Home Forums Articles How To's FAQ Register
Go Back   Xoutpost.com > BMW SAV Forums > X5 (E53) Forum
Fluid Motor Union
User Name
Password
Member List Premier Membership Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Xoutpost server transfer and maintenance is occurring....
Xoutpost is currently undergoing a planned server migration.... stay tuned for new developments.... sincerely, the management


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 01-04-2022, 05:17 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 26
2004bmwx53i is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by StephenVA View Post
Reuse the bolts for the bracket to hub. Replace the pins that hold the caliper to the bracket. Replace the caliper mounting boot as well. Reinstall the new pins DRY.

Note: At 100K I personally replace all bolts, boots, lines, rebuild the calipers etc at the brakes. The replacement bolts use a male TORX head, so you will in the future need a FEMALE Torx socket. The ability to torque and unbolt is improved moving forward at the socket self centers on twist.

?????
We are discussing #3 on Image below I looked up the costs from a local dealer.
Hex bolt M12X1,5X41 ZNS3 4 11/2005 34116767217
The cost is
Disc Brake Caliper Bracket Mounting Bolt - BMW (34-11-6-767-217)

MSRP: $17.98
Discount: $3.59 (20% off)
Sale Price: $14.39

I think to OP clicked on the assembly part (Bracket, bolts,etc) number #2
Would you please share the retailer info. Thanks
Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links

  #12  
Old 01-04-2022, 05:24 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 26
2004bmwx53i is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewwynn View Post
They are not torqued near yield I reuse. Does BMW recommend non reuse? They often do for CYA legal reasons in suspension parts.

From TIS:

2AZ
Brake caliper to steering knuckle
(screws lightly oiled, contact surfaces between brake caliper and steering knuckle cleaned and grease-free)

110 Nm.

It states if self locking or microencapsulated replace them.

I'm not aware that E53 uses either.

I reuse them.
Thanks for the input. As for the yield point, how would we know that at 110 Nm the material would not be at or passed yield.
Also, would you please explain what is meant by microencapsulated.
BTW, my mileage is 167000 miles!
Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-04-2022, 05:31 PM
andrewwynn's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Racine, WI
Posts: 9,091
andrewwynn will become famous soon enough
I'm not even sure what BMW means by microencapsulated but I think it's a special treatment that distresses the metal "one time" to lock it. These bolts aren't.

I use an app called iEngineer to look up bolt stress/yield etc.

I think those bolts are M12 front axle maybe M10 back.


Over 5 tons of force at normal torque.

The spec torque for 10.9 M12 is 122 Nm. That is 75% of yield 160 ish should be yield hence "nowhere near". You can stress a steel bolt effectively ∞ times if below 75% of yield. It acts just like a spring.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
__________________
2011 E70 N55 (me)
2012 E70 N63 (wife)
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-04-2022, 06:41 PM
bcredliner's Avatar
Premier Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Little Elm,Texas. (40 minutes North of Dallas)
Posts: 7,844
bcredliner is on a distinguished road
Micro-encapsulated bolts have Loctite or similar on them. That's why the bolts are special. I re-use them but apply blue Loctite before doing so. Calipers are subject to lots of vibration, shocks and heating and cooling cycles. I wouldn't reuse them without a new application of Loctite.
__________________
X5 4.6 2002 Black Sap, Black interior. 2013 X5M Melbourne Red, Bamboo interior
Dallas

Last edited by bcredliner; 01-04-2022 at 06:54 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 01-04-2022, 09:47 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 26
2004bmwx53i is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewwynn View Post
I'm not even sure what BMW means by microencapsulated but I think it's a special treatment that distresses the metal "one time" to lock it. These bolts aren't.

I use an app called iEngineer to look up bolt stress/yield etc.

I think those bolts are M12 front axle maybe M10 back.


Over 5 tons of force at normal torque.

