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  #11  
Old 01-24-2008, 08:13 PM
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Kids becoming burger flippers doesn't just suck for them, it sucks for all of us. Many of the strides the U.S. has made is due to its intelectual capital. When you allow much of the potential to fall through the cracks, then our comptetive advantage of innovation etc. also slips. Which in turn hurts the economy and just about everything else.

Education is key and the fewer kids getting a proper education will limit the countries ability to create, innovate etc. Because nothing has immediate impact/results, it's hard to understand why not 'leaving these kids behind' is important. The same reason that kids don't see how education really helps everything in the long run is the same reason many people may not support such a program. However, it is governments role to step in for the long-term health of the nation.
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  #12  
Old 01-24-2008, 08:40 PM
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I don't want people in my line of work who had to be paid to succeed in school. I guess I'll call the school system and demand a check for my grades now
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  #13  
Old 01-24-2008, 08:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nupe10123
I agree that is a low expectation of the youth and I didn't require money to make me do well either. It is sad that these types of 'programs' are effective - even more sad that there is a need for these programs at all.
Regardless of how sad, the reality is that they work.

The reality is that many of the kids that may not be focused enough to or mature enough to go to shcool and get good grades for the 'right' reasons will be motivated by this. A thereby in time when they hopefully do become more focused or concerned about the future, it won't be too late. In working with youth and young adults in the inner-city, I've seen how many of them now regret not doing better in school and currently paying the concequences. If programs like this were in place when they were in school (before they dropped out or failed too many times etc) then maybe they could have been 'saved'.

I don't think this program is the answer, but it has been proven to work and improve the futures of these kids, helping them focus until they eventually really got it.

Sad or not, this program get's results.
That is the excuse, it gets results? Well what is to stop kids from simply not attending class till they are paid...how about not doing homework till they get paid...where exactly does this end?? And I'd love to see the stat comparisons on kids paid, and kids not and where they are today...guaranteed the ones who were paid are no where near as successful as those who weren't.
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We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

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  #14  
Old 01-24-2008, 09:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AzNMpower32
I don't think it's the government's responsibility to "help kids focus". If a kid wants to slack off and not do anything with his/her life while in school, he/she should eventually land a job that reflects his/her efforts in school. If that means flipping burgers at the local joint, so be it. It's not like that child didn't know the consequences of not working hard in the beginning. If you don't work hard while you're young and get a lousy job, sucks for you.
If our government didn't take the responsibility to help kids focus in this country, have you any idea how much higher the crime rate in this country would be? It would cost the country to spend more money fighting crime, than it already spends on education just to keep it the same.

Cities like Baltimore threw millions for their school budget for years and saw results declining instead of rising. These communities insist on thinking that throwing more money into their schools will solve the problem even though everytime its done, things get worse. This is a smart move to show their critics in a way they can relate to while not have to waste millions on a situation that can not be fixed by money alone. If something like this was implemented in middle-class school systems, It would cost too much so it only makes sense to do it in areas and situations where its proven that the kids just don't care. It's sort of like the new tax incentives like the "no capital gains tax" where it only applies to those in the 10% tax bracket who wouldn't have any capital gains to tax in the first place.

More likely the students that are flipping burgers in these communities are the ones who are doing well in school. The ones that grew up in these places that saw success don't stick around to motivate or be positive role models making these kids not caring about the consequences of not working hard since they don't see what they have to lose or what they have to gain by going to school. In their eyes the grass is greener on the streets slanging rocks where they can get immediate results.

