Home Forums Articles How To's FAQ Register
Go Back   Xoutpost.com > Off-topic > The Lounge
Fluid Motor Union
User Name
Password
Member List Premier Membership Today's Posts New Posts

Xoutpost server transfer and maintenance is occurring....
Xoutpost is currently undergoing a planned server migration.... stay tuned for new developments.... sincerely, the management


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-10-2009, 10:49 AM
motordavid's Avatar
RetiredBum & Semi-RenaissanceMan
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Mtns of Western NC, & SW FLA
Posts: 16,829
motordavid will become famous soon enoughmotordavid will become famous soon enough
Quick Review Of X 35d & 335d...

From Sunday's NewYawkTimes; it isn't a C&D review, but pretty well written, imo.
GL,mD

Behind the Wheel | 2009 BMW 335d and X5 xDrive 35d
A Dose of Diesel Medicine Without the Nasty Aftertaste


The 2009 BMW X5 xDrive 35d, left, and the 2009 BMW 335d.

By LAWRENCE ULRICH
Published: May 7, 2009

I WANT you. I need you. But there ain’t no way I’m ever gonna love you: the message in that memorable slice of Meat Loaf, rendered with a flourish of the rocker’s sweaty kerchief, was that two out of three ain’t bad.

Diesel fans may feel the same way about the new, 50-state-legal models that began arriving last fall.

BMW’s dual entries — the 335d sedan and the tongue-twisting X5 xDrive 35d sport utility — struck me as perhaps the most desirable specimens yet.

I want their performance, which stacks up against BMW’s enthusiast-endorsed gasoline versions. I need their fuel economy, especially the stellar 37 miles a gallon on the highway that I received in the 335d. But on the rare occasions when I stopped to refuel, my ballad-worthy love for the Bimmers was soured somewhat by the volatile price of diesel. At the pump, these BMWs — like their counterparts from Audi, Mercedes and Volkswagen — turn into nutty spouses on a credit-card binge.
Nutty has been the word for diesel prices. When I reviewed the VW Jetta TDI diesel on these pages last November, diesel fuel sold for $2.95 a gallon nationwide, compared with $2.05 for regular gas. That huge premium wiped out the Jetta diesel’s considerable mileage advantage. And since the diesel model costs $700 more than the gasoline version (accounting for its $1,300 alternative fuel tax credit), its money-saving argument seemed less compelling.

But by last week, a gallon of regular had held relatively flat at $2.11, according to AAA, while diesel prices had plunged nearly 25 percent to an average of $2.26 a gallon. For BMW, Audi and Mercedes, which call for premium-grade fuel in their gasoline models, the comparison is more favorable: diesel now costs 6 cents a gallon less than premium and diesel delivers 20 to 40 percent better mileage.

Only months ago, energy experts were adamant that diesel, due largely to refinery shortages, would remain prohibitively expensive for years. So much for the experts, who have proved again that petro-predictions are as reliable as a 12-month weather forecast. For now, diesels are again poised to save you hundreds of dollars a year in fuel.

But diesel isn’t strictly a dollars-and-cents affair. The latest generation of engines produces about 20 percent less carbon-dioxide emissions than comparable gas engines. To cut smog-forming nitrogen oxides to California-friendly levels, the BMW diesels carry tanks of urea: 5.3 gallons for the 335d, 5.6 gallons in the X5. This ammonia-rich fluid is squirted into the exhaust stream to scrub pollutants, and the tank holds enough to last until the next scheduled service. BMW also pays for refills under its four-year or 50,000-mile program of free scheduled maintenance.

Diesel owners have also come to expect great durability, with diesels routinely running for 200,000 miles or more with no costly repairs. The engines conserve liquid like camels in the Sahara: both the 335d and X5 35d can travel nearly 600 highway miles on a tank.

But perhaps the coolest thing about the new diesels is that they make you feel as if you’re getting away with something: they are frugal, yet fun to drive.

BMW, ever mindful of what justifies its lofty prices, has whipped up the most power-hungry, enthusiast-oriented diesel ever sold in America. The 335d engine, the nation’s first twin-turbocharged diesel, produces 265 horsepower and 425 pound-feet of torque from a mere 3 liters of engine displacement. Even the mighty M5 supersedan (500 horsepower and $90,000) can’t muster that much torque — the force you feel when you punch the throttle.

A smoking 5.8-second run to 60 m.p.h. puts the diesel a mere half-second behind the gasoline-powered 335i and its ferocious 300-horsepower, twin-turbo 6. In my life, I’ve never experienced such explosive throttle response from a diesel. One thing’s certain: from 30, 50 or 70 m.p.h., the 3 Series will surprise a whole lot of V-8 sports cars and sedans. The 335d is 220 pounds heavier than the twin-turbo gasoline 335i, but the loss in handling is negligible.

The tradeoff is that the BMWs aren’t pure mileage hounds in the manner of the small VW diesel, which delivered 48 m.p.g. on the highway. The BMW will sneak past its federal estimates of 23 m.p.g. in town and 36 on the highway, but it takes effort.

