X5 Pulling 5900# Boat . . . Awesome!!

[X5Dawg]

Just another note, my Indy mechanic told me the limitation on the X is the torque converter - he stated the one in the X is from the 5-series and therefore built more for take-off power rather than hauling.

Not sure how true this is - maybe someone else can verify.

[JTis]

As the F-350 drivers say, with a "smaller" tow vehicle, it isn't the towing that's the problem, it's the stopping. I've towed with all kinds of vehicles, and although the X5 does well, I always felt more comfortable coming down a long grade with a heavy load in my old 2500HD than in the X5. Gotta say though, the X5 is head and shoulders over other SUV's in towing, particularly the Grand Cherokee V8 I used once---that was just scary.

[cgrosse]

My choice would be the V8 over the 3.0 ... once you drive and compare it's a no brainer. Plus the resale value if you would ever want to sell or trade up. Maintenence is always going to be an issue with any BMW... drive a Lexus, Acura or Infiniti if you want the vanilla driving experience. BMW is cutting edge... you just need to maintain them but the reward is ULTIMATE.

I own a 4.6is, a '98 740i and a '97 540i.

[DSAviate]

Good points Anerbe, and Others -

It's quite likely, that whether the 6000 lbs limitation came from the test track, engine/frame/transmission & torque converter engineers, the legal office, or some other entity at BMW, . . . we'll never know. No one wants to divulge their vehicle's weak link.

I can only imagine that 6000 lbs puts a "getting close" to limit strain on the hitch, frame, suspension, and transmission. Getting a V8 under the hood will only enable me to INCREASE that strain, and I don't want to do that. I don't want to be tempted to do that! So, just another reason to go with the simpler M54 with enough power, but not more than I need . . . UNLESS some members with BMW V8 experience want to convince me that the V8s are as easy, if not easier than the straight 6 to maintain.

I agree that stopping is a major concern. The X5 stopped this load during aggressive decel on par if not better than the Suburban. We're pretty committed to Florida, the only hills we'll see are the launch ramp and the exit ramp!

Love the sharing . . . Good Stuff!!

[admranger]

The ugly part of towing over the manufacturer's recommendation of 6k lbs max is the outcome of the lawsuit in any accident you are in (your fault or not). You're gonna have a hard time explaining how being over the manufacterer's recommended weight limit was not a contributing factor to an accident.

[JCL]

Couple of comments:

6000 lbs was the limit in North America. The same X5 vehicle in Europe had a higher published rating.

If you cause an accident, you cause an accident. Just because your trailer is under 6000 lbs doesn't make you not culpable.

The X5 is rated to stop 1600 lbs of trailer. Anything over that requires trailer brakes. Bigger trailers have bigger brakes. Maintenance of those brakes is a key point though, because in my experience most drivers towing don't check their brakes at truck stop brake checks at the start of long grades. I drove commercial trucks, all GVW, with and without air brakes, and consider that brake maintenance is part of the deal. We got tested on pretrip inspections, brake checks, and so on. Not many jurisdictions require special licenses for towing, and perhaps they should.

Suggest that those interested search on withidl's posts, and read up. He describes his weight distribution hitch (Hensley Arrow), his Dinan mods, his shifting technique with respect to the lock up torque converter, and so on. You will keep transmission temperatures down by keeping the torque converter in lock up mode. Excellent stuff. There is a big difference between an engineer with a very cautious approach and a lot of prep work towing 8300 lbs, vs someone bolting on a hitch and heading off with the same load. Just saying. I am not recommending that everyone go out and tow that much, but it does speak to the capabilities of the vehicle for those that are worried about the 6000 lb limit.

Originally Posted by withidl

Regarding the transmission; use MANUAL mode. You want to keep the transmission from "hunting" gears to maintain speed. On my 2001 4.4i 5 speed the torque converter locks-up (direct drive) at about 62 mph. I use cruise control set at an indicated 70 mph in MANUAL mode 5th so the engine can be max throttled (by cruise control) without downshifting or unlocking the torque converter. Your 6 speed transmission should behave the same except the 6th speed torque converter lock-up may be at a different speed than my 5 speed.

The following was posted some years back; at last report the truck was over 90,000 miles, with over 30,000 of that towing the Airstream.

Originally Posted by withidl

I've made numerous posts on Bimmer.org regarding towing and the capabilities of the X5, but because a "picture is worth a thousand words" I'm attaching one of my assembly for those who might be interested.