Last edited by lakai; 01-24-2008 at 09:29 PM.
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  #15  
Old 01-24-2008, 10:54 PM
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Wagner: If you were King of Baltimore and you could order the city to do whatever you felt was needed, what would you do to improve the city schools so that most of the kids start getting good grades, graduate, go to college, etc???
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  #16  
Old 01-24-2008, 11:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lakai
Cities like Baltimore threw millions for their school budget for years and saw results declining instead of rising. These communities insist on thinking that throwing more money into their schools will solve the problem even though everytime its done, things get worse. This is a smart move to show their critics in a way they can relate to while not have to waste millions on a situation that can not be fixed by money alone. If something like this was implemented in middle-class school systems, It would cost too much so it only makes sense to do it in areas and situations where its proven that the kids just don't care. It's sort of like the new tax incentives like the "no capital gains tax" where it only applies to those in the 10% tax bracket who wouldn't have any capital gains to tax in the first place.
Paying kids to get better grades is just the start. What's next? Paying them to stay in school? How about paying them to go to college? Perhaps we could also count their attendance and pay them to go to class. This is a bad case of "money solves everything" taken too far. :

Oh, I suppose if UVa paid me $150 to get an A, then I'll do better in my classes?
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  #17  
Old 01-25-2008, 05:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AzNMpower32
Paying kids to get better grades is just the start. What's next? Paying them to stay in school? How about paying them to go to college? Perhaps we could also count their attendance and pay them to go to class. This is a bad case of "money solves everything" taken too far. :

Oh, I suppose if UVa paid me $150 to get an A, then I'll do better in my classes?

This already happens. They're called grants and scholarships.

Why this is really happening in b-more is mayor Carcetti spent all the year's budget for education and making drastic cutbacks in the police department hindering them from catching the homeless serial-killer. So how did they get the money to do a program like this ?? It comes from that dirty ass senator Clay Davis who's under grand jury indictment. Hes bidding to buy some support from Carcetti to back him up on his legal problems. Davis got this money from an unknown source. Most likely its dirty drug money since clay davis is known to launder money for criminals. I bet you its from Marlo Stanfield since he stands to gain the most by getting clean money and the money will be circulated back onto the streets to buy his drugs. LOL
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  #18  
Old 01-25-2008, 05:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric5273
Wagner: If you were King of Baltimore and you could order the city to do whatever you felt was needed, what would you do to improve the city schools so that most of the kids start getting good grades, graduate, go to college, etc???
Well, lets see...

First, not everyone should go to college..so throw that thought process right on out the door.

Second, start with the parents, not the school. In B-more if you drive down the street on a "school day" you will see tons of kids roaming around. Fix the parental issue, which is much more difficult, first.
So to fix the parenting issue you'd have to start with the crime rate and the overload of subsidizing and government 'support' that is provided. And while I'm at it, Ed Norris is police commissioner again.

Once the parental issue is addressed, the school issue will be dissolved.

Yeah, problem solved
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We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

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  #19  
Old 01-25-2008, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wagner
Well, lets see...

First, not everyone should go to college..so throw that thought process right on out the door.

Second, start with the parents, not the school. In B-more if you drive down the street on a "school day" you will see tons of kids roaming around. Fix the parental issue, which is much more difficult, first.
So to fix the parenting issue you'd have to start with the crime rate and the overload of subsidizing and government 'support' that is provided. And while I'm at it, Ed Norris is police commissioner again.

Once the parental issue is addressed, the school issue will be dissolved.

Yeah, problem solved
It all starts with the parents.
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  #20  
Old 01-25-2008, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wagner
Fix the parental issue, which is much more difficult, first.
So to fix the parenting issue you'd have to start with the crime rate and the overload of subsidizing and government 'support' that is provided. And while I'm at it, Ed Norris is police commissioner again.

Once the parental issue is addressed, the school issue will be dissolved.

Yeah, problem solved
Nice double talk....sounds very much like something a politician would say.

But in this whole answer, you never said what you would do as "King Wagner of Baltimore" to fix the problem. You only hinted at areas that perhaps your policies would focus on. I think we all know where the problems lie. The debate is about how to solve those problems, not only identify them.

It sounds like the City of Baltimore is trying something out to see if it produces results. Personally, I doubt it will work. But I do commend them on trying, since most city governments have done nothing to try to fix the failing education system. If you have better ideas on how they should go about addressing the problem, please do share. If you were in the city council, what kind of legislation would you propose to help fix this problem??

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