New Diesels to come: high diesel fuel costs - Page 4

ron_jeremy · #1 11-21-2007, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fastbuck

The 3.0 twin turbo diesel engine has been in existance longer than the 3.0 twin turbo petrol engine. Neither does it exhibit the negative characteristics you describe. The diesel will far outlast the petrol engine.

Long time since i've been here, and diesel talking makes me interested.
I've owned 8 BMW, the latter is a Diesel, all the others, have been petrol engines.
I've dumped my E90 because of my son (1 month today

)
And bought a E39 530Dat, the very same engine that's in the E53 over here in Europe (01-04)
In my car it's original 193 hk and 410Nm of torque, this can as you all know, be increased substantial by a chip.
The engine are very smooth, it has a nice grunt to it, so when you floor it, it sounds more like a V8, than a diesel.
Now, just two weeks ago i tried the new TT diesel's from BMW, a E61 335Dat, and the E92 335D.
What an awsome engine, quiet, no vibrations, just lot's and lot's of torque and power, but it's the way it's been delivered that is so impressive.
So diesel has come a long way.
Just think of it, 286 hk, and 580 Nm of torque, and this can be increased significantly.
and the milage, i've tried to push imy car, driving in the city, i just can't get it over 1 liter pr mile (10km), the nicest figure i've seen is 0.80, on the highway, it's 0.60.
So if/when the diesel arrives, be sure to test it first, here in europe, it's a no brainer, even if the diesel should cost as much or a bit more than the petrol.

tornado · #2 11-21-2007, 04:34 PM

quite interesting to read your discussions abt diesel as i am driving diesels since abt 10 years and don't want to change back to petrols not only because of economics but also for bigger torque on low revs and more fun. My consumption with E70 3.0d engine is abt 22,5 mpg
(10,5 ltrs/100km) but thats including high speed on autobahn with a lot of full speed driving (abt 140mls/h or 225km/h). with speed limits like in US i would guess abt 27/28 mpg would not be out unrealistic. A 08 sd will be even more economic due to efficient dynamics, which unfo my car being a 07 doesn't have. on top of lower consumption we also have better prices for diesel against petrol. don't worry abt problems with new engines as this is a autobahntested technique for many years and all early problems meantime solved. i don't expect my engine to live longer than petrols as said before. old taxisdiesels with 90hp might but those highoutput lowweight machines are similar to gas engines.

Judyd · #3 11-17-2007, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JCL

The '08 emissions standards are tougher, hence the need for urea injection on both the MB and BMW models. Expect the mileage to take a hit, but it shouldn't be a big factor. More important to me is that these will be new generation engines, with the related first-year problems. None of the current generation of BMW diesels will meet the '08 standards. When they come out in late '08 (still a rumour, but with the press releases out a pretty safe bet) you can be on the bleeding edge. While BMW has built lots of diesels, they haven't yet built this generation.

Hmmm, rattles on start-up, no revs, first model year for the new engines, and theoretically a reduced engine life due to the higher peak cylinder pressures. Just get a 3.0 twin turbo petrol engine when they come out, IMO.

Thanks, JCL, and others, that was just the kind of info I was looking for. I think I'll pass on the diesels this time around. I've been burned too many times being an "early adopter" and think this is a time to pass on "bleeding edge" for me.

Thunder22 · #4 11-17-2007, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judyd

Thanks, JCL, and others, that was just the kind of info I was looking for. I think I'll pass on the diesels this time around. I've been burned too many times being an "early adopter" and think this is a time to pass on "bleeding edge" for me.

IMHO, if diesel prices go up, unleaded premium will rise proportionally as well...

JCL · #5 11-17-2007, 04:22 PM

Diesel price differences will likely be more due to government taxation rather than the fuel value. In the UK, diesel costs more than petrol due to the road tax structure (unless it has changed recently).

Fuel companies will likely charge more for diesel as they have to build new capacity. However, beyond that upgrade cost, they may charge based on the energy content of the two fuels. On a volumetric basis, diesel has 15% more energy than gasoline. When they get the price adjustments figured out, you should expect to pay more for diesel, up to 15% more. It might be less of a premium than that, we really don't know.

I am not at all against diesels, I work for a company that represents one of the largest diesel engine manufacturers in the world. However, we should calm down the euphoria that diesels are going to cure all our ills. We would make far more progress by driving less, by driving smaller cars, and so on.

Fredo · #6 11-17-2007, 05:30 AM

Diesels are not just about the economy....because of the torque they have and the fact it is produced so low down in the rev range they suit the X5 much better. Yes they rattle a bit on start up and don't sound as good high up the rev range but as an everyday car to drive they are far,far superior. Once you've had a diesel it seems very antequated having to really rev a car to get the performance out of it.

The only BMW petrol engined cars that are superior are the M/// cars. There is a case for the 335i but the 335d is a fantastic car too.

Wagner · #7 11-20-2007, 10:45 AM

I don't know that is viewed a 'cure' as much as it is a much better alternative to what we have now using the same resource. Sort of like a florescent bulb vs a incandescent bulb...same power source, better efficiency.