that would be incorrect Barry. Occult is defined as: of or pertaining to magic, astrology, or any system claiming use or knowledge of secret or supernatural powers or agencies.

so this would be inclusive of not just religious cults but also of things supernatural such as UFO's passing etc...

I would have to completely disagree with your statement about jehovah's witnesses. They clearly deny the deity of Christ, His physical resurrection, and salvation by grace which is the basis of Protestant belief.

Convienent way to dodge the discussion."I'm going to bed"? Wow. Never seen you duck out of a conversation so fast. But when you wake up remember you don't need a masters in theology to read and understand what the scriptures says. It's easy. But i know how uncomfortabe the truth can be and it certinally is not my intention to cause you discomfort. It's only my intention to provide you with something to think about. If your a person who recognizes the value of being a Christian then I'm sure you would have no problem with what the scriptures say. So give this some thought.

"Our Creator Sets the Standard
Our Creator established rules governing marriage long before governments began regulating the institution. The opening book of the Bible tells us: “A man will leave his father and his mother and he must stick to his wife and they must become one flesh.” (Genesis 2:24) The Hebrew word “wife,” according to Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words, “connotes one who is a female human being.” Jesus confirmed that those yoked together in marriage should be “male and female.”—Matthew 19:4. Thus, God intended marriage to be a permanent and an intimate bond between a man and a woman. Men and women are designed to complement each other so they may be capable of satisfying each other’s emotional, spiritual, and sexual needs and desires. So if God set the standard then the choice is clear.

But your right about one thing. All of us have a choice about what we want to do with our lives and we all personally have to answer for the choices we make. The great thing about it is the fact that God does educate us regarding what our choices are. After we have been educated then we can no longer say we were ignorant of the law, and the recompense or reward we receive will not be a surprise.

With regard to your comment that "you take the bible with a grain of salt because its been re-written by man so many times?" then consider this. God must be a very weak God if he cannot preserve the truth in one small book. If that is the case the anyone who calls themself a Christian has no hope and is lost because any God who is that weak cannot save them.

But anyway just thought i would share that and i will end my comments regarding the subject.

__________________
"What you hear in a great jazz band is the sound of democracy. “The jazz band works best when participation is shaped by intelligent communication.”
Harmony happens whenever different parts get to form a whole by means of congruity, concord, symetry, consistency, conformity, correspondence, agreement, accord, unity, consonance…….

Your definition is also correct but wouldn't apply to this group. They don't believe in UFO's or astrology or Black magic. So I’m not sure how you’re applying this term.

It is true that Jehovah's witnesses deny the common teaching that Jesus is God but they are not alone regarding that position. Fact is many theologians recognize that the teaching that Christ is god is based on tradition rather than scripture. But consider what the Bible says regarding this issue.

Testimony of Acquaintances

Showing that Jesus was clearly no ordinary person, an angel announced in advance his conception and birth, saying: “This one will be great and will be called Son of the Most High.” Notice that the angel said, not “God,” but “Son of the Most High.”—Luke 1:30-32.

At thirty years of age Jesus presented himself to be baptized. On that occasion God’s own voice said: “This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved.” And so John the Baptist, who witnessed the event, said of Jesus: “This one is the Son of God.”—Matt. 3:17; John 1:34.

Jesus’ apostles and friends repeatedly identified him in this way. Said Nathanael: “Rabbi, you are the Son of God.” (John 1:49) Peter exclaimed: “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” (Matt. 16:16) Martha confessed: “You are the Christ, the Son of God.” (John 11:27) The apostle John wrote so people might believe that “Jesus is the Christ the Son of God.” (John 20:31) And of the apostle Paul’s ministry it is said: “He began to preach Jesus, that this One is the Son of God.”—Acts 9:20.

Did Peter, Paul, John or any other of Jesus’ followers preach that he was God? No, from these scriptures it is clear that they taught he was God’s Son.

Why, then, do many religious people today believe that Jesus is God? It is due principally to the teaching of church leaders who, in the language of the fourth-century Nicene Creed, identified Jesus as ‘very God of very God, begotten not made, of one substance with the Father. Josh there is so much information on this subject it is impossible to go further. But whatever evidence we use I'm sure you will agree that it should be based on the scriptures.


Jehovah’s witness do believe in the resurrection. There were up to 500 Witnesses who saw him after he was resurrected.

Salvation By Grace? Great subject

Salvation by grace is often misunderstood by many to mean "a person doesn’t have to do anything to gain salvation when in fact the book of James say's that faith without works is dead.

In this regard it is interesting that you refer to the basis of Protestant belief. In truth what were the fundamental points that divided the Protestants from the Roman Catholics? According to Luther, there were three. First, Luther believed that salvation results from “justification by faith alone” (Latin, sola fide) and not from priestly absolution or works of penance. Second, he taught that forgiveness is granted solely because of God’s grace (sola gratia) and not by the authority of priests or popes. Finally, Luther contended that all doctrinal matters are to be confirmed by Scripture only (sola scriptura) and not by popes or church councils. But who’s right regarding this question? Is it the Catholics or the Protestant? Again why not let the scriptures speak.


Eph. 2:8, 9, “By grace [“undeserved kindness,” ] you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God—not because of works, lest any man should boast.” (The entire provision for salvation is an expression of God’s undeserved kindness. There is no way that a descendant of Adam can gain salvation on his own, no matter how noble his works are. Salvation is a gift from God given to those who put faith in the sin-atoning value of the sacrifice of his Son.)

Now notice Heb. 5:9, “He [Jesus] became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey him.” (Italics added.) (Does this conflict with the statement that Christians are “saved through faith”? Not at all. Obedience simply demonstrates that their faith is genuine.)

Jas. 2:14, 26, “What does it profit, my brethren, if a man says he has faith but has not works? Can his faith save him? For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so faith apart from works is dead.” (A person does not earn salvation by his works. But anyone who has genuine faith will have works to go with it—works of obedience to the commands of God and Christ, works that demonstrate his faith and love. Without such works, his faith is dead.)

Acts 16:30, 31, “‘Men, what must I do to be saved?’ And they [Paul and Silas] said, ‘Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.’” (If that man and his household truly believed, would they not act in harmony with their belief? Certainly.)


Josh; there is so much information available about these subjects and it’s wonderful talking about it. Maybe someday we can continue the discussion. But if we did that here we would be leaving bb out of it and you and I know that wouldn’t be fair. After all there is one thing we agree on and that is our common interest in his welfare.

__________________
"What you hear in a great jazz band is the sound of democracy. “The jazz band works best when participation is shaped by intelligent communication.”
Harmony happens whenever different parts get to form a whole by means of congruity, concord, symetry, consistency, conformity, correspondence, agreement, accord, unity, consonance…….