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  #71  
Old 03-22-2016, 05:53 AM
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subscribed. Such great info in here guys. Planning on getting a 2007 4.8i and ran into these problems on the web so im definitely going with my mechanic to check her out before i buy.
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  #72  
Old 06-14-2016, 01:22 PM
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Hey folks. I purchased a 2007 BMW X5 4.8i about 2 years ago, it had 64k on the odometer and is now at 80k. In those meager 16 thousand miles I've had to repair the following:
  • Tail lamp corrosion
  • Alternator bracket gasket leak
  • Both front springs broken
  • Rear airbags leak
  • Water pump leak
  • Valley pan leak
  • Coolant crossover tube replaced
I’m rather intrigued with BMW’s decision to use sadistic midget engineers to design these vehicles. It is rather impressive that they managed to use every fastener known to man, that took some planning. I never knew what an inverted Torx socket was until I tried to do a brake job on this vehicle. I suspect that they are still miffed about the results of that little dust-up 70 years ago so the X5 4.8i is passive-aggressive payback. Touché Germany, touché.



Thank you to gregg3gs for his write-up, it saved me a lot of work (if you are ever in Northern Illinois then ping me, I owe you a steak dinner). I went through this project over Memorial Day weekend this year and it took me almost 24 hours because I hit a few snags (and I’m not the automotive genius my dog thinks I am) . I thought I might post some of my findings in this thread in case it might help the next person.


1) I read one comment that said I wouldn’t need to unclip the passenger side wires from the front of the engine to remove the manifold, this is a false statement. This is because the wires, as they come from the factory, run between the manifold and the fuel line, so to remove the manifold the wires can’t be going through there. I suspect that if you removed the fuel rail then you might not have to unclip all of the wires, but since I had both belts off the front of the engine it seemed simpler to me to unclip all of the wires. When I reassembled everything I ran the wires (green arrow) in front of the fuel line (red arrow) so the wires wouldn’t have to be unclipped from the engine the next time:

Name:  wires1.jpg
Views: 1449
Size:  74.6 KB


The only caveat of doing this is that the breather hose (red arrow) fits tightly against the wires, but everything still went together okay:


Name:  wires2.jpg
Views: 1197
Size:  60.1 KB



Gregg3gs also suggested unclipping the oil sender wire from the bottom of the engine and unthreading the wire up to the top, but I had trouble figuring out how to get it unthreaded through all of the accessories. Later, after I had both belts and the crank pulley off the front of the engine it looked like it would not have been difficult to unclip the wire from the bottom of the engine and pull it out, but I decided to cut the wire (3 wires, actually) and solder on connectors to make it easy to unclip for the next time. I haven’t noticed any negative effects of going this route:


Name:  wires3.jpg
Views: 1088
Size:  17.4 KB


2) The replacement of the water pump would be a relatively simple task if it weren’t for the fact that the bottom bolt is behind the crank pulley (bravo, BMW!). I ended up removing both belts from the pulley and removing the pulley to access the bolt, but removing the A/C belt requires that you relieve the tension from the belt. The tensioner was a big issue for me and I address it next, but I’ve recently read that you can replace the water pump without removing the crank pulley. The trick is to take out all of the bolts except the bottom one, then loosen the bottom one, tip the water pump forward, and that will give you enough room to get the bottom bolt out from behind the crank pulley. To install the new pump you simply work backwards, tip the bottom bolt into position and get it started, then install the rest of the bolts. I think this method could have saved me many hours of additional work (so happy I read about it afterwards). I had to loosen the belt that goes around the crank pulley and the A/C pulley before I could remove the belt, this required loosening the A/C tensioner bracket. I tried the tip about dremeling a slot into the top of the bolt and using a screwdriver, but I couldn’t get the bolt to budge even with a big screwdriver. To get access to the bolt head I had to remove the crank pulley first, then the aluminum bracket that goes in front of the crank pulley. The aluminum bracket is held in with one bolt down low on the block, I had to access it from underneath the vehicle with a crescent wrench. Once that bracket was out I was able to loosen the female Torx bolt using a 3/8” drive ratchet, a 3/8” universal joint, and a 3/8” drive Torx bolt, coming at it from the front of the engine. In the picture below the green arrow is the A/C tensioner pulley, the blue arrow is the tensioner bolt with the slot dremeled into the top (and gooped up with anti-seize for the next time), the red arrow is the crank end where the crank pulley mounts, the yellow arrow is the aluminum bracket that had to be removed, and the pink arrow is the oil sender wire that I mentioned in a previous section:

