PLS HELP 2001 3.0 Wont Move in D or R rolls in P

[andrewwynn]

The front driveshaft spline issue is at the TC so when it happens the front drive shaft doesn't spin.

The symptom describe a loose CV axle or perhaps a blown CV joint (depends where the turning stops).

If the front drive shaft (propeller) is turning it means the TC is working and also means that power is being applied to the diff. the front side is bolted unlike the back side which is just spline poked into the TC.

Replaced doesn't mean fixed. If the CV axles are locked in, the symptoms described a defective dif.

Odds are far better a CV axle is not fully installed or the splines in/out of the dif are worn .

Put the car in N and allow all motion to stop before P. The grinding is the parking prawl. But you should not need to use the engine power to resolve.

If one of the CV not engaged, you'll likely be able to turn that wheel by hand. When you try to power from the engine side if either side slips neither side moves. It should be a little easier to turn the side that's not engaged as well as the pop from the spline slip should be much easier to feel on the CV axle that's slipping.

About once a year these symptoms come up on xoutpost. It has almost always come out to be spline engagement out of front dif. One time was a blown dif.

Worth car in park attempt to turn one of the floating front wheels.

When working properly the other wheel will turn the opposite way. The front drive shaft from TC shouldn't turn.

Pre 04 the TC doesn't disengage the front axle but I can't remember if it's locked with the parking prawl but I do know that anytime I've turned a front wheel by hand the opposite wheel turns the opposite way so that's the test to perform.

If you don't get that result the problem is at the dif.

[upallnight]

Originally Posted by andrewwynn

The front driveshaft spline issue is at the TC so when it happens the front drive shaft doesn't spin.

The symptom describe a loose CV axle or perhaps a blown CV joint (depends where the turning stops).

If the front drive shaft (propeller) is turning it means the TC is working and also means that power is being applied to the diff. the front side is bolted unlike the back side which is just spline poked into the TC.

Replaced doesn't mean fixed. If the CV axles are locked in, the symptoms described a defective dif.

Odds are far better a CV axle is not fully installed or the splines in/out of the dif are worn .

Put the car in N and allow all motion to stop before P. The grinding is the parking prawl. But you should not need to use the engine power to resolve.

If one of the CV not engaged, you'll likely be able to turn that wheel by hand. When you try to power from the engine side if either side slips neither side moves. It should be a little easier to turn the side that's not engaged as well as the pop from the spline slip should be much easier to feel on the CV axle that's slipping.

About once a year these symptoms come up on xoutpost. It has almost always come out to be spline engagement out of front dif. One time was a blown dif.

Worth car in park attempt to turn one of the floating front wheels.

When working properly the other wheel will turn the opposite way. The front drive shaft from TC shouldn't turn.

Pre 04 the TC doesn't disengage the front axle but I can't remember if it's locked with the parking prawl but I do know that anytime I've turned a front wheel by hand the opposite wheel turns the opposite way so that's the test to perform.

If you don't get that result the problem is at the dif.

If you read his post, he already replaced the diff with the same results.

[andrewwynn]

Originally Posted by upallnight

If you read his post, he already replaced the diff with the same results.

Hence my use of the phrase "replaced doesn't mean fixed". The symptom is of dif or.cv spline problem. (front drive shaft spins in gear).

The question is: does the front drive shaft STOP spinning when the clink/pop happens.

[upallnight]

Originally Posted by andrewwynn

Hence my use of the phrase "replaced doesn't mean fixed". The symptom is of dif or.cv spline problem. (front drive shaft spins in gear).

The question is: does the front drive shaft STOP spinning when the clink/pop happens.

Since most people will not replace the Diff with a brand new diff since it is too costly for the current crop of X5 owners, they will buy a used diff to replace it. What are the odds of buying a used diff with exactly the same problem as the original diff? Maybe he is better off playing the lottery with that type of odds.

OP had the car on a lift or jackstands and tested the powertrain. The wheels spin when place in drive and reverse. What this test doesn't do is test the powertrain components under load ie with the weight of the car on the powertrain.

Stripped front drive shaft splines are a common problem with these cars. He already stated that he can heard grinding sounds. Now he can waste more time and money chasing other solution but I would look at the common known failure problem before wasting time and money on other "Questionable Problems".

[andrewwynn]

Originally Posted by upallnight

Since most people will not replace the Diff with a brand new diff since it is too costly for the current crop of X5 owners, they will buy a used diff to replace it. What are the odds of buying a used diff with exactly the same problem as the original diff? Maybe he is better off playing the lottery with that type of odds.



OP had the car on a lift or jackstands and tested the powertrain. The wheels spin when place in drive and reverse. What this test doesn't do is test the powertrain components under load ie with the weight of the car on the powertrain.



Stripped front drive shaft splines are a common problem with these cars. He already stated that he can heard grinding sounds. Now he can waste more time and money chasing other solution but I would look at the common known failure problem before wasting time and money on other "Questionable Problems".

Re reading I did say replaced.

Odds of replacing a differential with another differential that has a stripped gear very small.

odds of a mechanic that’s not super qualified swapping a working differential with a different working differential because the CV axle was loose pretty high.

No qualified mechanic will skip the step of hand turn the input of the dif To confirm or deny that the output shaft are both turning before installing or before removing.

Unless I missed something the front Drive propeller was turning which means it was not a transfer case spline which is the common problem described above.

mechanic with experience of a skipping spline will definitely know the difference of the sound versus broken gears.

I have interacted about six of these discussions on Xo. 3 were CV came out, two were TC spline one was dif internal destruction.

And the only post from the original poster it says the front driveshaft was turning and the front wheels were not turning those the back wheels were.


