Hate to say it, but the 4.8is may have to go.

[Sweep_the_Leg]

Originally Posted by TerminatorX5

incorporate, make a business plan, take a loan in name of newly incorporatted business, pay off loan from business proceeds - keep the car

You're not going to find many banks who will hand out loans to newly formed businesses with no collateral and no personal guarantees.

[Sweep_the_Leg]

Originally Posted by TwinTurboGTR

I mean, Ive done my best with the company. The last 2 years have been just straight hustling and it had proven to be lucrative, but when companies are asking you to finance their projects, being 180 days late on their invoices, or just straight filing for chapter 11 and then ask me to get in line as a creditor... its just well... a lot. All of the contracts that I have secured are 10+ year contracts which is good... so this will give my pop time to figure out what he wants to do. Whether he wants to sell the company off or find someone to take it over and run it. Either way, the way the company sits now.. its in a good position, just not with me in it.

Do you not have security agreements as part of these contracts? If you're getting purchase-money security interests in whatever products you're making, and filing the appropriate financing statements, then you should be in a much better position if and when your customers do get into financial trouble.

[TwinTurboGTR]

Thanks. I appreciate the kind words. I am trying my best. As far as getting banks involved, my goal was to self finance my new project and not involve any loans. This way once the company does do well as I start it small... then I will get a credit line to either finance bigger items into the business or for emergencies. So really not looking to get a loan.

As far as security agreements... they really arent heard of in the manufacturing portion of aviation. I mean before I even took over the shop, my father would send out the invoice, the companies would pay within 30 days and everything would be good. It wasn't until around '98 when some companies would start to get lazy on paying on time. It would extend to 45, 60, 75, 90 days. Now most are at 90 days and some are at 180 days. Companies also used to purchase their own material, send it to us and then we get to work. Now we are responsible for purchasing material. Our business has a fairly high overhead to begin with. Right off the bat, our overhead is anywhere from 25 to 30% because of tooling. A lot of times we need to purchase new crush rolls for jobs and they are $10K and the job may only be a $40K job. Now crap like that I start working into the bids. So if I go into our inventory room and don't see the appropriate tooling, I will work the tooling into the bid.

These financing statements never stick anyways. My first year I did that. I contacted the 3 companies and drafted out a new policy that invoices needed to be paid within 30 days or we would yank the serial numbers and certification from the parts until parts have been paid. Basically after that statement had gone out... the companies just stopped paying all together and stopped requesting us for bids. Hence why I hauled a$$ and obtained other contracts and kept them all on a tight leash on payment. As soon as they are late, I remove their jobs from the line and drop them to the end of the line until they pay. Once they pay, then they must wait their turn again to have the machine retooled for their particular job, which in turn I charge them for 2 set up fees. So this has worked out well. But the 3 companies are the companies bread and butter. I recently stopped doing bids for DoD and the Department of the Navy because they have invoices that haven't been paid since 1991. The inventory accumulated from DoD and Navy is insane and most of the parts are no longer in use. So basically lost money.

[Ricky Bobby]

The long and short of it, is if you are in business for yourself you are going to be chasing people to cut you checks and make empty promises to pay invoices your whole career.

Hell, people can't pay their utility bills on time in their own homes, you really expect them to pay their invoices on time in business? My father in law runs a process serving agency in North Jersey (I work for him for some side work), and his job basically as boss of the company is to do all the service work for law firms, you think he ever gets paid for the jobs in 30 days? Nope.

Attorneys/legal firms don't want to pay any invoices until cases are settled and money is handed out, which means my FIL gets paid last. One firm he does work for still has unpaid work done from 2007! But they will fax him 30 subpoenas on a Thursday afternoon that have to get done in 24 hours because the deposition is on Tuesday. If he told them "I won't do it until I get paid from previous work" he'd lose them as a client.

So goes the cycle of business in this country, work now, get paid later lol.

[TerminatorX5]

with fed. gov-t clients - get on horn with them, they have to close the books somehow... especially if they did not pay since 1991... you need to be persisitent - we have contracts too, our supplier in NJ, and they get "paid" when the ordered item is "received" in the inventory software... a lot of times item is shipped overseas, the person who ordered the item has been out of country, the item physically is received but nobody is there to "close" the order as the person is now across the globe in another part of the world, the contractor is not paid... once they got too many of those on their books, they just talked to the contract rep, and the issue was resolved - the deals were forcefully "closed" from DC and the contractor got paid...

you need to do so the same with your USG clients...

[TwinTurboGTR]

RB- Yup, exactly right. Nature of business is to chase clients to cut checks... problem is... I'm chasing everybody, meaning the original 3. If just one of them paid on time, I would be ok. But to chase the 3 biggest accounts, the only 3 accounts we had at one point is ridiculous.

