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  #1  
Old 12-22-2015, 08:59 PM
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Front End Noises

Hey Lads,

Ok, so for some time now the X5 has been making what sounds like a cracking noise in the front end somewhere. I also have a brake shudder from the front when I initially apply the brakes but that smoothes out after a the brakes settle in.

The cracking sound seems to be most prominent when I am initially backing up and turning the wheels and then again when I go forward. I believe it does it slightly while turning and driving but very noticeable at very slow speed such as backing out of the driveway.

After reading a bunch of posts, I settled on the idea that it was probably my CV axles making the noise. I have owned and driven the truck for three years and I have never changed them. I have no idea how old they are.

So today I went for it and bought a set of rebuilt axles. They look good and they feel solid. I thought the noise was coming from the right side and decided to replace that axle first which I did. The noise however, remains.

My first question pertains to a possible issue with the power steering and can a worn rack make such noises? I have never done one before so I do not know how they go bad and what they do. I do have some power steering fluid leaking from somewhere but haven't dived straight into that as it has only been drops coming from somewhere. Not enough to make any marks on the ground, just makes the hoses wet.

The second question I have involves the CV axles and to help me keep my sanity that I am not doing this for no reason. I checked the axle after I got it out of the truck and noticed play on one end when I counter twist the ends of the axle. Should there be any play at all in these cv joints? I ask because the new one has basically zero play by comparison and I want to feel good about spending the money and time knowing I did something good for the truck even if it wasn't to fix the problem I initially went after.

Oh, in case you want to ask, I am having a bitch of a time locating exactly where the noise is coming from. It doesn't do it at all when the truck is up off the ground and my son turns the wheels left and right. I have tried to follow on the ground as he backs up and goes forward and I have heard it but damned if I can locate exactly where it is coming from.

Bernie

3.0L


I am going to leave this thread here because this is a distinct possibility.
I have had the boots replaced so maybe the proper torque values were not applied.

http://www.xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-foru...l-bearing.html

If anyone has the torque values for the components on the front end, it would be helpful.
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Last edited by razorboy; 12-22-2015 at 09:26 PM.
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Old 12-22-2015, 09:57 PM
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I doubt it was the cv shaft in the first place. Cv shaft noise will be all the time not only when you back out and goes away after a bit of driving.
I would check your brake pads, rotors, and caliper for proper function. Then check the dust cover for corrosion build up and touching the disc.
As for the torque value for the cv shaft it is 305 ft lb.
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Old 12-23-2015, 06:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perrier View Post
I doubt it was the cv shaft in the first place. Cv shaft noise will be all the time not only when you back out and goes away after a bit of driving.
I would check your brake pads, rotors, and caliper for proper function. Then check the dust cover for corrosion build up and touching the disc.
As for the torque value for the cv shaft it is 305 ft lb.
Thanks for the ideas.

Its not the brakes. It does it when the brakes are applied or when they are not. My guess right now is that it might be something on the front suspension that was not tightened down to spec based on what I have recently read. I did have CV boots replaced this year but cannot coincide the work to the noise. Easiest place for me to go now is just grab the torque wrench and go through each nut and bolt to make sure they are what they are supposed to be. At least I can rule that out then.
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Old 02-19-2017, 11:12 PM
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The source of all my pain (wobbling under brakes and creaking / cracking noises was lower control arm inboard nuts / bolts not tightened to spec.

They were way loose compared to the prescribed torque
Before you do anything to find a wobble or front end noise, make sure everything has been tightened corrlectly. This was the source of months of frustration and some unnecessary spending before I found the culprit
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Old 02-20-2017, 02:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by razorboy View Post
The source of all my pain (wobbling under brakes and creaking / cracking noises was lower control arm inboard nuts / bolts not tightened to spec.

They were way loose compared to the prescribed torque
Before you do anything to find a wobble or front end noise, make sure everything has been tightened corrlectly. This was the source of months of frustration and some unnecessary spending before I found the culprit
And of course you tightened them to spec. with the vehicle on the ground (full weight on the arm etc.)?

Failure to do it this way (with no load on the bushes) results in early bush failure.... and may explain how they got like this. It's probably pretty easy to pop the arms back on after working on the front end, leaving them very loose until the vehicle is lowered to the ground, and then forgetting to go back and torque them up.
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Old 02-20-2017, 02:49 AM
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Originally Posted by wpoll View Post
And of course you tightened them to spec. with the vehicle on the ground (full weight on the arm etc.)?

