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  #11  
Old 05-08-2022, 02:38 PM
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Well done!!

From one 4.6 owner to another, troubleshoot the simple/easy fixes first, especially if safety related. Always torque the wheel lugs, not fun if a wheel falls off. 3/8 and 1/2 in torque wrenches are a must have for DIYer.
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  #12  
Old 05-08-2022, 05:12 PM
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You definitely need to torque your lugs. At the least I use torque sticks to get them close before a follow up. A primary point is to.get them tight enough to not loosen up. Even "snug" they will apply on the order of 40-50,000# of force but if as loose as you describe, for sure the hub to wheel surface could have moved a couple 1/1000" each rev and cause a tap. I heard a distinct double tap which could be two different lugs binding up and releasing.

Good share though. Somebody in the future will see this thread and check their lugs.
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  #13  
Old 05-08-2022, 09:59 PM
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Well it was on the wheel end! Good catch. Luckily you didn't have any lug-bolts fall off during highspeed transit!
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  #14  
Old 05-09-2022, 03:07 AM
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Yeah I should definitely have a torque wrench in my shopping list, already have a 1/4" one but not much of a use for car related stuff. Still wondering how I would have left the lugs so loose while even after the rechecking they were okay but I guess they were still a bit off which allowed them to loosen even more.
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  #15  
Old 05-09-2022, 11:55 AM
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Torque wrench mandatory/big hoard of tools & parts optional

I've carried a "cheap" torque wrench in all my vehicles (my personal vehicles, not the ones the wife uses exclusively...she wouldn't be able to set the torque required) since the 1970's, after I had problems with lug nuts being too tight, or too loose, after using "4-way"s or a "jack-handle wheel lug wrench" (included, along with the jack, in most cars' equipment).

Several times I had found that after I had changed out a flat tire using those tools to loosen/tighten the lug nuts (or the bolts on my VW's), and then went to re-tighten them about 100 miles later (what my Grandfather taught me to do), they were either too tight or slightly loose, depending on my degree of aggravation when changing the flat tire. I just never was able to judge how much force to use.

At first, I carried a beam-style 1/2" torque wrench, but switched to cheap click-style wrenches when they started selling for under $50 USD. Since then, I've had no problems with wheels installed or tightened by myself.

However, I have had recent (and several times prior) bad experiences with lug nuts/bolts that were too tight to remove easily, that had been installed by tire shops presumably with powerful air impacts. I usually found my truck wheels had been overtightened way past the 140 ft-lbs required, so I added a long-handle 1/2" breaker bar (with an extension tube for added power) to my truck equipment. The recent https://xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-forums/...bolts-e53.html problem I had with my first flat on the X5 prompted me to add a breaker bar and extension tube to the growing assortment of tools I have in the trunk (including std. BMW tire-changing equipt.), all in various toolbags and boxes:
  • two more jacks,
  • two jack-stands,
  • a decent torque wrench,
  • full sets of metric sockets and tork sockets,
  • misc. other hand tools,
  • two worklights,
  • fender cover, ground cloth(s), beach towels, work gloves, hand towels, hand cleaner,
  • a laser temp gun,
  • two hand-held scan tools (Foxwell NT510 Elite and Innova 3101i),
  • two Android/Bluetooth OBD2 dongles, OBDLink LX and BAFX for Torque Pro, OBDLink apps
  • "OHP INPA Cable FTDI FT232RL USB OBD2 for BMW Diagnostic Coding | K Line" , used for the Android apps Bimmertool Pro and Deep OBD,
  • dedicated spare phone for Android OBD2 app usage (8" Android tablet, too, if traveling 100+ miles from home, also for OBD2 and offline maps)
  • panel fasteners,
  • spare fuses+terminals+extra wiring kit,
  • 1 gallon of pre-mixed blue coolant,
  • 10 quarts of Castrol 5W-40 Euro/Hi-mileage/LL oil + filter+ spare drain plug,
  • many miscellaneous unnamed items & tools,
  • even a 6"Hx10"Wx18"L treated wooden block (for a solid footing for my choice of jack).
Probably 200 lbs of gear. Overkill, just in case I have a problem away from my real tool sets, at the house.
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  #16  
Old 05-09-2022, 01:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SamW View Post
Yeah I should definitely have a torque wrench in my shopping list, already have a 1/4" one but not much of a use for car related stuff. Still wondering how I would have left the lugs so loose while even after the rechecking they were okay but I guess they were still a bit off which allowed them to loosen even more.
I've been amazed over the years at what even reputable shops can miss. I think lot has to do with them moving too fast, confirmation bias, etc., and some with unfamiliarity, especially as vehicles age. These are the very reasons pilots use checklists!

Many years ago I had a reputable shop do some front suspension work and a valley pan in my X5 and they neglected to torque the subframe stiffener bolts. This will get your attention on the road.
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  #17  
Old 05-09-2022, 01:28 PM
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Did you check to see if the loose wheel deformed the lug holes in the wheel?
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Old 05-09-2022, 04:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Henn28 View Post
I've been amazed over the years at what even reputable shops can miss. I think lot has to do with them moving too fast, confirmation bias, etc., and some with unfamiliarity, especially as vehicles age. These are the very reasons pilots use checklists!

Many years ago I had a reputable shop do some front suspension work and a valley pan in my X5 and they neglected to torque the subframe stiffener bolts. This will get your attention on the road.
I guess it can happen to any of us, I just got to use torque wrench next time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcredliner View Post
Did you check to see if the loose wheel deformed the lug holes in the wheel?
Actually I didn’t, will do tomorrow, thanks for the heads up!
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  #19  
Old 05-09-2022, 04:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by workingonit View Post
... I usually found my truck wheels had been overtightened way past the 140 ft-lbs required, ...
140Nm (~105ft.lbs)?

140ft.lbs is VERY tight- at least on our cars!

(Maybe you are referencing a larger vehicle spec.)
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  #20  
Old 05-09-2022, 05:27 PM
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unclear reference to a larger truck

Quote:
Originally Posted by wpoll View Post
140Nm (~105ft.lbs)?

140ft.lbs is VERY tight- at least on our cars!

(Maybe you are referencing a larger vehicle spec.)
I guess I didn't make the reference clear; the truck that I referred to was my '04 Chevy 2500HD WT, with eight-lug wheels. It does require 140 ft-lbs torque, which seems to have been exceeded on all three sets of new
tires I've had installed at Discount Tire and NTB. That's when I started carrying the breaker bar.

Previously, 1/2" diameter, 5-lug and even 6-lug Chevy trucks only required 90 ft-lbs (actually 65-90, prior to the mid-70's), and when they were overtightened, I could still get them loose. But, when the lug bolts/nuts went to 9/16" on the eight-lug wheels, it seems all the tire techs decided to use their most powerful impacts to secure them. I never expected the same on the X5.
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'01 BMW X5-E53 3.0i (born 7/13/01)
topas-blau, Leder-Montana grau,
my new favorite project car

Plus four GM vehicles, Daily Drivers, and modified trucks for hauling & camping:
3 Chevys:
'09 HHR Panel LS 2.2L,
'08 Cobalt Coupe LS 2.2L,
'04 Silverado 2500HD WT Reg. Cab
+ a '98 GMC Sierra 1500 Ext. Cab

- and 19 others, now gone, that I've had over the last 56 years (not counting the stillborn "1965 ChevyII altered/gasser project")
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