Will it start or won't it

[London Lad]

Originally Posted by Penguin

No, they are not.

Capacitors are used on AC motors, not on DC motors. An automotive starter is a DC motor.

If you are thinking that the lump on some starter motors which looks similar to the capacitors on large AC motors, it is not -- the lump is the starter solenoid.

Do you have a link or reference to capacitors being built into engine starter motors? If so, I will gladly admit I am in error. But in 44 years of working on engines, I have never seen a starter motor on any engine which used a capacitor.

Add my 42 years to your 44 and that's 86 years that's seen no caps in starter motors on cars.

[Redridge]

MOV's...(caps) are put across coils (solenoids).... they are used as surge supressors. Some starters do have them, and is a common practice.

[ABMW]

London Lad,

See above. They are built into the caps of the motors. Although, some are external.

If you ever get bored and feel like rebuilding a DC motor you'll come across them fairly frequently.

I'm well aware of what a solenoid is.

In any event, getting back on topic, this is my first BMW product.

I decided to do some exploring in the battery compartment. I didn't bother noting where the battery was made, because I'm sure it's internals are sourced from China, not that that is a bad thing.

I don't know if there is space to fit a Optima battery without modification or removal of the storage compartment (I have third-row seats).

Though, it did take me all of 5-minutes to open the compartment up.

Someone mentioned that using a battery tender trickle charger was not an easy proposition? What's the difficulty?

There's certainly room for a second battery to be installed, if the storage compartment were to be removed, but you may run into issues with keeping it charged if there alternator were not upgraded.

I suppose one way to figure out if the car is drawing power from the battery is to simply disconnect the battery or install a temporary kill switch. If the battery is still discharging, there's a possibility the problem is strictly confined to the quality of the battery.

If the battery is no longer discharging, there's a design flaw wherein one electrical component is not shutting down.

What I'm personally aware of that runs when the car is unattended in a parked state:

1) The internal motion detector for the alarm system.
2) If my iPod is connected to the glove compartment USB port, it will continue charging after the car is turned off. I do not know how long this continues. Perhaps it shuts off after a period of time.
3) Some on the board claim the car performs a self-diagnosis every 15 minutes for a period of time, and then switches to a self-diagnosis every hour.
4) We're missing something. Does the BMW keep a connection to BMWNA via a cellular network? Does it continue to listen for incoming messages?

In any event, I agree the car should start. I've not had any troubles whatsoever, thus far. I do not drive my vehicle on the freeway EVERYDAY by any means, and there have been periods of 4 to 5 days whereby I've only driven the car to and from the office (2-miles round trip).

When I looked at the battery indicator it was green, which indicated a fully charged battery according to the code marked on the battery.

Who knows? On the face of it, the battery did not seem all that impressive. I didn't bother looking at the ratings. Maybe I'll look tomorrow, but I'll just replace it with a higher capacity battery, if it gives me trouble.

That is, if there is not a charging issue going on with all of our vehicles.

Either way, if this is truly a widespread problem, BMW is going to have to address it rather quickly or they're going to be finding quite a few buyers using lemon law protections to obtain buybacks.

I certainly don't want to take that route, but I won't hesitate it need be. These are $65 to $75k SAVs. They should be more reliable than Hyundais. Then again, the 2000 Hyundai Santa Fe I bought for a girlfriend back in College (I was dumb and in love), is still running strong, or so I hear and it has never had a single issue.

German automobiles can be, and generally are somewhat finicky vehicles, especially when it comes to the notoriously crappy electronics that they seem to be producing, but keeping a battery charged is about as simplistic as you can get.

I'm very interested to see what takes place if someone installs a kill switch, and leaves their car parked for a few days. If the battery still dies, it's obviously a bad batch of cells, battery cells that is.

Anyway, these are not Toyotas for better or for worse. There are some things you give us. In 2010 I expect my vehicle to start each and every time I turn the key or push the starter switch a 95% reliability rating is unacceptable. I want it to start 100% of the time. If it doesn't that's unacceptable to me, and to most these days.

Hopefully we'll sort this out or it's limited to certain vehicles. Keep the info coming, the more the better.

[GoVols!]

OK. Now that this thread has completely gotten off topic, I'll answer whether the X satrted or not.

Oops. I decided not to try since I didnt want to get out in -22* weather anymore than the X probably did. I sat by the fire all day. It started fine on Sunday in 15*.

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by nynd

I think there is some confusion. In ALL electronic modules used in any vehicle, there are capacitors called "mov's" which have the sole purpose of protecting modules against surge currents when the starter is cranking.

I agree there is some confusion. We are talking about what is in starter motors, not misc electronic modules in the vehicle.

Yes, there are capacitors in the electronic modules in vehicles.

There are not in starter motors.

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by Redridge

MOV's...(caps) are put across coils (solenoids).... they are used as surge supressors. Some starters do have them, and is a common practice.

FYI, the original statement was "Capacitors are built into many starter motors within automobiles today. They assist in the initial rotations of the motor."

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by ABMW

If you ever get bored and feel like rebuilding a DC motor you'll come across them fairly frequently.

I have rebuilt many starters over the years, including motorcycle starters, and have never seen a capacitor in aqny of the starters/

[ard]

Originally Posted by ABMW

The starting systems of most vehicles have capacitors which increase the amperage of the 12v battery within the X5.

To be accurate, the first mention of capacitors is above: IN the staring system, to INCREASE the amperage...in "the X5"



All the rest of the discussion of MOVs and what not ("Metal Oxide Varistors, and NOT capacitors) is due to this poster and others needing to win an argument.

[Thunder22]

Originally Posted by GoVols!

OK. Now that this thread has completely gotten off topic, I'll answer whether the X satrted or not.

Oops. I decided not to try since I didnt want to get out in -22* weather anymore than the X probably did. I sat by the fire all day. It started fine on Sunday in 15*.

let's lock this thread up. it's ridiculous.

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by ard

To be accurate, the first mention of capacitors is above: IN the staring system, to INCREASE the amperage...in "the X5"

You are correct, that was indeed the first mention.