Name:  ac_tensioner.jpg
Views: 1286
Size:  66.3 KB


3) To remove the manifold bolts I just used a socket with an extension, then a magnet to retrieve the bolts. Reinstallation was a bit trickier, until I used masking tape to hold the nut in the socket. Once the nut is started on the stud then you can just pull off the socket:

Name:  manifold_bolt.jpg
Views: 1666
Size:  21.1 KB

A swivel extension had to be used to reinstall some of the nuts . For removing and installing the manifold I used small bungie cords to hold the electrical boxes up and out of the way. For re-installation I threaded 2 bolts diagonally into the top of the manifold and strung a wire between them, it gave me a handle to hold the manifold.



4) The 3 plugs at the back of the manifold are indeed a fun challenge; I found several things that helped. I removed these bars:


Name:  engine_bay.jpg
Views: 961
Size:  15.2 KB



I found it easier to access the plugs from the driver’s side (I’m right handed, and not an elf). The 2 outside plugs have wire clips that hold them on, the wire needs to be pushed in (towards front of engine) to release the plug. The middle plug has a plastic clip that needs to be pushed in (towards front of engine) to release the plug. The plugs pull down to come off. Kudos to BMW for using every different style of electrical clip ever invented on one vehicle!

Name:  manifold_plugs.jpg
Views: 1280
Size:  35.4 KB


5) I bought the wrong gaskets for the Valvetronic pumps so I just reused the original ones and it doesn't seem to matter. The pumps have a threaded shaft, once you take out the 4 Allen bolts just unscrew the motor and it will come out. Do the converse when installing, just screw it in until flush with the head and then install the 4 Allen bolts.

Name:  valvetronic.jpg
Views: 1072
Size:  8.8 KB


6) There is no radiator drain plug in my X5, I just had to disconnect hoses and try to catch the coolant as it poured out.

7) I didn't need to replace the valley pan bolts, they were not corroded bad. I just had to wire brush the back 2.



8) I used steel wool to clean gasket surfaces, when I did that for the manifold to head surface I got steel shavings in the valve orifices that was hard to clean out. I should have used Scotch-Brite instead.

9) The coolant transfer pipe wasn't leaking yet but I decided to replace it anyways. Upon removal it looked like the front gasket was not holding up well so I'm glad I did. I used the MTS coolant transfer pipe instead of the URO one, I saved $100 but with a catch. I read in an Amazon review that several people had problems getting the pipe to fit inside the front gasket, one reviewer purchased the URO gasket set and it worked better because of a slightly different gasket profile. I purchased the URO gasket set and I'm glad I did; I first tried using the MTS front gasket and couldn't get the pipe to feed in correctly so after 30 minutes I switched to the URO gasket and had it in within minutes. The rear gasket is just an O-ring so the URO one worked fine. I ended up using the URO rear O-ring to replace one from one of the large coolant hoses going to the waterpump.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00HK5ZH8I...JGQ0QJ19VWTXYR


10) When reconnecting the coolant hoses, several of them leaked. I suspect the new water pump (Beck-Arnley) throats were slightly smaller in diameter; that, along with the worn-out coolant hose O-rings, caused the leaks. I bought replacement O-rings from a hardware store and that fixed the issues. Before putting the manifold back on I did a pressure test and the results were disappointing; I put 20 lbs of pressure in the system and after 15 minutes it had dropped to 15 lbs, that is when I found the coolant hose leaks. After fixing them I was still seeing a pressure drop, after 30 minutes it was still losing about 5 lbs of pressure. I could not see any visible leaks so I finally decided the best way to determine where it was leaking was to fill the system with coolant and use the vehicle. I put everything back together and after several weeks I am happy to see that the coolant level is not going down like it used to, and I’m not seeing coolant on my driveway any more. It might have been a leaky pressure testing kit, even though I couldn’t hear or find any leaks.