Following are some statistics on the assembly:

BMW X5
*2001 April build
*All options except phone & load floor
*4.4i with Sports Package (rear axle has air suspension)
*Dinan throttle body, engine & trans software (298 hp & 350+ #' torque)
*Current miles = 60,369 (engine oil consumption = 1 pint every 6,500 miles)
*Hitch is the BMW OEM hitch (I installed it)
*Average city mpg = 13 to 17 (basis number of stop lights)
*Average highway mpg = 18 to 22 (basis wind direction)
*Average towing mpg = 8 to 12 (basis wind direction)

Airstream
*2002 (May 2001 build) 31 foot Classic Limited
*GVWR (gross vehicle weight rating) 8,300# (have loaded it to 8,900+#)
*Tongue weight 750 to 1,000 pounds (weight distributed)
*Miles towed by X5 = 20,706

Hensley Arrow
*Towing interface (orange component between the X5 & Airstream)
*Totally negates sway via mechanical geometry (no friction involved)
*Incorporates weight distribution springs with jack screws
*Web site = Trailer Sway Elimination Guaranteed - Hensley® the ONLY trailer hitch guaranteed to totally eliminate trailer sway.

[JCL]

Originally Posted by X5Dawg

Just another note, my Indy mechanic told me the limitation on the X is the torque converter - he stated the one in the X is from the 5-series and therefore built more for take-off power rather than hauling.

Not sure how true this is - maybe someone else can verify.

Not sure where it came from, but see my note above on driving techniques to keep the torque converter in lock-up mode, thus reducing transmission temperatures.

[JCL]

Originally Posted by JTis

As the F-350 drivers say, with a "smaller" tow vehicle, it isn't the towing that's the problem, it's the stopping. I've towed with all kinds of vehicles, and although the X5 does well, I always felt more comfortable coming down a long grade with a heavy load in my old 2500HD than in the X5.

I have done lots of towing with an F250HD, an F350 tow truck, and some with a Super Duty. With tow trucks you have the issue that the towed vehicle does not have brakes (unless it is a trailer with surge brakes). It is all about driving for the load and conditions. My E53 with a braked trailer felt better than an F350 wheel lift tow truck with a heavy car on the back, and that tow truck was licensed and set up to tow like that every day.

[admranger]

Originally Posted by JCL

Couple of comments:

6000 lbs was the limit in North America. The same X5 vehicle in Europe had a higher published rating.

If you cause an accident, you cause an accident. Just because your trailer is under 6000 lbs doesn't make you not culpable.

It does make a civil judgement oh so much easier if you are over weight. While not clear in my post, I was referring to the tort happy USA! Viva la multimillion dollar judgement! Even I could win a case where the load was heavier than the manufacturer's recommendation, and I'm merely an engineer (well, truth be told, a couple of different engineers wrapped into one -- neither of which drives a train...).

Originally Posted by JCL

There is a big difference between an engineer with a very cautious approach and a lot of prep work towing 8300 lbs, vs someone bolting on a hitch and heading off with the same load.

Yep, the big difference is that the engineer is putting themselves in a position to lose everything they own if they get into a wreck towing beyond the manufacturer's recommendation. Preponderance of evidence, not reasonable doubt comes into play in civil suits in the USA (lawyers, feel free to chime in here).

Everyone makes choices. Just be sure you are somewhat aware of the consequences of the choices you make.

The Hensley hitch is a marvelous piece of engineering (about $3k worth iirc) that will get you no where in court. It'll just help tie the rope around your neck tighter: "So, as an engineer you KNEW you were overloading your X5 and yet you RECKLESSLY did it anyway without any thought towards the havoc you would create on our nation's highways, putting mothers, babies, kittens, and puppies at risk? Yes or no answer please!" The winning lawyer, errr, plaintiff rests.

I'm not telling anyone what to do. I'm just sayin'...

Oh, my other, other vehicle is a Chevy crew cab dually diesel. I've towed a few times.

[JCL]

Glad to meet another engineer with extensive towing experience.

Yes, the USA is tort happy. I would be aware of my insurance policies towing there (whether or not I was towing over the manufacturer's published load limit). In my simplistic way, I assumed that the overweight trailer would have to be a contributing factor to an accident, and that the simple existence of such trailer would not apportion blame. But then I am not a lawyer.

The thread started with questions about whether the X5 could tow the recommended limit of 6000 lbs. I think it can, and the examples of pushing that limit were to show that the 6000 lb load is very doable, not to recommend that everyone should overload their vehicle. When I have had to move an overweight load, it has been slowly, with precautions up to and including pilot vehicles. I think there is a big difference between a prepared driver towing a heavy load and an unprepared driver towing the same load, whether that load is just under or just over (or way over) the published maximum for the vehicle.

Cheers

Jeff