Congratulations U.S. Members - Page 3

blondboinsd · #21 11-08-2006, 05:04 PM

All that needs to be said has been said, the repubs suck, they failed, its time for a new representation, change is good, nuff said

Sponsored Links

bjo · #22 11-08-2006, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric5273

1. What is wrong is that an increasing number of Americans are "underemployed", meaning they are college educated professionals working at low wage part-time jobs and such. They are not considered "unemployed" by government statistics.

2. What is wrong is that an increasing number of Americans are living below the poverty line including about 13% of all Americans and over 20% of all American children. The poverty line is $18k per year for a family of 4, or $12k for a single person. So if you and your wife have a combined gross income of $20k per year ($384 per week before taxes) and you have 2 kids, you are not considered to be living in poverty and your kids are better off than 20% of American kids.

3. What is wrong is that over 45 million Americans have no heath insurance.

4. What is wrong is that fewer than 25% of Americans own any stocks or have anything vested in that 12000 DJIA.

5. What is wrong is that there is a continous increase in the divide between the wealthy and the poor and the middle class is slowly disappearing in this country.

As we are on an BMW X5 message board here, most of us are upper middle-class or above. So maybe you do not care about all of this as it does not personally affect you. But as you saw yesterday at the polls, may Americans are very upset as things are not doing so great for them.

1. If you are a college educated person then you have the ability to learn and move up from your part-time low wage job. Its not the govt's responsiblity to provide higher paying jobs.
2. Its not the govt's responsiblity to provide higher paying jobs. Yes it sucks to be poor, but there are always ways to increase your income.
3. Health care is expensive, but how do you propose that we pay for 45 million people's health insurance?
4. There are more people who are tied in the stock market than you think. 401k ring a bell?
5. The middle class will always be around. We have not reached the class division like what Mexico, India, etc has. When we do expect a bloody revolt.

Thunder22 · #23 11-08-2006, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blondboinsd

All that needs to be said has been said, the repubs suck, they failed, its time for a new representation, change is good, nuff said

How eloquent. ugh.

Thunder22 · #24 11-08-2006, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjo

1. If you are a college educated person then you have the ability to learn and move up from your part-time low wage job. Its not the govt's responsiblity to provide higher paying jobs.
2. Its not the govt's responsiblity to provide higher paying jobs. Yes it sucks to be poor, but there are always ways to increase your income.
3. Health care is expensive, but how do you propose that we pay for 45 million people's health insurance?
4. There are more people who are tied in the stock market than you think. 401k ring a bell?
5. The middle class will always be around. We have not reached the class division like what Mexico, India, etc has. When we do expect a bloody revolt.

BINGO!

the left wants to tell everyone what to do, the right wants to tell everyone where to go

Juanted · #25 11-08-2006, 06:00 PM

Well, for its flaws, our form of goverment is the oldest democracy in the world -- this despite the fact that we are a very young nation.

You got any better ideas? Or is this only driven by the fact that your party is no longer in power. Funny how that works. I am not a liberal per se, but I am a registered democrat. Though unhappy about the situation over the past six years, I simply accepted the fact that the Republicans were chosen by the majority of the voting population to run the country. That's what happens in a democracy. (To say nothing of the fact that Bush probably stole the 2000 election.) The Reds had their time, and they blew it. Now, the electorate has again spoken and given the Blues a chance. Maybe you should simply accept that -- just as I did for the past few years.

No, it's not perfect, but it's pretty damn good. I can't think of a single superpower in history that was (or still is, for that matter) as democratic as ours.

OR... you can mount a campaign to re-write our constitution, re-work our electorate process, and revamp our democratic checks-and-balances system. Let me know how that goes.

Juan

Quote:

Originally Posted by gresch

It's not a moot point juan.

No plan is worse than a bad plan. It's that simple.

To use an analogy, how is anyone better off by deciding to walk into a dark cave instead of climb down a dark hole?

This isn't a Dems vs. Republicans debate, it's a shitty political party vs. the other shitty political party discussion.

As Americans, we should be demanding a better government, not a different government because the one that is in power is disliked.

Hoping for a "good politician" is like praying not to have a hangover over drinking liter of vodka, sure it's possible, but not probable.

blondboinsd · #26 11-08-2006, 06:07 PM

ROFL sore loser much? Love it! Another good one Juan!

Eric5273 · #27 11-08-2006, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gresch

1. There isn't 1 democrat who has said this. please provide a source.

Here is one. There are many others as well.

Murtha calls for immediate withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq

As for your comment of me being "1 for 6", I don't care if you agree with what the liberal platform is. You asked what it is, and I am telling you.