The spec torque for 10.9 M12 is 122 Nm. That is 75% of yield 160 ish should be yield hence "nowhere near". You can stress a steel bolt effectively ∞ times if below 75% of yield. It acts just like a spring.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
This is first class response! Thank you.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 01-04-2022, 09:53 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 26
2004bmwx53i is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcredliner View Post
Micro-encapsulated bolts have Loctite or similar on them. That's why the bolts are special. I re-use them but apply blue Loctite before doing so. Calipers are subject to lots of vibration, shocks and heating and cooling cycles. I wouldn't reuse them without a new application of Loctite.
Just for the sake of technicalities, I would say that if bolts are torqued to specification they would not necessarily need extra locking measure. The torque supposedly has already taken vibration into account. This is my pure guess.
Adding thread lock does no harm at all. I'll do that. Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-04-2022, 09:58 PM
andrewwynn's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Racine, WI
Posts: 9,091
andrewwynn will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcredliner View Post
Micro-encapsulated bolts have Loctite or similar on them. That's why the bolts are special. I re-use them but apply blue Loctite before doing so. Calipers are subject to lots of vibration, shocks and heating and cooling cycles. I wouldn't reuse them without a new application of Loctite.

That is not bad advice. I will add however that after remove and replace roughly 100-120 caliper bolts. 100% of the time it took more torque to remove them than the torque they were set with. E.g. I'm not concerned about adding thread lock though I certainly would not advise against it. Very good idea. Actually on a recent job where the bolts were so rusted I had to cut new faces on the bolt to remove: I added thread lock to ironically make it easier to remove next time.

(Nexuses the thread lock fills the gap that allows water/air ingress to cause the rust lock)
__________________
2011 E70 N55 (me)
2012 E70 N63 (wife)
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-04-2022, 10:00 PM
andrewwynn's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Racine, WI
Posts: 9,091
andrewwynn will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2004bmwx53i View Post
Adding thread lock does no harm at all. I'll do that. Thanks.
I've rarely added but after that last job from hell (took a couple hours to remove two caliper bolts after somebody else rounded off the bolt heads on some M14 bolts), just to keep out the rust is a good reason.
__________________
2011 E70 N55 (me)
2012 E70 N63 (wife)
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01-05-2022, 11:39 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 26
2004bmwx53i is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewwynn View Post
I'm not even sure what BMW means by microencapsulated but I think it's a special treatment that distresses the metal "one time" to lock it. These bolts aren't.

I use an app called iEngineer to look up bolt stress/yield etc.

I think those bolts are M12 front axle maybe M10 back.


Over 5 tons of force at normal torque.

The spec torque for 10.9 M12 is 122 Nm. That is 75% of yield 160 ish should be yield hence "nowhere near". You can stress a steel bolt effectively ∞ times if below 75% of yield. It acts just like a spring.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Just to be nerdy, I found some info regarding the yield of 160. Yield is stress with units of pressure like psi, torque is of unit length x force. So they can't be compared. Please have a look at the link below (the tables) and let me know what you think (I get yield of 940 and proof load of 630 MPa). This has become an interesting discussion.Thanks

https://www.boltdepot.com/fastener-i...ade-Chart.aspx
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 01-05-2022, 12:25 PM
crystalworks's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: SA, TX
Posts: 5,984
crystalworks is on a distinguished road
Ever since having a caliper bracket bolt back out on my Mom's Infiniti FX35 (was torqued to spec), I use a bit of red locktite every time I do a brake job. Didn't do any real damage, just gouging on wheel barrel, but could have been very bad. I've never had that happen on a BMW, but I take no chances now.
__________________
2005 X5 4.4i Build 04/05 Maintenance/Build Log
Nav, Pano, Sport (Purchased 06/14 w/ 109,000 miles) (Sold 8/15 w/121,000 miles)


2006 X5 4.8is Build 11/05 Maintenance/Build Log
Nav, DSP, Pano, Running Boards, OEM Tow Hitch, Cold Weather Pckg (Purchased 08/15 w/ 90,500 miles)

2010 X5 35d Build 02/10
Nav, HiFi, 6 DVD, Sports Pckg, Cold Weather Pckg, HUD, CAS, Running Boards, Leather Dash, PDC, Pano (Purchased 03/17 w/ 136,120 miles)
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On





All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:53 PM.
vBulletin, Copyright 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0
2017 Xoutpost.com. All rights reserved. Xoutpost.com is a private enthusiast site not associated with BMW AG.
The BMW name, marks, M stripe logo, and Roundel logo as well as X3, X5 and X6 designations used in the pages of this Web Site are the property of BMW AG.
This web site is not sponsored or affiliated in any way with BMW AG or any of its subsidiaries.