Yet compared with most hybrids, these diesels are much more forgiving of a heavy right foot. Romping like a schoolboy in the 335d, I still managed 30 m.p.g. on the highway.

All told, in city and on highway, in fast times and slow, I managed 30 m.p.g. over a week of driving, an enormous gain over the 21 m.p.g. I got with the gasoline 335i. As some auto critics have noted, BMW has smaller diesels in its European portfolio that would do better. Yet I’m not convinced that American 3 Series fans are ready for a 4-cylinder-anything in a BMW.

As a lifelong devotee of fast-spinning yet puree-smooth gas engines — like the 8,000-r.p.m. masterworks of a Honda S2000 or BMW’s twin-turbo 335i — I’m not yet accustomed to diesels that run out of breath around 4,500 r.p.m. But compared with the compromises required by some hybrids — squishy regenerative brakes, aimless transmissions, boggy acceleration, diminished cargo space — the drawbacks of diesels seem minor.

BMW said it couldn’t build a manual transmission that would be strong enough to handle the diesel’s torque and still feel sporty. And as much as I love self-shifting a BMW, it must be said that the diesels are especially compatible with their 6-speed automatic transmission. With torque packed into the lower and middle range of the power curve, you can leave the car in Drive and enjoy ridiculous passing power in any situation.

Both BMW diesels deliver the stellar handling BMW is known for. As with the conventional 3 Series, the word “driving” barely does justice to what takes place. It’s more like you cradle the car, barely moving your palms, while the 335d responds like a polo pony to every twitch.

Like other modern diesels, the BMWs are California-clean and do away entirely with black, stinky exhaust. Both BMWs are barely louder at idle than gasoline versions, but the 3 Series actually seems quieter on the highway, where its diesel tools along at incredibly low engine speeds. The X5’s sound quality isn’t as soothing, with the diesel’s drone and boom much more noticeable in its S.U.V. soundbox of a cabin.

BMW’s Active Steering, which adjusts the steering ratio depending on the car’s speed, is not available on diesel models, but that is no real loss.

The X5 diesel — 14 inches taller and 1,400 pounds heavier than the 335d — is less of a giggle fit on wheels. Yet by the standards of obese luxury S.U.V.’s, the BMW remains as skilled a performer as anything in the class.

Its eye-opening 0-to-60 time of 6.9 seconds trails the 350-horsepower V-8 version by just half a second. And its estimated 18/26 m.p.g. is nearly 40 percent better than the woeful 14/19 of the gasoline V-8 version and also trumps the 15/21 of the 6-cylinder gasoline model.

While this sedan and S.U.V. mimic the fine points of their gas counterparts, they keep the bad stuff as well. For the 3 Series, that includes a smallish back seat and sticky doors that don’t always close fully on the first try. For the X5, subtract points for the clunky last-generation iDrive controller that sets vehicle functions; only BMWs that received major updates for 2009 get the markedly improved version of iDrive, as a $2,100 option for the 3-Series.

After experiencing the iDrive 2.0 in the latest 7 Series sedan, returning to the old version was like that frustrating dream where you’re back in high school: you know you’re not supposed to be there, but the teacher is giving a quiz and you can’t get up and leave. The X5 also clings to its awkward clamshell tailgate.

The 335d’s downer is a $44,725 starting price — $2,475 above the formidable 335i with an automatic. A $900 federal alternative fuel tax credit barely softens the blow. That’s a lot of money for any 3 Series not wearing the high-performance “M” badge — or for one lacking a navigation system. (Navigation is a $2,100 option that includes iDrive and 12 gigabytes of music storage.) My test car, optioned up, fetched $51,445.

The X5 makes a stronger economic case, at least if you are determined to buy a luxury S.U.V. The diesel costs $3,700 more than the basic X5 3.0 (with a 260-horsepower in-line 6). Yet like the diesel version of the big Mercedes GL, the X5’s diesel makes a frugal stand-in for the optional V-8.
Starting at $52,025, the diesel model costs $4,600 less than the X5 with a 4.8-liter V-8. Figure in a $1,800 federal tax credit and the buyer is $6,400 ahead before the first fill-up, with major fuel savings supplying a bonus for years to come.

And when it comes to performance, the diesel buyer will never miss the V-8.

All told, the 335d can save time. But it’s the X5 xDrive 35d that saves more money.

INSIDE TRACK: Save fuel, keep the fun.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/10/au...pagewanted=all
__________________
Ol'UncleMotor
From the Home Base of Pro Bono Punditry
and 50 Cent Opins...

Our Mtn Scenes, Car Pics, and Road Trip Pics on Flickr:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/4527537...7627297418250/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/4527537...7627332480833/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/45275375@N00/

My X Page




Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links

  #2  
Old 05-10-2009, 11:09 AM
E61Silver's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: X5world
Posts: 6,176
E61Silver is an unknown quantity at this point
Given the higher price of fuel and car I am not sure Diesel is the way to go.

