims not 20s... From the side and rear I can't tell a difference from the 214s. You def. need the fender flares that come with the SA package though. I'll try to take some side/rear photos tonight before I taker them off for the season! see attached for the spec

I'm going to reach out to the contact you provided. Thank you for doing that! Yeah I think I'm between the X6M and black 214s now. I'm pretty sure I'll do a staggered setup and go with 315 in back if it's the X6M rims and then 275 square if its the black 214 rims since they are .5 inches narrower.

X6M reps:
Pro-
- Different design than summer set
- Look pretty darn cool
Con-
- Need to see if they'll fit my regular X5 without modification or adapters
- 275/40 tire will look a bit stretched in the back

214 in black reps:
Pro-
- black color may look really cool with platinum gray
- I know I like this design
- .5 inches narrower than X6M reps so the 275/40 tire will look less stretched
Con-
- Same design as my summer set

Staggered setup
Pro-
- Staggered fills the rear wheel well the best
Con-
- Cannot rotate tires if the winter tires are directional (not sure if they are). I'm looking at Blizzaks and then I think Pirellii (sp?) snow/ice. I have Blizzaks now but they seem to wear really fast if there isn't snow or ice on the roads.

Square setup
Pro-
- All 4 corners can be rotated
Con-
- Rear will sit in a bit (.5-1 inch depending on rim and actually more because of the offset) from the fender flare

Rear 275 vs 315 setup
Pro-
- 275 will be a smaller footprint in back and help with traction
- 315 will cover a X6M rim better
Con-
- 275 on X6M rim will have some tuck/stretch
- 315 is more expensive and a wider footprint which won't have as good of traction as a 275

PS. You guys all rock! I could not have done this without all your help. I would have probably given up and just gone with the Prem pkg and skipped the rims I really wanted. Now I'm confident I'm going to have an awesome looking setup winter and summer.


In un-related news, I'm taking the Shelby out of the bubble today for a short drive around town! They haven't cleaned the highways yet so I'm going to stay off them to avoid any big rock chips. The 60 degree day is just too hard to ignore.

Late to the thread and early in the day and waiting for coffee, so I may be missing something here.... but have you considered,

Ordering the vehicle with the OEM summer wheels/tires that you find aesthetically pleasing,
Purchasing OEM winter wheels/tires that function,
Designing and purchasing tailored fitment spacers or from the H&R range of offerings and have similar wheel-to-fender fitment on your winter wheels/tires that you enjoy with your summer wheels/tires.

Looking forward to pics of the new addition! :)

Welcome to the party! :thumbup: I'd rather not go with spacers as I cannot find anything that says they are supported and safe but then again I haven't found anything official saying they are not safe. But I'm going to default to the safest options which is to just avoid them and not have to worry about it. Thank you though!

Wait, you are worried about "safe" and 'officially supported', but you will buy and drive on cheap replicas??? Have you found anything that says replica wheels are approved by BMW or are safety certified by any international standards body (ie TUV)?

Spacers are fine if the spacers and bolts are high quality. We are not talking about crazy 2-3" spacers.....

While you do need to be careful about the quality of ANY rims you put on your car, there is no reason to believe wheels not sold as OEM by BMW are of any less quality than BMW OEM wheels.

Nor are they 'cheap' just because they are $200-$400 per wheel. You're kidding yourself if you think BMW pays less than that and the rest isn't markup...

^agree with ard. I've run spacers with no issues for years on other cars.

First, I was making a narrow comment on the concept that "since they aren't approved I don't want to use them" about spacers... we can get into a substantiative discussion about the risks of spacers, but the OP was rejecting them on the blanket assertion that since they are not "approved" he considers this unsafe.

Second, other than saying "bmw makes money on wheels" what 'data' is there to support the safety of copies??? It is false logic that many people conveniently buy into...they don't like the money BMW makes and convince themselves that OE copies are "robin hood vendors" protecting them from evil BMW.

Finally, when wheel vendors have as much to lose as BMW, then I will trust their wheels. It is a matter of quality control, financial and business risk. I bought a set of HRE C20s for the other car, $5k, and have every confidence in them. It is not a class thing or money thing- I am a cheap bastard and if I could buy cheap, good looking wheels that gave me the quality assurance I would.

I guess I will end with this; if you think there is nothing wrong with aftermarket copies, then there is nothing wrong with a 10-15mm spacer The risk you are taking is probably the same!

IMO

A

(But I prolly wouldnt want any spacer on a track car....)

If you do some research, you'll find that a large number of track cars run spacers due to larger BBKs and for the increase in track width.

Seriously, people have very misguided views on spacers. There are two types, extended lug bolts/nuts, or bolt-on type.

Bolt-on spacers are every bit as safe as running no spacer at all. Slip on (or extended lug) spacers are less desirable, but no less safe, as the extended lugs are of a higher strength steel.

:popcorn:

In reference to the replicas, there is also no data that says they are unsafe. My point is just that people shouldn't blanketly assume they are not safe. You need to do your own due diligence (i.e. ask for certifications, speak with the vendor, get references, etc.) and determine if you believe that particular wheel is safe.

