2012 35d ECU upgrade or JBD tuner?

[m3the01]

Hi All,

Not much info on this topic as of late,

Any thoughts on the best ECU upgrade / retune or just go for the JBD and run at 75%?

LMK, craving a little more from the diesel.

[Jyohay]

if you have warranty go for the JBD for ease of servicing.
If you are out of warranty and will never be going back to the dealer, then ECU tune is fine.
you will get more performance out of a full ecu tune.
unless unlimited unflash and reflash or at a reasonable cost from a local tuner is an option, i wouldnt want to deal with the headache

[m3the01]

I've heard renntech tune is undetectable at the dealer.

What are the options as of late?

[bawareca]

Originally Posted by m3the01

I've heard renntech tune is undetectable at the dealer.

What are the options as of late?

Many tunes could be "undetectable" at the dealer, but to re-flash EDC17CP09 (this is our diesel computers family) you need to open the DDE physically or drill a decent size hole in it, so the intrusion will be physically detectable. Of course any part of the warranty may never come to that, but you never know.

[Duc Hunter]

Been through the "undetectable" tune on an Audi. They are ALL detectable if the OEM knows how to look. Audi has checksums they look at, and to catch them all, and reset them all with a tune is next to impossible.

I am not SURE on BMW, but I would say in general, if you are under warranty don't do it, if you are not then it is the best way to go.

[bawareca]

Originally Posted by Duc Hunter

Been through the "undetectable" tune on an Audi. They are ALL detectable if the OEM knows how to look. Audi has checksums they look at, and to catch them all, and reset them all with a tune is next to impossible.

I am not SURE on BMW, but I would say in general, if you are under warranty don't do it, if you are not then it is the best way to go.

A modern engine computer will not even start the car ,or even communicate, if the checksums are messed-up. This was a problem 10 years ago. Nowadays a chinese clone tool will correct the checksums whe writing in the ECU.
Audi "OEM"s are at a level to not be able to distinguish interior equipment diagram from electrical diagram. Not all of them of course, but I bet 90% wont be able to show you which is "Master" and which is "Slave" computer at a first glance. And if you ask them for the checksum they will send you to the cashier to pay the bill The other dealers of course are not in the business of fixing cars, but at least have some traditions in educating technicians. VAG cars are really popular from 5 years ago or so, and getting extremely complicated, so it will take a very long time until you will be able to find people with a real knowledge of these cars.

[Ozer]

What kind of numbers are possible with the ECU tune versus JBD?
I know JBD gives you up to 60+ HP 100Tq, idk what an ECU tune gives and costs.

Id love to get more power from my Diesel as well

[bawareca]

Originally Posted by Ozer

What kind of numbers are possible with the ECU tune versus JBD?
I know JBD gives you up to 60+ HP 100Tq, idk what an ECU tune gives and costs.

Id love to get more power from my Diesel as well

Again, it is not about the numbers. You can probably add another 50% with JBD or tune, but what is the price you will pay in a long term?

[Duc Hunter]

Anyone interested can simply look up Audi TD1, and read all about how Audi started catching previously "undetectable" tunes. They leverage checksums in the software, among other things. Basically there are a range of checksums that can be "ok" and enable the car to run. Within that range though Audi has a specific set that must be exact, based on the version of the code you have in your ECU. Any variance from theirs flags your car as TD1...meaning the ECU was tampered with. The ONLY people permitted to flash an Audi ECU and not void the cars warranty are Audi. And when they do it they track which tune is in it. They will even flag you car TD1 even if a factory tune is currently in the car....if that tune is one they had already flashed out (meaning they installed a different version I'm your car at some point). The worst part is when you car is flagged TD1 Audi flags most of your warranty as void. This includes the ECU (obviously), the electrical system (because it is connected to the ECU), the Engine/exhaust/emissions, the tranny, the diff's....don't take my word for it (as a previous Audi owner) read up on TD1....

Yes, their are several laws that prevent this, and should limit Audi to only being able to void the ECU warranty...and maybe a few obvious parts. And yes, these same laws require Audi to PROVE the ECU tune caused the issue they are refusing the warranty BEFORE they do so.....and the reality is Audi has more lawyers than most of the companies we work for have employees, and then include the dealers own attorneys...we are talking tens of thousands world wide....and they have DEEP pockets....so unless we want to get a lawyering fight them in court (which no one ever does) they win.

Now BMW may not be as advanced or draconian as Audi has become.....I am not as familiar with BMW's behavior yet. I just believe in making informed decisions, and there is no reason BMW cannot do the same thing as Audi (and all the VAG companies (Porsche, Bentley, Lamborghini, VW, Skoda, etc) are doing.

So....as I was saying...if you have factory warranty left I thought not tune. If you have an extended warranty (factory ENVER offer this, they are dealer sold items provided by independent warranty companies) check with them first. If you are out of warranty, go for it. Tunes can be a HUGE gain, and when done properly are amazing and do not harm your vehicle at all. As has been mentioned though, a tune from a fly0by-night shop can do a lot of damage.

Originally Posted by bawareca

A modern engine computer will not even start the car ,or even communicate, if the checksums are messed-up. This was a problem 10 years ago. Nowadays a chinese clone tool will correct the checksums whe writing in the ECU.
Audi "OEM"s are at a level to not be able to distinguish interior equipment diagram from electrical diagram. Not all of them of course, but I bet 90% wont be able to show you which is "Master" and which is "Slave" computer at a first glance. And if you ask them for the checksum they will send you to the cashier to pay the bill The other dealers of course are not in the business of fixing cars, but at least have some traditions in educating technicians. VAG cars are really popular from 5 years ago or so, and getting extremely complicated, so it will take a very long time until you will be able to find people with a real knowledge of these cars.

[bawareca]

I agree with everything you wrote. VAG is spending a lot of time and money on T-prot indeed.
I wrote that some tunes MAY be undetectable for the BMW dealer level tools, but I would not advice anyone with car under BMW warranty to do reflash.