This means the problem is in front of the propeller and I have never heard of a CV joint breaking to the point where it will turn inside itself so the odds are very good the CV axle is loose. Possibly from a previous repair an incompatible part was used where the inner splines were not long enough to properly engage the differential.

At this point it’s just a thought exercise because we have no additional feedback but the discussion as it will hone our diagnostic skills

[maddogmontana]

Originally Posted by andrewwynn

Re reading I did say replaced.

Odds of replacing a differential with another differential that has a stripped gear very small.

odds of a mechanic that’s not super qualified swapping a working differential with a different working differential because the CV axle was loose pretty high.

No qualified mechanic will skip the step of hand turn the input of the dif To confirm or deny that the output shaft are both turning before installing or before removing.

Unless I missed something the front Drive propeller was turning which means it was not a transfer case spline which is the common problem described above.

mechanic with experience of a skipping spline will definitely know the difference of the sound versus broken gears.

I have interacted about six of these discussions on Xo. 3 were CV came out, two were TC spline one was dif internal destruction.

And the only post from the original poster it says the front driveshaft was turning and the front wheels were not turning those the back wheels were.


This means the problem is in front of the propeller and I have never heard of a CV joint breaking to the point where it will turn inside itself so the odds are very good the CV axle is loose. Possibly from a previous repair an incompatible part was used where the inner splines were not long enough to properly engage the differential.

At this point it’s just a thought exercise because we have no additional feedback but the discussion as it will hone our diagnostic skills

First off, thank you everyone. Truly appreciate everything here.

I bought car AS IS from a copart auction. My 4th purchase this year, 3 land cruisers and an lx470, all have arrived in working condition matching the description on the auction listing.

The X5 said "normal wear, runs & drives" When it arrived off the carrier, it did neither. The battery was too dead to start it it with the pack provided by the driver and I couldnt reach the trunk to swap one out. We got enough juice for lights and to put the trans in N.

So I rolled it off the truck, a big multi car hauler, in N, when I hit the brakes it didnt really do much of anything until I pulled the E brake. I'd say I hit the pavement pretty hard, wondering if that could have caused something to snap lose on the front axel.


Anyway, after swapping out the battery for my backup she started right up, I was pumped but it didn't move in gear, rolled in P, made that fine grinding noise going back into P from D that I described earlier.

Got it towed to my "mechanic" who is not great but, has been great when I need to drop off a company car for a master cylinder or brake pads, starter, etc. Lets me bring my own parts, very reasonable prices, etc.

Once we got it on the lift and hit the gas in D we all noticed a rattling noise from the front diff, sounded like a large bolt was being shaken around a metal box or something.

So I went to a yard nearby and got a front diff, it was clean, no gear wear, oil was still visable, it was clean and when I turn the part that bolts to the front drive shaft, the internals seemed to move nicely, everything felt good.

Also, when I spun the front wheels with the car on the lift, the other did not move. When I did this with the rear wheels, the other wheel spun in the opposite direction. When I spun the front pass wheel, the front driver wheel did not spin.

I wasn't there to check how this worked after he swapped the diff and when I got back it was on the ground and still no movement. But it felt like it was almost there, you could feel the car sort of kick or jerk or try and give you a little push when In D or R when previously the drive shaft was just spinning freely with that rattling noise from the front diff.

I was ready to go buy some after market front drive shaft assembly and just have him swap it out, I know its not the trans, it could be the TC chain, but I would like to look at the front CV's and rule that out before i start with the TC.

[upallnight]

Originally Posted by maddogmontana

First off, thank you everyone. Truly appreciate everything here.

I bought car AS IS from a copart auction. My 4th purchase this year, 3 land cruisers and an lx470, all have arrived in working condition matching the description on the auction listing.

The X5 said "normal wear, runs & drives" When it arrived off the carrier, it did neither. The battery was too dead to start it it with the pack provided by the driver and I couldnt reach the trunk to swap one out. We got enough juice for lights and to put the trans in N.

So I rolled it off the truck, a big multi car hauler, in N, when I hit the brakes it didnt really do much of anything until I pulled the E brake. I'd say I hit the pavement pretty hard, wondering if that could have caused something to snap lose on the front axel.


Anyway, after swapping out the battery for my backup she started right up, I was pumped but it didn't move in gear, rolled in P, made that fine grinding noise going back into P from D that I described earlier.

Got it towed to my "mechanic" who is not great but, has been great when I need to drop off a company car for a master cylinder or brake pads, starter, etc. Lets me bring my own parts, very reasonable prices, etc.

Once we got it on the lift and hit the gas in D we all noticed a rattling noise from the front diff, sounded like a large bolt was being shaken around a metal box or something.

So I went to a yard nearby and got a front diff, it was clean, no gear wear, oil was still visable, it was clean and when I turn the part that bolts to the front drive shaft, the internals seemed to move nicely, everything felt good.

Also, when I spun the front wheels with the car on the lift, the other did not move. When I did this with the rear wheels, the other wheel spun in the opposite direction. When I spun the front pass wheel, the front driver wheel did not spin.

I wasn't there to check how this worked after he swapped the diff and when I got back it was on the ground and still no movement. But it felt like it was almost there, you could feel the car sort of kick or jerk or try and give you a little push when In D or R when previously the drive shaft was just spinning freely with that rattling noise from the front diff.

I was ready to go buy some after market front drive shaft assembly and just have him swap it out, I know its not the trans, it could be the TC chain, but I would like to look at the front CV's and rule that out before i start with the TC.

I would guess that one of the axle is not completely engaged with the splines in the differential. I would pull both axles off to check the splines. If it is the driver side axle ie the left side of the car, I have an oem driverside axle that I am selling for $40.00 plus shipping. Boots are not torn and splines are good.

Sounds like you are a flipper.