Also, I have no problem with BMW making money on wheels. My point was that because they are 1/2 of BMW's price doesn't mean they are 'cheap' in terms of quality. The price difference is part profit, part overhead on BMW's part.

Agree. Especially on the (important) distinction between the through bolt type... essentially all spacers are 'painted' with that one brush.

I once had morons at an Americas Tire store refuse to work on my E39M5 because the fronts had (gasp) 3mm spacers! three-friggin-millimeters. the width of this O. They did the rears, and I jacked the car up in the parking lot myself and handed them the bare wheels.

Now, I will make two comments about spacers on the track- they reduce the thermal transfer from rotor to wheel, AND they CAN make the lug bolt loading more complex and increase these stresses. However, this is an X5 forum (so we aren't talking track) and the situation where this kind of consideration comes into play is pretty high up on the performance curve even with track use.

And some technical inspectors won't allow spacers due to the safety risks, particularly on front wheels with their higher braking loads.

I would agree that bolt-on adaptors are safer, but I don't think they are as safe as having no spacer. You have introduced an additional failure point, as well as changing the load on the wheel bearing, and suspension components. That has to count for something.

I think that loose spacers are far less safe. It doesn't matter if the lugs are a higher strength steel, unless you calculate both the bending moment and the fatigue limit and make sure both are still reasonable. One calculation I saw showed that a 1/8" spacer (3 mm) reduced the safety factor by two. I consider that a significant reduction in safety.

Good previous discussion here, with my link to another thread in the GT40 forum. http://www.xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-foru...l-spacers.html

I completely agree with your assessment of slip-ons (loose), as the bending moment will affect the loading on the bolts more.

However, it's difficult to get on board with the idea that bolt-ons would decrease an MTBF by a factor of two. Follow this thought process:

1) The only thing you are introducing is a slab of aluminum. Granted, you are adding 5 more bolts to that wheel hub, so technically, there would be your MTBF reduction by 2, but that's subjective much like many reliability calculation methods.

2) The idea that you are imposing more load on the axle and hub are nearly moot due to the nature of differing wheels themselves. Obviously the loading on the hub is different with the sport 20's vs. the stock 18's. The 18's have a higher offset and are tucked in more. To think that a safety factor is not used would be crazy.

3) I know the right way to build a widebody track car would be to replace the axle, hubs, and associated suspension arms, but not everyone does this. The cheaper and more popular way to achieve the stance is to purchase very low (in the negatives) offset wheels, which are effectively much further off the hub than what you'd get with spacers.

What I'm trying to get at is that if anyone has a cause for alarm for even a 1" (25mm) spacer on their wheels is ludicrous in my book. But if it does make one feel uneasy, then simply don't buy them. :)

I may be wrong, but I don't consider mean time between failure to be directly related to safety factors. I relate MTBF to availability, more than reliability. Safety factors are designed to improve reliability. With an issue like a wheel coming off a vehicle at speed, even small differences in safety factors (reliability) can matter due to the extreme consequences.

I don't think that the offset point is moot, since the correct offset should put the centreline of the tire at the same point as the axle bearing. Anything that changes this creates a bending moment. What about scrub distance? Is that a concern, particularly with the negative camber of the X5?

I suppose that one could assume that the original engineer put in a healthy safety factor, and that one is free to spend it without consequence, but I guess the engineer in me rebels against that approach. My E53 was designed for 17" wheels. I suppose that the E70 was designed for 18" wheels. Anything over that puts additional load on the suspension, and is using up some of that original safety factor, IMO.

Agree completely that the cheapest way to deal with it is to install spacers, as opposed to buying the correct wheels. I just don't think that makes them as safe. Maybe it makes them safe enough. But in the consideration of systems that I would want to reduce safety in, wheel retention isn't one, due to the potential consequences of failure of that retention system.

I agree that this is more of a risk on track vehicles. However, when one poster asked a while ago if there had ever been a problem on a street vehicle, it didn't take long to provide the story of a Jeep (CJ or YJ, not sure which) that had a wheel pass the driver on the highway.

Interesting discussion.

What really scares me is this look. This isn't ok with me since I'd need to have it on from December through March in MN.
http://www.xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-foru...18-set-up.html
http://www.xoutpost.com/attachments/...p-100_1829.jpg[/QUOTE]



Hi All - Sorry do dig up an old thread, but I would like continue the discussion of using wheel spacers to push narrow wheels further out toward the end of the fenders do avoid the look mentioned above. I may opt for truck tires instead of winter tires because I live in SF where the weather is quite temperate and I travel frequently to Tahoe where there is a lot of snow. Snow tires around the bay area can wear out quite fast and truck tires might last a bit longer.

Anyhow...is there anyone out there who has successfully used the smaller width wheels and use spacers to push the wheel/tire out and closer to the edge of the fender? I also want to avoid the look of the car bulging out over the wheels!