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  #41  
Old 05-19-2013, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by X5SND View Post
Do you feel the shimmy by your feet? Does it go away/get worse/remain constant (intensity) under braking. I'm skeptical it would be the corrosion on the caliper piston before say a sticking caliper causing uneven pad wear/transfer to the rotor. How are u suspension wise in the rear? If your shimmy is coming through the seat bottom not the wheel or pedals, I'd start looking into the rear.
I'm skeptical of the caliper too now that I mention it, since the brakes were flushed, my rotor and wheel don't get excessively hot either. I guess I'll paint the calipers after all!

Braking doesn't affect the shimmy/vibrations at all, I had that before redoing the front end, but no more. You're right it does come more through the floor than anything, like I said I can feel the slight shakes in the passenger seat being transferred through if I'm putting my hand on it.

Unaffected by speed, maybe a tiny bit worse on highway but that just could be since I'm going faster.

Tie rods are the only thing left original on the front end (besides the left side wheel bearing), rear is original as far as I know, mechanic said when I did my front suspension parts that the rear parts looked good and tight but when I change my hub rings in the rear (aluminum instead of plastic) I'll give the wheel a tug. Could my need for an alignment cause the slight shakes? Or tie rods? Or the left bearing on the front which isn't making noises like the right but may have some wear anyway?

I'm hoping to put off redoing the rear suspension parts for another year or so if possible. Might do Dave's subframe bushing tool rental and get those out of the way first since those are easy and cheap.

I'm ok with the way it is, steering wheel doesn't shake so I'm happy with that, its just very slight, even my wife said its barely noticeable. I can live with it for a while until I start tackling the rear, just was wondering opinions on if it could be caused by the following outstanding items:

1) Left front wheel bearing (original and not making noise, but not fresh like the front right bearing)
2) Tie rods in front (last remaining original front suspension item)
3) Much needed 4 wheel alignment (could I be getting vibes from camber/toe being out of wack, I never got alignment after front suspension because I found out I needed to do my front bearings and didn't want to align twice)
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2003 X5 3.0i 5-Speed - Born on 9/18/2003
105k miles -Topaz Blue/Schwarz/Titan Int. Trim/EHCII/Sport
Proud 3-Pedal owner, UUC SS/AFE/4.8iS Exhaust/Sharked
2013 X5 35D (CEO's) - Born on 5/17/2013 -
68k miles - Alpine White/Cinnamon Brown/Premium Pkg, Sport Activity/Premium Pkg and Sound/20" Style 214/Running Boards

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  #42  
Old 05-19-2013, 10:18 AM
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I replaced both wheel bearings recently and took the hubs to the local machine shop to have the bearings pressed in. I even printed out and brought the instructions (from BMW) for the technician. An hour and $20 later, the new bearings are pressed in.

But I think he Brinneled one of the bearings, as it failed within about 100 miles (the steering went funky and the wheel itself had play in it. You could grab the tire and move the wheel from side to side by 1/2" or more).

This time around, I just bought an entire spindle assembly off a junked X5 and bolted it on. It took about a half-hour and was a lot easier (and cheaper) than replacing the bearing itself.

The bearings on these cars seem to last a good long time - 150,000 miles or more.

It is not easy to press the bearings in, as the housing has an odd shape, and working around the dust shield isn't easy either. I ended up cutting the thin part of the dust shield so it could be removed and reinstalled without taking the hub off the spindle (crazy design, but BMW must have had their reasons).


Wheel shimmy is a heartbreaking problem. I had the infamous E36 shimmy problem and I rebuilt the entire front end, even a new rack and pinion. It still came on, at about 60 mph.

Turns out the tires (Michelin MXV) were about 8 years old, and even though they had lots of tread, they had dry rotted and were hard as a rock. I swapped the tires with my other E36 (which were new) and the problem mysteriously transferred to the other car.

P.S. - I notice that the new X5s (E70) have integrated hub assemblies. The hub and bearing are one piece and it simply bolts onto the spindle with four bolts. Anyone can swap these out with your basic Craftsman socket set - no special tools needed, other than the axle socket. I used to make these types of assemblies at New-Departure Hyatt Bearings, back in the early 1980's, for the GM B and C cars. The E70 bearings look suspiciously similar. After finding Delphi struts on the front of my car, nothing would surprise me, though.
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  #43  
Old 05-19-2013, 03:53 PM
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I would think that if your alignment was that off or tierods that worn, you would definitely notice some drivability issues --- wandering, in-precise steering and the need for constant correction; this on top of the usual tire wear that would be associated with alignment. I still can't believe at 66k your wheel bearing was toast....I'm at about 115k (187k km) and mine are still silent.