This was a big endeavor for me, as I said earlier it took me almost 24 hours to complete. I suspect that without some of the hold-ups and with some of the shortcuts it might have been closer to 16 hours. There is a point where you wonder if the vehicle will ever run again and perhaps you should set it on fire, but as long as you label everything and take your time it will work out. Hope this helps somebody else!

Snoopyhat
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  #73  
Old 06-14-2016, 01:54 PM
ard ard is offline
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Well done. Thanks for the contribution. and LOL.
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  #74  
Old 06-15-2016, 03:46 AM
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Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: ny
Posts: 2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopyhat View Post
Hey folks. I purchased a 2007 BMW X5 4.8i about 2 years ago, it had 64k on the odometer and is now at 80k. In those meager 16 thousand miles I've had to repair the following:
  • Tail lamp corrosion
  • Alternator bracket gasket leak
  • Both front springs broken
  • Rear airbags leak
  • Water pump leak
  • Valley pan leak
  • Coolant crossover tube replaced
I’m rather intrigued with BMW’s decision to use sadistic midget engineers to design these vehicles. It is rather impressive that they managed to use every fastener known to man, that took some planning. I never knew what an inverted Torx socket was until I tried to do a brake job on this vehicle. I suspect that they are still miffed about the results of that little dust-up 70 years ago so the X5 4.8i is passive-aggressive payback. Touché Germany, touché.



Thank you to gregg3gs for his write-up, it saved me a lot of work (if you are ever in Northern Illinois then ping me, I owe you a steak dinner). I went through this project over Memorial Day weekend this year and it took me almost 24 hours because I hit a few snags (and I’m not the automotive genius my dog thinks I am) . I thought I might post some of my findings in this thread in case it might help the next person.


1) I read one comment that said I wouldn’t need to unclip the passenger side wires from the front of the engine to remove the manifold, this is a false statement. This is because the wires, as they come from the factory, run between the manifold and the fuel line, so to remove the manifold the wires can’t be going through there. I suspect that if you removed the fuel rail then you might not have to unclip all of the wires, but since I had both belts off the front of the engine it seemed simpler to me to unclip all of the wires. When I reassembled everything I ran the wires (green arrow) in front of the fuel line (red arrow) so the wires wouldn’t have to be unclipped from the engine the next time:

Attachment 69570


The only caveat of doing this is that the breather hose (red arrow) fits tightly against the wires, but everything still went together okay:


Attachment 69571



Gregg3gs also suggested unclipping the oil sender wire from the bottom of the engine and unthreading the wire up to the top, but I had trouble figuring out how to get it unthreaded through all of the accessories. Later, after I had both belts and the crank pulley off the front of the engine it looked like it would not have been difficult to unclip the wire from the bottom of the engine and pull it out, but I decided to cut the wire (3 wires, actually) and solder on connectors to make it easy to unclip for the next time. I haven’t noticed any negative effects of going this route:


Attachment 69572


2) The replacement of the water pump would be a relatively simple task if it weren’t for the fact that the bottom bolt is behind the crank pulley (bravo, BMW!). I ended up removing both belts from the pulley and removing the pulley to access the bolt, but removing the A/C belt requires that you relieve the tension from the belt. The tensioner was a big issue for me and I address it next, but I’ve recently read that you can replace the water pump without removing the crank pulley. The trick is to take out all of the bolts except the bottom one, then loosen the bottom one, tip the water pump forward, and that will give you enough room to get the bottom bolt out from behind the crank pulley. To install the new pump you simply work backwards, tip the bottom bolt into position and get it started, then install the rest of the bolts. I think this method could have saved me many hours of additional work (so happy I read about it afterwards). I had to loosen the belt that goes around the crank pulley and the A/C pulley before I could remove the belt, this required loosening the A/C tensioner bracket. I tried the tip about dremeling a slot into the top of the bolt and using a screwdriver, but I couldn’t get the bolt to budge even with a big screwdriver. To get access to the bolt head I had to remove the crank pulley first, then the aluminum bracket that goes in front of the crank pulley. The aluminum bracket is held in with one bolt down low on the block, I had to access it from underneath the vehicle with a crescent wrench. Once that bracket was out I was able to loosen the female Torx bolt using a 3/8” drive ratchet, a 3/8” universal joint, and a 3/8” drive Torx bolt, coming at it from the front of the engine. In the picture below the green arrow is the A/C tensioner pulley, the blue arrow is the tensioner bolt with the slot dremeled into the top (and gooped up with anti-seize for the next time), the red arrow is the crank end where the crank pulley mounts, the yellow arrow is the aluminum bracket that had to be removed, and the pink arrow is the oil sender wire that I mentioned in a previous section:

Attachment 69569


3) To remove the manifold bolts I just used a socket with an extension, then a magnet to retrieve the bolts. Reinstallation was a bit trickier, until I used masking tape to hold the nut in the socket. Once the nut is started on the stud then you can just pull off the socket:

Attachment 69575

A swivel extension had to be used to reinstall some of the nuts . For removing and installing the manifold I used small bungie cords to hold the electrical boxes up and out of the way. For re-installation I threaded 2 bolts diagonally into the top of the manifold and strung a wire between them, it gave me a handle to hold the manifold.



4) The 3 plugs at the back of the manifold are indeed a fun challenge; I found several things that helped. I removed these bars:


Attachment 69573



I found it easier to access the plugs from the driver’s side (I’m right handed, and not an elf). The 2 outside plugs have wire clips that hold them on, the wire needs to be pushed in (towards front of engine) to release the plug. The middle plug has a plastic clip that needs to be pushed in (towards front of engine) to release the plug. The plugs pull down to come off. Kudos to BMW for using every different style of electrical clip ever invented on one vehicle!

Attachment 69574


5) I bought the wrong gaskets for the Valvetronic pumps so I just reused the original ones and it doesn't seem to matter. The pumps have a threaded shaft, once you take out the 4 Allen bolts just unscrew the motor and it will come out. Do the converse when installing, just screw it in until flush with the head and then install the 4 Allen bolts.

Attachment 69576


6) There is no radiator drain plug in my X5, I just had to disconnect hoses and try to catch the coolant as it poured out.

7) I didn't need to replace the valley pan bolts, they were not corroded bad. I just had to wire brush the back 2.



8) I used steel wool to clean gasket surfaces, when I did that for the manifold to head surface I got steel shavings in the valve orifices that was hard to clean out. I should have used Scotch-Brite instead.

9) The coolant transfer pipe wasn't leaking yet but I decided to replace it anyways. Upon removal it looked like the front gasket was not holding up well so I'm glad I did. I used the MTS coolant transfer pipe instead of the URO one, I saved $100 but with a catch. I read in an Amazon review that several people had problems getting the pipe to fit inside the front gasket, one reviewer purchased the URO gasket set and it worked better because of a slightly different gasket profile. I purchased the URO gasket set and I'm glad I did; I first tried using the MTS front gasket and couldn't get the pipe to feed in correctly so after 30 minutes I switched to the URO gasket and had it in within minutes. The rear gasket is just an O-ring so the URO one worked fine. I ended up using the URO rear O-ring to replace one from one of the large coolant hoses going to the waterpump.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00HK5ZH8I...JGQ0QJ19VWTXYR


10) When reconnecting the coolant hoses, several of them leaked. I suspect the new water pump (Beck-Arnley) throats were slightly smaller in diameter; that, along with the worn-out coolant hose O-rings, caused the leaks. I bought replacement O-rings from a hardware store and that fixed the issues. Before putting the manifold back on I did a pressure test and the results were disappointing; I put 20 lbs of pressure in the system and after 15 minutes it had dropped to 15 lbs, that is when I found the coolant hose leaks. After fixing them I was still seeing a pressure drop, after 30 minutes it was still losing about 5 lbs of pressure. I could not see any visible leaks so I finally decided the best way to determine where it was leaking was to fill the system with coolant and use the vehicle. I put everything back together and after several weeks I am happy to see that the coolant level is not going down like it used to, and I’m not seeing coolant on my driveway any more. It might have been a leaky pressure testing kit, even though I couldn’t hear or find any leaks.


