Non-return valve parts falling out during oil filter removal

[Awntchi]

Hi guys, a bit of a long post...apologies in advance...

This has been discussed many times in various forums, in particular this one. I mentioned this issue in a different thread I started regarding my suspension conversion but thought I'll just make a specific thread about it here instead as I need some input on my findings.

1. I went to BMW (Norway) last week and they assured me they knew which part this valve sits in...I was really happy as that part was very cheap and requires no more than 10 min to change. Today I went to pick it up and immediately noticed they were wrong, that part does not have the valve incorporated into it. See link, item 2.
RealOEM.com - Online BMW Parts Catalog

2. The parts rep at BMW then recommended to order the actual filter housing (not where the filter sits), part 1 in above link. He said that's where the valve most likely came from....with no certainty in his voice this time. He said that there is a possibility that the oil is not being filtered due to the missing valve but again he was NOT sure. I told him to order it (takes a week, approx 200$) but I think I'll call them now to cancel it due to some interesting info I've found on this forum.

3. Below link is a discussion on this forum about this issue, the difference here is BMW (USA and Canada) are saying the actual oil pump is where this valve came from but it doesn't make sense as the valve would have to travel quite a distance to get down to where the filter sits and eventually spring out upon opening the filter housing, see link: RealOEM.com - Online BMW Parts Catalog.

I could then only assume they changed both the pump and filter housing (part 1 in first link)...but you know the saying about ASSuming However, a few members in this thread have chosen not to do anything about the valve and driven more than 10K miles without it and no issues whatsoever. One even had a BMW dealer confirming there is no need to do anything about the issue as there is no proof of oil starvation etc to the engine.
http://www.xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-foru...-update-4.html

4. Semi-conclusion: Changing the oil pump or housing seems to require a considerable amount of time (taking into account access to lift, tools, know-how etc) if choosing the DIY route. Even if the dealer or Indy take it in they would need approx 14 hours which in Norway translates into serious amount of cash. Driving without it risks something but so far there is no proof of that...not even what the risk is. I've put about 1100Km (about 690 miles) since the oil change and I have no leaks nor weird noises, the car behaves like it always has....a beast when you need it to be or a sleeping bear when the "boys in blue" are around

What do you guys think?

[David.X5]

I know the 4.4 (which has a remote mount filter housing), but can offer some general advice.

There is a drain back valve in the filter housing. The oil filter press it down when installed, it open as the filter lid is removed so oil drains back into the pan. That valve has to be in the bottom of the oil filter housing to work.

The oil pump has a pressure regulating valve built in. If it fell apart you would have lousy oil pressure and probably quickly kill your engine.

The Inner diameter of the main oil tubes/hoses is on the order of 1 cm. it is hard to imagine the main parts of the valve passing through that opening.

Good luck,

David

[David.X5]

The risk is that the oil bypasses your filter if the drain-back valve is broken. The oil will accumulate carbon and particles and cause excessive wear. I'd guess the crank bearings would be damaged first.

Might be a good idea to do very frequent oil changes (like 1000 miles) until you get it fixed.

[David.X5]

The risk is that the oil bypasses your filter if the drain-back valve is broken. The oil will accumulate carbon and particles and cause excessive wear. I'd guess the crank bearings would be damaged first.

Might be a good idea to do very frequent oil changes (like 1000 miles) until you get it fixed.

[Awntchi]

Thanks for your input David,

The part that they first suggested and ordered (no 2 in the first diagram) does have a spring loaded valve at the bottom of it which is still intact in my X. I think I will start by checking the oil filter and the housing it sits in...if it is "filled" with oil then that should clear the suspicion of oil not being filtered...right?

In the meantime I will definitely increase oil change intervals....

[David.X5]

If the bypass valve is broken and open all the time, I believe you will still see oil in the filter housing, it will just not be flowing through the filter element, it will choose the easier path around the filter. I would expect the oil to darken quickly, but that varies with the oil

[StephenVA]

I think I can add a little value to the conversation on this concern. In our 4.8is applications the filter is located on the bottom back of the engine, not top side like 80% of all the other BMW models due to the block changes. The anti drain-back valve is designed to keep oil in the filter housing when it is not pressurized (ENGINE OFF). In the top side mounted filters this is a large issue as the engine would experience 8-18 seconds of ZERO oil pressure on start up as the oil would have to travel up the line from the engine, fill the filter area, then down to the pump to be transferred through the main bearings, etc.

On the 4.8is the filter hangs on the back side of the oil pump housing near the oil pan. The filter housing is never empty of oil after the engine is started as it hangs upside down. The quick way to determine if the valve is functioning is to open up the drain valve on the filter housing (The little one) and see how much oil comes out.

Part #2 is the plastic basket that holds the filter element upright so oil will filter normally through it. Without it the filters will collapse.

I do not believe we have a "by-pass" valve incorporated into our pump/filter housings. Has anyone on the forum ever cut one apart?

I also think the parts guy is a little confused on which part you need and the labor involved. There are two parts of the pump/filter assembly. You only need to exposed parts of the filter housing. NOT the entire pump assembly to replace the valve. See images below:

[StephenVA]

Found the TSB on this issue from 2006 as well, that mentions the anti-drain valve parts found in the filter housing during oil changes as the OP mentioned.

The part price has doubled in the last year.....

[Awntchi]

Stephen, thank you for the explanation. The part in the first pic of your first post is what I ordered today. Both the parts rep and I agreed that the valve could not travel all the way from the pump, through the filter housing and into the filter. However, we were just using common sense and not any actual solid technical analysis based on the internals of the pump. Your input confirms our thoughts though.

Would you know how much work involves replacing the filter housing unit only by any chance?

As for your second post, that's the first thing I saw when googling about this issue, and the reason why I'm getting serious doubts about where this valve actually sits. The report says "oil pump" which didn't make sense to me and hence why I assumed they changed the whole unit at once (both pump and housing).

If the 200$ part fixes the problem without any major work then I'm all for it, better 200 now than a few thousands later down the road. If it's the pump then I'm stuck...I cannot do such a big job where I live as I have no access to lifts nor a garage. I will have to park the X long term until I find a solution. I'll investigate the oil in the filter to start with at least....

[StephenVA]

In the few times I had to work on mine, It appears that this part can be accessed from under the car without any removal other than the stiffing plate for access. Looks like a few bolts and your done. Could not figure out if there is a gasket between the housings or not. RealOEM.com shows nothing.