When you got your wheels RF balanced, did you get the results? I know with mine, while one was a marginal pass, it was still out enough that would have been felt on the roadster speed.

So to get to your list....
1) doubtful, wheel bearings generally make noise when worn.
2) again, doubtful, you would notice your x wandering around with loose tierods.
3) Maybe, but unlikely. The first sign of this causing any sort of issue would be evident on the tire (cupping or uneven tread wear). As with #2 though, if it was that far out, you would/should be able to discern something is out driving around.

I stand by my opinion that since the wheel is not translating any of the vibe, that your issue is not in the front but elsewhere...but I'm not expert! Lol.
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  #44  
Old 05-19-2013, 09:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X5SND View Post
I would think that if your alignment was that off or tierods that worn, you would definitely notice some drivability issues --- wandering, in-precise steering and the need for constant correction; this on top of the usual tire wear that would be associated with alignment. I still can't believe at 66k your wheel bearing was toast....I'm at about 115k (187k km) and mine are still silent.

When you got your wheels RF balanced, did you get the results? I know with mine, while one was a marginal pass, it was still out enough that would have been felt on the roadster speed.

So to get to your list....
1) doubtful, wheel bearings generally make noise when worn.
2) again, doubtful, you would notice your x wandering around with loose tierods.
3) Maybe, but unlikely. The first sign of this causing any sort of issue would be evident on the tire (cupping or uneven tread wear). As with #2 though, if it was that far out, you would/should be able to discern something is out driving around.

I stand by my opinion that since the wheel is not translating any of the vibe, that your issue is not in the front but elsewhere...but I'm not expert! Lol.
Yes you are the expert Spencer since you just did your rear end suspension!

Thanks for the inputs, yes at my mileage I'm not feeling the looseness that loose tie rods would give, the X doesn't wander much or need constant correction either. I put on my 168s with Proxes STII's in July of last year and probably put about 2k on them max, shortly after I got my wheels I redid the front suspension, and since I needed to do my wheel bearing I didn't get aligned after that, and basically parked the car until I did my bearing so I wouldn't wear the still basically new tires unevenly.

And I know you have almost double the mileage I do, but you wouldn't believe it unless you drove this car a week ago and drove it last night with silence! The vibes and the wum-wum-wum sound as soon as I hit 40 mph and continued no matter how fast above I went, was ridiculous! Made the car undrivable.

I assume the right front bearing went bad before I bought the car, when the air struts were old (before I replaced with Arnotts) and the previous owner drove over a nasty pothole or something when the front was "slammed" and maybe gave excessive wear to that side and I really didn't notice when I first bought it but over the last year WOW did it get loud. Only reason I can tell for 100% certainty that 95% of my vibes/humming noises came from 1 wheel bearing, right front. And yes, still at 69k miles as of today!



I'm assuming some rear end suspension parts are showing signs of wear, bushings deteriorating, etc, as my whole front suspension parts replacement made the car completely different than it was when I bought in Dec. 2011. Worn subframe bushings transfer vibes at all?

EDIT: S, Sorry but after a highway drive this AM I will say that my vibrations also get transferred into the steering wheel, although not terrible, it is noticed. Since the vibes are noticeably reduced from replacing my right front wheel bearing, I am doing the left front for good measure, as I suspect the left one is not far behind, and these vibes I'm feeling from a bearing that has play in it will eventually turn into a roar like the right side had.

My buddy who balanced my wheels and is Master tech at Lexus said he would recheck the wheels for me if I wanted him too but they all checked out and balanced out fine. I will shake the tires tonight as I need to put the other 3 metal hub rings on my wheels anyway, just check for play in the rears, and look for play on left bearing in front.

He also told me vibes I'm feeling might be slight but if there is play in the existing original bearing in the front that its possible that would transfer the vibes in the drivetrain, and since the right front side is tight it is making the left side having slight looseness more apparent. He said bearings go over time so I might drive with slight vibrations now but in a few months it might end up making ridiculous noise like the right one did.


