rough riding

[o. l. t.]

Originally Posted by Jordo

But you had mentioned that if all of the Camber was taken away completely, it wouldnt handle for chit. This confuses me. From what I know, (and I will add my 4 wheel chassis set up has only been for dirt surface race cars/4 wheelers) I disagree.

Your race cars are not 7 feet tall 2 ton SAV's on asphalt. This monster can really benefit from camber. Zero camber on this truck will push at any speed in turns. I live on a mountain and every turn is great thanks to the setup this truck has with negative camber. Not only does it push from rolling the sidewall when you have zero camber, it severely reduces surface contact. This truck is not a tiny car, you don't have to drive it's balls off to see benefits of negative camber. Inertia is what matters and mass makes all the difference. Anyone who says you do is not bothering to take its size and weight into account, which make it drive completely different from a 1500lb aluminum go kart.

As well, due to the truck going into POSITIVE camber over any bumps or inconsistencies that cause the truck to unload the suspension, even as it goes down the freeway at 70 mph, will cause wandering and instability.

[Jordo]

Originally Posted by o. l. t.

Your race cars are not 7 feet tall 2 ton SAV's on asphalt. This monster can really benefit from camber. Zero camber on this truck will push at any speed in turns. I live on a mountain and every turn is great thanks to the setup this truck has with negative camber. Not only does it push from rolling the sidewall when you have zero camber, it severely reduces surface contact. This truck is not a tiny car, you don't have to drive it's balls off to see benefits of negative camber. Inertia is what matters and mass makes all the difference. Anyone who says you do is not bothering to take its size and weight into account, which make it drive completely different from a 1500lb aluminum go kart.

As well, due to the truck going into POSITIVE camber over any bumps or inconsistencies that cause the truck to unload the suspension, even as it goes down the freeway at 70 mph, will cause wandering and instability.

Interesting. What your saying does make sence. But what I'm having a hard time understanding is the wheels ability to "change it's camber"
In a turn as you used as an example.

So hear me out and let me know you think....

Visualize our X5 from behind it with no body on it. Now let's visualize the rear suspension and wheel. We see the control arms, air bag system AND axle.
And let's not forget we have some serious camber on that wheel.
Now in your mind, keeping the chassis level (parallel) with the ground, let's go ahead and lift the rear wheel simulating a bump. The camber that it had WILL maintain the same amount through out the suspension stroke.

And from how I understand what your telling me the camber (in my words) "flatten out" as the suspension stroke compresses.

For the camber to flatten out you would need a pivot point on the control arms to move right and left to give you varying amounts of camber. (like what the adj. do for an alignment)

Am I communicating my self? In order for the wheel to sit flat on the road when it's deep in the stroke would require the rising rate to be variable. And that is not on our X5's.

Maybe a better example would be a car that was lowered, excessively. With no alignment correction. That wheel would look similar to what we have. The FIXED pivot points prevent the wheel from changing is camber. Am I making any sence as to how I'm visualizing this?

Granted 99% of my work is dirt related, and is usually motocross bikes and quads, but I still feel the wheel does. It have the ability to adj. Mid stroke.

Let me know what your thinking. Maybe I am misunderstanding what your describing.

Thanks for your time.

[o. l. t.]

You answered your own question already. Lowering (or raising) a car changes it's camber showing that camber does indeed change as the suspension does. Your problem is that you are looking for this mechanical action to take place when it is simple geometry. That's where there are upper AND lower control arms. Their offset determines the amount of camber change happens. It is the vertical equivalent of bump steer.

[nom3rcy]

You have to take body roll into account also.

[Jordo]

Good chat guys. Thx for your input.