Failure to do it this way (with no load on the bushes) results in early bush failure.... and may explain how they got like this. It's probably pretty easy to pop the arms back on after working on the front end, leaving them very loose until the vehicle is lowered to the ground, and then forgetting to go back and torque them up.
Can't really explain it.
I was going through the front end looking for such a thing and it was the first nut/bolt I decided to check and it took no effort at all to loosen the nut. It's been like it for so long, I can't remember when it started and since I never did any suspension work on the truck myself, it must have been as you said - left loose and forgotten.

Anyway, yes vehicle on the ground tightened to 100nm and then 15 degrees. Snug as a bug
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Old 02-20-2017, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by razorboy View Post
Can't really explain it.
I was going through the front end looking for such a thing and it was the first nut/bolt I decided to check and it took no effort at all to loosen the nut. It's been like it for so long, I can't remember when it started and since I never did any suspension work on the truck myself, it must have been as you said - left loose and forgotten.

Anyway, yes vehicle on the ground tightened to 100nm and then 15 degrees. Snug as a bug
I have an annoying knock, I know its one of these bolts. Perhaps lower or Upper control arm or ARB links. I am going to get under there an check every single one of them and tighten them buggers with my torque wrench.

Cheers for the info.
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What I had updated
Carbon Effect Steering Wheel
Panoramic Sunroof Fix
PVC Replacement
All glowplugs and glowplug regulator
New discs and pads all round
All new front suspension links, bushes and rods
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Old 02-20-2017, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Lamby View Post
I have an annoying knock, I know its one of these bolts. Perhaps lower or Upper control arm or ARB links. I am going to get under there an check every single one of them and tighten them buggers with my torque wrench.

Cheers for the info.

It's so much more important than I gave it credit for.
I actually was changing out all the bolts in my reinforcement tray thinking that was the source of my creaking noises and as a side job, decided to start checking all of the suspension bolts for tightness. It was literally the first thing I checked!

I just grabbed the lower control arm and wiggled it and I heard it clink a bit so I dug deeper into it. Then I discovered that I could grab the assembly by the rotor and it was visibly moving around a tiny bit. Eyebrows went up at that point. If it was 100nm of torque necessary, these couldn't have been torqued any more than 25-30nm.

I spent money on this thing trying to locate this noise. Thrust bushings and even replaced the rack (although it was leaking anyway).

For a lot of us, checking the torque on the suspension bolts seems a bit of a time waster as I am always thinking what part needs to be replaced but I am here to tell you that these nuts and bolts not being torqued to spec caused a violent wobble in my steering under brakes (I have seen this a lot on the forum) and would make clicking, creaking, grinding type noises going from reverse to drive and during wheel turning at slow speed.

All makes perfect sense now!
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Old 03-02-2017, 05:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by razorboy View Post
It's so much more important than I gave it credit for.
I actually was changing out all the bolts in my reinforcement tray thinking that was the source of my creaking noises and as a side job, decided to start checking all of the suspension bolts for tightness. It was literally the first thing I checked!

I just grabbed the lower control arm and wiggled it and I heard it clink a bit so I dug deeper into it. Then I discovered that I could grab the assembly by the rotor and it was visibly moving around a tiny bit. Eyebrows went up at that point. If it was 100nm of torque necessary, these couldn't have been torqued any more than 25-30nm.

I spent money on this thing trying to locate this noise. Thrust bushings and even replaced the rack (although it was leaking anyway).

For a lot of us, checking the torque on the suspension bolts seems a bit of a time waster as I am always thinking what part needs to be replaced but I am here to tell you that these nuts and bolts not being torqued to spec caused a violent wobble in my steering under brakes (I have seen this a lot on the forum) and would make clicking, creaking, grinding type noises going from reverse to drive and during wheel turning at slow speed.

All makes perfect sense now!
I would like to think that I did these to the correct torque specs when I did the job in the first place. HOWEVER, I was wrong! Razorboy was correct and I went around each component in the front suspension and tightened to correct settings. Lower CA to subframe is spec'd at 100nm (think that about 80lb/sf) and they where well off. They where about 60nm. The problem is, I have snapped bolts before with my torque wrench not clicking. I must need it calibrating. So I use the wheel nuts as a good feel guide. 140nm is a fair amount and 100nm not far off so force to be applied etc... however I didn't take into account that I was laying on the floor under the car with much less leverage to apply to the wrench. Hence the bots are lose. Lesson learnt. And I also bought a smaller torque wrench as my Large TengTool is a beast and doesn't do the lower forces.

Anyway thanks again, I am clunk free and a happy man.
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What I had updated
Carbon Effect Steering Wheel
Panoramic Sunroof Fix
PVC Replacement
All glowplugs and glowplug regulator
New discs and pads all round
All new front suspension links, bushes and rods
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Old 03-02-2017, 09:45 AM
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Here is a picture of front end component torques that I found here on Xoutpost and added foot-pounds and a few other values.



Mike
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