Thoughts?
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2003 X5 3.0i 5-Speed - Born on 9/18/2003
105k miles -Topaz Blue/Schwarz/Titan Int. Trim/EHCII/Sport
Proud 3-Pedal owner, UUC SS/AFE/4.8iS Exhaust/Sharked
2013 X5 35D (CEO's) - Born on 5/17/2013 -
68k miles - Alpine White/Cinnamon Brown/Premium Pkg, Sport Activity/Premium Pkg and Sound/20" Style 214/Running Boards


Last edited by Ricky Bobby; 05-20-2013 at 10:28 AM.
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  #45  
Old 05-20-2013, 11:57 AM
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Bummer! If you're gettin wheel shakes, that's definitive of something a miss in the front for sure! I suppose that the optimistic way to look at it is that hopefully it'll be one of those 2 birds, 1 stone deals--- Both wheel bearings will have been changed, and *hopefully* resolve all your vibration issues as well! Personally when it comes to things suspension/drive line related I like to do both sides; so I'd probably do the other bearing for 2 reasons...1) you already did the right side, 2) Given the state of the one you already did, this one may not be far behind....especially if the symptoms you remedied on the right are now present on the left. I know you're a busy man, but its a job that could be easily knocked off on a nice weekend...t'is the season

As far as the bushings for the rear....I was actually surprised at my rear subframe bushings (and LCA bushings as well actually) when we pulled them out. They weren't that bad -- still intact; no where near what some of the nightmare pics on this site show. That being said however, you could tell right away that while there wasn't any visible catastrophic failure, the rubber had become ROCK hard over the years. Within the first couple seconds of getting on the road you could immediately tell the difference. There was much less road vibration/noise transferred to the cabin than before....brought the 'luxury' back to the ride if you will.
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  #46  
Old 05-20-2013, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X5SND View Post
Bummer! If you're gettin wheel shakes, that's definitive of something a miss in the front for sure! I suppose that the optimistic way to look at it is that hopefully it'll be one of those 2 birds, 1 stone deals--- Both wheel bearings will have been changed, and *hopefully* resolve all your vibration issues as well! Personally when it comes to things suspension/drive line related I like to do both sides; so I'd probably do the other bearing for 2 reasons...1) you already did the right side, 2) Given the state of the one you already did, this one may not be far behind....especially if the symptoms you remedied on the right are now present on the left. I know you're a busy man, but its a job that could be easily knocked off on a nice weekend...t'is the season

As far as the bushings for the rear....I was actually surprised at my rear subframe bushings (and LCA bushings as well actually) when we pulled them out. They weren't that bad -- still intact; no where near what some of the nightmare pics on this site show. That being said however, you could tell right away that while there wasn't any visible catastrophic failure, the rubber had become ROCK hard over the years. Within the first couple seconds of getting on the road you could immediately tell the difference. There was much less road vibration/noise transferred to the cabin than before....brought the 'luxury' back to the ride if you will.
Thanks for the words S, will definitely be doing the left side too, will be much quicker now that I know what I'm doing. Plus I took the time to dremel off the rust off the hub on the right side, replaced the dust cover, etc, and really cleaned it all off well. I'm also going to replace hub rings with aluminum on the other 3 wheels (already did on right front) and make sure lug nuts are set to 101 ft lbs.

Exactly what I am thinking as well about the subframe bushings, the rubber just dries out completely, and with 10 years on my X and seeing salty winters like you do, I believe mine could use changing as well

Tis the season is right, got my spark plugs changed over the weekend and noticeably smoother startups and idle were gained right away! Now I have to do lower intake boot for preventative maintenance of a leak, chase down my ABS/DSC/BRAKE trifecta (might be ABS module or wheel sensor I have to do testing), and then after that I can finally paint my calipers with G2 caliper paint and get my cluster pixels repaired.

I told you I had tons to do before my headlight project can begin, haha
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2003 X5 3.0i 5-Speed - Born on 9/18/2003
105k miles -Topaz Blue/Schwarz/Titan Int. Trim/EHCII/Sport
Proud 3-Pedal owner, UUC SS/AFE/4.8iS Exhaust/Sharked
2013 X5 35D (CEO's) - Born on 5/17/2013 -
68k miles - Alpine White/Cinnamon Brown/Premium Pkg, Sport Activity/Premium Pkg and Sound/20" Style 214/Running Boards

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  #47  
Old 05-20-2013, 01:42 PM
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Jesus, you weren' kidding! On a side note, where did you snag Aluminum hub rings from?
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  #48  
Old 05-20-2013, 01:55 PM
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Jesus, you weren' kidding! On a side note, where did you snag Aluminum hub rings from?

