2010 X5 35d - won't start after injector replacement

[ninja_zx11]

Glad you got it cranking again.Yes it could well be the CAS.I am sure you will find the culprit soon...

[ingenieur]

If it cranks then the key is recognized. The DDE and CAS are VIN specific for EWS4 handshake - no synch.
What faults are stored now?
Most importantly readout the memory from the DDE with the description and conditions.

[torqueisking]

I've found some conflicting info about EWS4. One POV is as you've noted - crank = EWS4 ok, no EWS4 sync - uses handshake. The other says that the CAS controls cranking and the DDE controls fuel so the CAS can recognize the key and allow cranking but if it doesn't return a valid value to the DDE based on the encryption key, it won't start the engine.

And there's more conflicting info! When I check the EWS status using the DDE73 script in INPA, I receive a "RELEASE OF IGNITION AND INJECTION ISSUED (CHALLENGE RESPONSE SUCCESSFUL)". Great but recently a single 4C18 error code appeared in the DDE error memory which indicates that there is a problem with the receipt of the terminal 15 based message from the CAS. I guess I believe the latter because it won't start!

That fault doesn't appear when reading the errors via "functional jobs". No faults shown in that report, the CAS or EWS4 error report.

Rheingold on the way...hope that helps.

[ninja_zx11]

Originally Posted by torqueisking

I've found some conflicting info about EWS4. One POV is as you've noted - crank = EWS4 ok, no EWS4 sync - uses handshake. The other says that the CAS controls cranking and the DDE controls fuel so the CAS can recognize the key and allow cranking but if it doesn't return a valid value to the DDE based on the encryption key, it won't start the engine.

And there's more conflicting info! When I check the EWS status using the DDE73 script in INPA, I receive a "RELEASE OF IGNITION AND INJECTION ISSUED (CHALLENGE RESPONSE SUCCESSFUL)". Great but recently a single 4C18 error code appeared in the DDE error memory which indicates that there is a problem with the receipt of the terminal 15 based message from the CAS. I guess I believe the latter because it won't start!

That fault doesn't appear when reading the errors via "functional jobs". No faults shown in that report, the CAS or EWS4 error report.

Rheingold on the way...hope that helps.

How did you make INPA to work on E70 35D?Did you add DDE73KWP.IPO and DDE73KWP.INI files to C:\EC-APPS\INPA\SGDAT folder and then added entry in E70.eng to get DDE7 for M57 engine in INPA menu?Was it in English?INPA never worked for me on my E70 35D.

[torqueisking]

Originally Posted by ninja_zx11

How did you make INPA to work on E70 35D?Did you add DDE73KWP.IPO and DDE73KWP.INI files to C:\EC-APPS\INPA\SGDAT folder and then added entry in E70.eng to get DDE7 for M57 engine in INPA menu?Was it in English?INPA never worked for me on my E70 35D.

That's exactly what I did. The DDE73KWP.IPO script is in German and apparently an English version does not exist.

You'll see a German error message after choosing the DDE73 script. It says there's a language mismatch. Ignore that. Click the left button (ok) and the first DDE73 menu should appear.

[ninja_zx11]

After reading some other posts it looks like INPA somehow disturbed DDE and EWS/CAS. Not my work but you can try this:I found it here.
1- Launch inpa
2- Select the engine
3- Choose the model of the engine
4- Select option: activate
5- Select option: EWS (Or CAS.not sure??)
6- Select option: reset ----> in progress ----> click ok
7- Back to the main menu, ie, back, back, back, and close the INPA
8- Open the inpa and check the errors. That errors should have gone by now.
9- Turn the ignition off, remove the obd connector and start your car.

[torqueisking]

Thanks for the suggestion and help.

Spent hours and hours scouring the internet for solutions. Most no start forum posts are for pre-2008 vehicles. The 2010 uses EWS4 which, according to BMW technical documentation, does not require manual syncing to the DDE. They auto-sync via handshaking over CAN. Attempting to use the EWS reset in INPA unfortunately results in an error message stating that no reset is possible because it is EMS4.

I'll likely just end up re-flashing the DDE as that seems to be the culprit.

It would be nice to know what specifically caused this!

[ninja_zx11]

Originally Posted by torqueisking

Thanks for the suggestion and help.

Spent hours and hours scouring the internet for solutions. Most no start forum posts are for pre-2008 vehicles. The 2010 uses EWS4 which, according to BMW technical documentation, does not require manual syncing to the DDE. They auto-sync via handshaking over CAN. Attempting to use the EWS reset in INPA unfortunately results in an error message stating that no reset is possible because it is EMS4.

I'll likely just end up re-flashing the DDE as that seems to be the culprit.

It would be nice to know what specifically caused this!

You are welcome bud!!

I can only guess that INPA did something because its not meant to work on our E70 with M57.We made it work by editing it and that's what i think caused it

Try to work with Rheingold before going to reflashing route.Rheingold might be able to shed some light on this issue..

[torqueisking]

Finally got Rheingold. I really recommend this software over INPA.

Didn't take long to focus in on what is happening...or not happening.

All the controllers tested and they all passed. No error codes.

All voltages and buses tested and passed.

Ran the EKP (low pressure fuel pump) controller. No issues.

Ran the HP fuel rail test. No fuel pressure reading. With INPA, the pressure reading "blipped" so I thought it was ok.

Final confirmation was removal of one injector feed line and crank. Dry.

The diagnostic text in Rheingold is so helpful. No searching the internet. It's all right there. As noted in Rheingold, the DDE won't activate the HPFP or injectors if it detects a problem with the fuel pressure rail feedback loop (actuator and sensor).

A quick visual check of the rail didn't reveal any issues. Next step is to check the resistance between the wires at the actuator, sensor and the DDE. I'll also test them on the bench.

It's unfortunate that the DDE didn't throw a DTC to confirm there's a problem with the HP fuel system.

[bawareca]

Originally Posted by torqueisking

Finally got Rheingold. I really recommend this software over INPA.

I have read some speculations how the system works, so I'll throw a quick explanation how the EWS works. Starting EWS3 and all the way to 2008 models, there are 2 forms of identification between EWS(CAS) and DME/DDE- ISN number which is permanent and doesnt change and is OTP(one time programmable) and a rolling code which changes everytime the engine is started. Up to 2008 the ISN is 2 byte code. Blank (brand new) modules can be purchased from BMW and programmed with the respective ISN after the module is installed on the car. Starting 2008 ISN changes to 16 byte (128 bit encryption, same as one visits a bank site, etc) and is specific to each car and known only to BMW. This means that blank modules cannot be purchased anymore. they are ordered by VIN and come pre-prgrammed with the specific data. Rolling code still exists. In certain conditions the EWS and DME/DME can loose sync on the rolling code and can be re-synced with the function EWS/CAS-DME/DDE adjustment -->reset start value.
In any case, if there is a problem there the DME/DDE will throw a code "EWS interface manipulation".
The keys were stored in the CAS only until some time in 2011. After that new CAS firmware(s) were released and the key has to be registered in the DME/DDE also. I am not exactly sure, but if the key is not recognized by the DME/DDE the car may not start without throwing a code for manipulation.