As for "what else", there are many foreign policy issues. The liberal agenda would include the following:

1. More active cooperation with global treaties such as Kyoto Protocol and the World Court.

2. Withdrawal of troops and closure of military bases from many of the 130+ countries we currently have American military bases in.

3. Disband President Bush's program to develop a new class of tactical nuclear weapons in violation of the NPT.

4. Closure of the Guantanamo prison and all other secret prisons

5. Disband the NSA domestic spy program

6. Eliminate military aid to non-democratic countries such as Kazakhstan, Turkmenistan, Pakistan, Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Nigeria, and others

7. Economic sanctions against countries with major human rights violations such as Turkmenistan, Saudi Arabia, Niger, Burma, and others

8. Elimination of economic embargo and sactions against Cuba

There's probably some more that I cannot think of right now.

Thunder22 · #28 11-08-2006, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaefer

Well, for its flaws, our form of goverment is the oldest democracy in the world -- this despite the fact that we are a very young nation.

You got any better ideas? Or is this only driven by the fact that your party is no longer in power. Funny how that works. I am not a liberal per se, but I am a registered democrat. Though unhappy about the situation over the past six years, I simply accepted the fact that the Republicans were chosen by the majority of the voting population to run the country. That's what happens in a democracy. (To say nothing of the fact that Bush probably stole the 2000 election.) The Reds had their time, and they blew it. Now, the electorate has again spoken and given the Blues a chance. Maybe you should simply accept that -- just as I did for the past few years.

No, it's not perfect, but it's pretty damn good. I can't think of a single superpower in history that was (or still is, for that matter) as democratic as ours.

OR... you can mount a campaign to re-write our constitution, re-work our electorate process, and revamp our democratic checks-and-balances system. Let me know how that goes.

Juan

What party are you assuming that i'm a member of? I've never said, nor have I defended either side, I'm an equal opportunity hater of politics and politicians.

In reference to your last paragraph, again, I wasn't bashing the system, I am bashing the morons that we currently have to choose from, and the manner in which Americans cast their vote, i.e. their decision making process.

I am seriously questioning, and still waiting for a coherent answer other than "anything but the republicans would be better", what the the Dems plans are. In detail. Saying "stop the war" is b.s., everyone wants to get out of Iraq, HOW will the dems do it differently? Healthcare? everyone wants better more affordable healthcare, how will the dems do it differently? they've already failed at it miserably back when Hillary was running the country in the 90's, what are they going to do differently? and if they have the answer, why haven't they proposed it since clinton left office? waiting for the right moment?

When someone gives me a well thought out, backed up by references answer to this question, I think we'll all be better off.

You can choose to disagree with how i feel, that's your prerogative, but don't waste your time trying to sway me to the other side nor convince me that i'm wrong. I'm no more right or wrong than you are, we just differ in opinion.

Scottie · #29 11-08-2006, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaefer

Well, for its flaws, our form of goverment is the oldest democracy in the world -- this despite the fact that we are a very young nation.

Juan

you sure about that

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en...e+Search&meta=

maybe your the world’s oldest modern democracy

Thunder22 · #30 11-08-2006, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric5273

Here is one. There are many others as well.

Murtha calls for immediate withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq

As for your comment of me being "1 for 6", I don't care if you agree with what the liberal platform is. You asked what it is, and I am telling you.

As for "what else", there are many foreign policy issues. The liberal agenda would include the following:

1. More active cooperation with global treaties such as Kyoto Protocol and the World Court.

2. Withdrawal of troops and closure of military bases from many of the 130+ countries we currently have American military bases in.

3. Disband President Bush's program to develop a new class of tactical nuclear weapons in violation of the NPT.

4. Closure of the Guantanamo prison and all other secret prisons

5. Disband the NSA domestic spy program

6. Eliminate military aid to non-democratic countries such as Kazakhstan, Turkmenistan, Pakistan, Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Nigeria, and others

7. Economic sanctions against countries with major human rights violations such as Turkmenistan, Saudi Arabia, Niger, Burma, and others

8. Elimination of economic embargo and sactions against Cuba

There's probably some more that I cannot think of right now.

I can't believe that you don't see the negative sides to all of that.

Do you really support all of those initiatives? Do you not see the negative side of each? I seriously hope not, because almost every single one of them would hurt the US.

re: Murtha's "call to leave immediately", what do you think will happen in Iraq if tomorrow the US military is just "gone"? obviously, murtha is not saying "leave this second", there would be a staged/planned withdrawal. Which the republicans are in favor of as well, so how does this differ from their plan? what good did it do to vote in the dems?

Sponsored Links