Hub Centric Rings 74 1mm to 72 56mm Metal Hubrings | eBay

Bought from this seller last week
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2013 X5 35D (CEO's) - Born on 5/17/2013 -
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  #49  
Old 05-20-2013, 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Ricky Bobby View Post
Yes you are the expert Spencer since you just did your rear end suspension!

Thanks for the inputs, yes at my mileage I'm not feeling the looseness that loose tie rods would give, the X doesn't wander much or need constant correction either. I put on my 168s with Proxes STII's in July of last year and probably put about 2k on them max, shortly after I got my wheels I redid the front suspension, and since I needed to do my wheel bearing I didn't get aligned after that, and basically parked the car until I did my bearing so I wouldn't wear the still basically new tires unevenly.

And I know you have almost double the mileage I do, but you wouldn't believe it unless you drove this car a week ago and drove it last night with silence! The vibes and the wum-wum-wum sound as soon as I hit 40 mph and continued no matter how fast above I went, was ridiculous! Made the car undrivable.

I assume the right front bearing went bad before I bought the car, when the air struts were old (before I replaced with Arnotts) and the previous owner drove over a nasty pothole or something when the front was "slammed" and maybe gave excessive wear to that side and I really didn't notice when I first bought it but over the last year WOW did it get loud. Only reason I can tell for 100% certainty that 95% of my vibes/humming noises came from 1 wheel bearing, right front. And yes, still at 69k miles as of today!



I'm assuming some rear end suspension parts are showing signs of wear, bushings deteriorating, etc, as my whole front suspension parts replacement made the car completely different than it was when I bought in Dec. 2011. Worn subframe bushings transfer vibes at all?

EDIT: S, Sorry but after a highway drive this AM I will say that my vibrations also get transferred into the steering wheel, although not terrible, it is noticed. Since the vibes are noticeably reduced from replacing my right front wheel bearing, I am doing the left front for good measure, as I suspect the left one is not far behind, and these vibes I'm feeling from a bearing that has play in it will eventually turn into a roar like the right side had.

My buddy who balanced my wheels and is Master tech at Lexus said he would recheck the wheels for me if I wanted him too but they all checked out and balanced out fine. I will shake the tires tonight as I need to put the other 3 metal hub rings on my wheels anyway, just check for play in the rears, and look for play on left bearing in front.

He also told me vibes I'm feeling might be slight but if there is play in the existing original bearing in the front that its possible that would transfer the vibes in the drivetrain, and since the right front side is tight it is making the left side having slight looseness more apparent. He said bearings go over time so I might drive with slight vibrations now but in a few months it might end up making ridiculous noise like the right one did.


Thoughts?
Hey Ricky,

I also have the little vibration on the steering wheel after replacing all my front suspension parts. The only thing that I have not done is getting a 4 wheels alignment. I have been trying to figure it out where exactly it is coming from because it only happen when I am braking at a very slow speed. The vehicle don't vibrate, it is straight thru the steering wheel. Brake rotors and pad are almost new and they were working fine until I put my summer tire set on. I am taking to the dealer next week to see if a 4 wheel alignment will do the trick.
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  #50  
Old 05-21-2013, 08:20 AM
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Originally Posted by ArmyX5 View Post
Hey Ricky,

I also have the little vibration on the steering wheel after replacing all my front suspension parts. The only thing that I have not done is getting a 4 wheels alignment. I have been trying to figure it out where exactly it is coming from because it only happen when I am braking at a very slow speed. The vehicle don't vibrate, it is straight thru the steering wheel. Brake rotors and pad are almost new and they were working fine until I put my summer tire set on. I am taking to the dealer next week to see if a 4 wheel alignment will do the trick.
usually you get the vibrations when braking from the thrust arm bushings but i'm assuming you replaced those and torqued the bushing with the wheels on the ground? My vibes are slight as well and like I said I still have to do the other side wheel bearing, hoping when I complete that I will have 2 new "tight" bearings and get a 4 wheel alignment and that should cure it.

Other than that my buddy at Lexus is going to re-check my wheel balanace if I still get vibes after the alignment.
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2003 X5 3.0i 5-Speed - Born on 9/18/2003
105k miles -Topaz Blue/Schwarz/Titan Int. Trim/EHCII/Sport
Proud 3-Pedal owner, UUC SS/AFE/4.8iS Exhaust/Sharked
2013 X5 35D (CEO's) - Born on 5/17/2013 -
68k miles - Alpine White/Cinnamon Brown/Premium Pkg, Sport Activity/Premium Pkg and Sound/20" Style 214/Running Boards

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