This was a big endeavor for me, as I said earlier it took me almost 24 hours to complete. I suspect that without some of the hold-ups and with some of the shortcuts it might have been closer to 16 hours. There is a point where you wonder if the vehicle will ever run again and perhaps you should set it on fire, but as long as you label everything and take your time it will work out. Hope this helps somebody else!

Snoopyhat
How much would this run me with an independent mechanic?
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  #75  
Old 06-15-2016, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ynotrhyme View Post
How much would this run me with an independent mechanic?
I was quoted $2000 by an indy that charges $99/hr, that was for replacing the valley pan, the crossover tube, and the water pump. The parts were $429 for me with the largest costs being $90 for the valley pan, $105 for the MTC pipe, and $151 for the water pump. So I saved $1571 for 24 hours work, which means I was working for $65/hr. If I was able to avoid the few delays and finish it in 16 hours instead, I would have been working for $98/hr. But the experience was priceless...
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  #76  
Old 06-15-2016, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopyhat View Post
2) The replacement of the water pump would be a relatively simple task if it weren’t for the fact that the bottom bolt is behind the crank pulley (bravo, BMW!). I ended up removing both belts from the pulley and removing the pulley to access the bolt, but removing the A/C belt requires that you relieve the tension from the belt.
For future reference - it is possible to remove the waterpump without removing crank pulley. The lower bolt (the one behind the pulley) was shorter then the rest of them. So you have to remove all other bolts first, then use open end wrench to unscrew the bolt (PIA). After it is completely unscrewed don't try to take bolt out as there is not enough space. Pull waterpump up along with the bolt (you might need to wiggle it a bit). Assembly is in reverse... Put the bolt through lower hole of waterpump, then wiggle them together from top down and use fingers to start the bolt. Saved me quite some time when I was replacing wobbly waterpump.
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  #77  
Old 06-15-2016, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BorisKV View Post
For future reference - it is possible to remove the waterpump without removing crank pulley. The lower bolt (the one behind the pulley) was shorter then the rest of them. So you have to remove all other bolts first, then use open end wrench to unscrew the bolt (PIA). After it is completely unscrewed don't try to take bolt out as there is not enough space. Pull waterpump up along with the bolt (you might need to wiggle it a bit). Assembly is in reverse... Put the bolt through lower hole of waterpump, then wiggle them together from top down and use fingers to start the bolt. Saved me quite some time when I was replacing wobbly waterpump.
Thanks BorisKV, I read about that shortcut after I had completed the job. Perhaps now that the information is in this thread it will save someone else the extra work.
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  #78  
Old 06-15-2016, 02:34 PM
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Dreaded N62 (4.8i)Coolant Leak - Merry Christmas

I don't remember the lower bolt behind the crank pulley being shorter than the others. I would have noticed otherwise. Still possible to remove that bolt without removing the crank pulley. However, if your water pump had been replaced before, the lower bolt might have been replaced with a shorter one. That's what I did when when I replaced mine at around 80k mark (3rd water pump).
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  #79  
Old 06-15-2016, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanC View Post
I don't remember the lower bolt behind the crank pulley being shorter than the others. I would have noticed otherwise. Still possible to remove that bolt without removing the crank pulley. However, if your water pump had been replaced before, the lower bolt might have been replaced with a shorter one. That's what I did when when I replaced mine at around 80k mark (3rd water pump).
My waterpump was original, but I stand corrected... according to RealOEM.com - Online BMW Parts Catalog the lower bolt is same as three others holding waterpump, except the top one which is longer (and that's the one I've removed last before removing the bottom one so it was etched in my memory I guess).
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  #80  
Old 06-15-2016, 06:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BorisKV View Post
My waterpump was original, but I stand corrected... according to RealOEM.com - Online BMW Parts Catalog the lower bolt is same as three others holding waterpump, except the top one which is longer (and that's the one I've removed last before removing the bottom one so it was etched in my memory I guess).


I would like to thank you for this post. The reason why I changed my water pump was because it had developed a leak right around that top bolt, which is indeed supposed to be longer than the others as per realoem. When I removed my water pump, the top bolt was NOT different than the others, all 5 were the same, and I used a regular short bolt for the top one as well. After reading your post, I just checked that area and noticed a slight leak again, which is probably because of that short bolt up top.

I will be replacing it this weekend with the correct one. 👍
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