Thinking about a 0W-20 ? Need answers ?

[nrgetic99]

Originally Posted by cary

LL-98 allows Group III, and the BMW badged Castrol oil sold in the US is a Group III (Form of TXT Softect I believe). Motul Japan has the specs on their website, and it lists the difference in the requirement.

Trying to spec out (or in for that matter) a particular base oil or component is a bit of slippery slope here in NA due to restraint of trade issues.

In other areas, other OEM's can effectively do the same by clever use of Physical properties or selected performance tests.

Either way, in spite of my grevious oversight, this thread is becoming very valuable.

I think I may call my old friends and see if I can get a hold of some of the full synthetic 5W-40 from my European days.. I can tell you for a fact, all PAO with 10% Ester and an HTHS over 4.0 cP. It was ACEA A3, B3 (04) and BMW LongLife but I am not sure what variant.

David

[JCL]

Originally Posted by vinuneuro

That's because the North American oil sold at your dealer doesn't meet BMW's LL specs.

My question wasn't what is available. Any oil that has LL on the bottle could just be an old formulation. The question is whether BMW is still specifying LL oils. They are not requiring them in my new vehicle; there is no mention of the LL spec in my owner's manual for my 2008 535i. I do need an SL oil, and ACEA A3, which is a tougher spec than in the past.

So, has BMW given up on the LL spec? Is there any recent BMW info?

[vinuneuro]

I'm sure your manual differs from those that come with European spec BMW's. That might have something to do with why the LL info isn't in your manual. Perhaps someone on the other side of the pond could check and tell us.

[JCL]

Could be. Just for fun, I went and checked the manuals on X5 World. No mention of the A3 or LL spec, all the way back through the 2000 model (although it may have been referenced in a supplemental manual for service warranty).

I find it strange that we used to get LL oils, but no longer. I suspect it may be because the SH oils we used to get (remembering that SH was a 1996 spec) were LL certified, but the newer engines require SL or SM, and those oils perhaps aren't certified.

We do get A3 spec oils, and that is a Euro spec, separate from the API certifications.

[JCL]

Following up on Vin's idea, I googled "bmw.co.uk LL-04" I got 3 hits; all were discussion boards. I tried "bmw.de LL-04" and got more hits, but didn't find any BMW sites (just discussion boards, etc at the top of the list).

So, it appears that the entire LL issue may be a non-issue.

I did find a BMW TIB that recommended not using LL-04 in North America as it was not compatible with NA fuels, but that is likely obsolete now that NA fuels have lower sulphur levels. LL-01 was the most recent recommendation for gasoline engines, as Cary suggested in his post.

I'll stay with my API SM oil, and quit wondering about it.

[vinuneuro]

Once again, the manuals hosted on x5world are NA versions.

I don't see any reason why BMW would discuss an oil spec on their websites. Automobile consumers aren't concerned with things such as that, like medium and heavy-duty diesel consumers would be. It'd also be fruitless imo, to suddenly drop proprietary oil spec's when they're pursuing emissions targets even more keenly.