Term- Yeah been there tried that. Basically after 2000, the previous invoices that weren't paid, I was basically told to go F myself. Parts were obsolete then and no longer used or amendments were made and the parts no longer worked. I even went the collection route to hire ADP for a year for recovery services... They worked at it for 12 months... out of $1.1 mil outstanding, they were able to recover $63K. Far off from their number that they suggested they could recover which was north of $500K. One of the best and worst clients we have really hurt us in the last 5 years. They moved facilities from NJ to Aberdeen, MD. We had a 25 year contract to rebuild landing gears and wing control actuators. The first 10 years of the contract was gravy... When it was announced they were going to move, they estimated 3 month transition time. 3 months turned into 3 years! Three years of no one picking up the phone, no one knowing when operations would start, etc. After they finally got settled, they lost 90% of their contracts, which in turn affected our bottom line. They have just recently started to ship us landing gears and wing controls again, but at a rate of 6 every 2 or so months. We used to get 20 every month at $22K a pop for the landing gears. They good... They always pay in 30 days, the bad... they dragged ass on the new facility and lost most of their contracts. Always something.

[TwinTurboGTR]

RB- Yup, exactly right. Nature of business is to chase clients to cut checks... problem is... I'm chasing everybody, meaning the original 3. If just one of them paid on time, I would be ok. But to chase the 3 biggest accounts, the only 3 accounts we had at one point is ridiculous.

Term- Yeah been there tried that. Basically after 2000, the previous invoices that weren't paid, I was basically told to go F myself. Parts were obsolete then and no longer used or amendments were made and the parts no longer worked. I even went the collection route to hire ADP for a year for recovery services... They worked at it for 12 months... out of $1.1 mil outstanding, they were able to recover $63K. Far off from their number that they suggested they could recover which was north of $500K. One of the best and worst clients we have really hurt us in the last 5 years. They moved facilities from NJ to Aberdeen, MD. We had a 25 year contract to rebuild landing gears and wing control actuators. The first 10 years of the contract was gravy... When it was announced they were going to move, they estimated 3 month transition time. 3 months turned into 3 years! Three years of no one picking up the phone, no one knowing when operations would start, etc. After they finally got settled, they lost 90% of their contracts, which in turn affected our bottom line. They have just recently started to ship us landing gears and wing controls again, but at a rate of 6 every 2 or so months. We used to get 20 every month at $22K a pop for the landing gears. They good... They always pay in 30 days, the bad... they dragged ass on the new facility and lost most of their contracts. Always something.

[pezho405]

Originally Posted by TwinTurboGTR

...

WHat about you Pez?

Beer on Pour(Rozliv? not quite sure the english word).
There are many of these around russia right now, you walk in and theres different fresh beers you can either get cups or bottles of all sorts of sizes. There is also a selection of stuff to go along with it such as Dried fish (Taranka) dried Calmari, other seafood, cheese, dried bread (Suhariki)

Its very popular, lots of people always stop by oine of these on the way out to nature for the weekend or night.

The area we have our place is is good, basically center of city, in a microregion of where people love to drink. There isnt one too close by, also the soccer stadium is close by.

When you get barrel most places mark it up at least 100%

We know some numbers, A really good one that is very busy in a good are gets about ~80.000 rubles PER DAY of which they pocket about 40.000 rub (~$1.200)

Ones that are in a bad area with not much business have been getting 15.000RUb per day, which is still good ~500$
This is close to what we hope to get at least at least.

March and April are the Set up months we have planned to be ready for the summer season.

[Ricky Bobby]

Originally Posted by pezho405

Beer on Pour(Rozliv? not quite sure the english word).
There are many of these around russia right now, you walk in and theres different fresh beers you can either get cups or bottles of all sorts of sizes. There is also a selection of stuff to go along with it such as Dried fish (Taranka) dried Calmari, other seafood, cheese, dried bread (Suhariki)

Its very popular, lots of people always stop by oine of these on the way out to nature for the weekend or night.

The area we have our place is is good, basically center of city, in a microregion of where people love to drink. There isnt one too close by, also the soccer stadium is close by.

When you get barrel most places mark it up at least 100%

We know some numbers, A really good one that is very busy in a good are gets about ~80.000 rubles PER DAY of which they pocket about 40.000 rub (~$1.200)

Ones that are in a bad area with not much business have been getting 15.000RUb per day, which is still good ~500$
This is close to what we hope to get at least at least.

March and April are the Set up months we have planned to be ready for the summer season.

Pez,

The English word for "beer on pour" or rozliv, as you put it in Russian, would be "beer on tap" (just tryin to help you out I know English is 2nd language)

And the equivalent in US to what you describe in Russia would be a brew pub, beer hall, microbrewery, etc, all with many different craft beer selections and usually some food available etc. Craft brewing has become huge in the US over the past few years, just in New Jersey alone I recognize that 6 years ago if you were looking for craft beer from this country you could get Samuel Adams and maybe a couple others, now the coolers in liquor stores are filled with tons of different brands, styles etc, basically fighting for shelf room with wine selection nowadays. Its great for beer drinkers.

Are you starting a microbrewery in the motherland?

[TerminatorX5]

I think it is also sometimes called incorrectly as draft beer while the correct way should be draught, even though, pronounced almost the same...

I think, what Artem is describing, would probably be called a beer hall... I remember some in Moscow, that had automated dispensing machines, like vending machines - you drop xx amount of coins, stick your vessel (usually a 3 liter jar - "banka") and it fills the jar up... you could also get some hot dogs without buns, "sosiski" with some nuclear mustard (I love that mustard, it makes you grow hair on your chest!!!)

given the customer base in russia who drinks beer, i don't think a pub or a microbrewery will survive...