I don't understand why they don't put the 335 gas engine in the X?
It has tons of torch, on a recent trip to VT (in the 535XIT) it went up the hills in high gear with ton of power. The old 4.4 X5 had to down shift to climb those same hills.
__________________
Loving my BMW
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-10-2009, 11:11 AM
noncom23's Avatar
Premier Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Big D
Posts: 6,521
noncom23 is on a distinguished road
No "D" for me. Can stand the smell!
Nice post mD.
__________________
Mike F
Current: 2017 Grand Cherokee HEMI
2017 Kawasaki ZX-14r
2017 Harley RG Ultra
2017 Harley Fatboy S
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 05-10-2009, 09:12 PM
Quicksilver's Avatar
Premier Member and retired relic
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: NORCAL
Posts: 17,198
Quicksilver will become famous soon enoughQuicksilver will become famous soon enough
Tempted is what they call me. Did a test drive but not sure
if I'm ready for a new car note. During the test drive I didn't
notice any Diesel smell at all.
__________________
"What you hear in a great jazz band is the sound of democracy. “The jazz band works best when participation is shaped by intelligent communication.”
Harmony happens whenever different parts get to form a whole by means of congruity, concord, symetry, consistency, conformity, correspondence, agreement, accord, unity, consonance…….
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-10-2009, 09:29 PM
Dannyell's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Hinckley OH: America de Nord
Posts: 1,345
Dannyell is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by E61Silver View Post
Given the higher price of fuel and car I am not sure Diesel is the way to go.
Depends where u live...here diesel is 20 cents cheaper than premium gasoline and prices are usually 10 to 20 cents difference...

Many trucking companies have gone under and many owner operators have started considering other careers ...so with demand of diesel being lower I would assume that prices should stay more stable than that of gas...

If I get an E70 it will be the diesel or the M
__________________
01 4.4


P5 card hacked
'our curr€ncy, your problem'
Bavarian Motor Wrong
:
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-10-2009, 09:44 PM
Weasel's Avatar
Almost never on here anymore :(
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: New Orleans, La
Posts: 6,892
Weasel will become famous soon enough
Yep, them diesels are smooth and without any smoke or smell. And if I remember correctly it will be available in the 5-series as well, but they are likely going to wait for the next model rather than throw it out in the last year or 2.
__________________
"When you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all" (Bender, futurama)

You make something idiotproof, they'll make a better idiot


You think professional is expensive, just wait until you pay for amateur.

Never let your sense of morals prevent you from doing what is right.

Examine what is said, not who speaks.

X5 pics

RIP 4.6is.....

2003 4.6is
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-10-2009, 10:06 PM
vinuneuro's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: MI/IL/IN
Posts: 7,799
vinuneuro is on a distinguished road
Diesel is the option to have in the X5, but I can't see why anyone would get one in a chassis that has the N54 available.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-10-2009, 10:11 PM
Quicksilver's Avatar
Premier Member and retired relic
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: NORCAL
Posts: 17,198
Quicksilver will become famous soon enoughQuicksilver will become famous soon enough
Driving a Diesel for many has nothing to do with the price.
It's more to do with the driving experience. The torque
the entire experience. As the article said......
"But perhaps the coolest thing about the new diesels is
that they make you feel as if you’re getting away with
something: they are frugal, yet fun to drive."

Enjoying what your driving is what it's all about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by E61Silver View Post
Given the higher price of fuel and car I am not sure Diesel is the way to go.

I don't understand why they don't put the 335 gas engine in the X?
It has tons of torch, on a recent trip to VT (in the 535XIT) it went up the hills in high gear with ton of power. The old 4.4 X5 had to down shift to climb those same hills.
__________________
"What you hear in a great jazz band is the sound of democracy. “The jazz band works best when participation is shaped by intelligent communication.”
Harmony happens whenever different parts get to form a whole by means of congruity, concord, symetry, consistency, conformity, correspondence, agreement, accord, unity, consonance…….
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-10-2009, 11:16 PM
Meiac09's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Chicago
Posts: 4,227
Meiac09 is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quicksilver View Post
Driving a Diesel for many has nothing to do with the price.
It's more to do with the driving experience. The torque
the entire experience. As the article said......
"But perhaps the coolest thing about the new diesels is
that they make you feel as if you’re getting away with
something: they are frugal, yet fun to drive."

Enjoying what your driving is what it's all about.
I drove a ML320 Bluetec, so I take it that it was the Mercedesness that made it suck, right?
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-10-2009, 11:16 PM
JCL's Avatar
JCL JCL is offline
Premier Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 11,853
JCL will become famous soon enoughJCL will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinuneuro View Post
Diesel is the option to have in the X5, but I can't see why anyone would get one in a chassis that has the N54 available.



And the smell people complain about isn't usually from the engine, it is at refueling time.
__________________
2007 X3 3.0si, 6 MT, Premium, White

Retired:
2008 535i, 6 MT, M Sport, Premium, Space Grey
2003 X5 3.0 Steptronic, Premium, Titanium Silver

2002 325xi 5 MT, Steel Grey
2004 Z4 3.0 Premium, Sport, SMG, Maldives Blue
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On





All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:49 PM.
vBulletin, Copyright 2026, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0
© 2017 Xoutpost.com. All rights reserved. Xoutpost.com is a private enthusiast site not associated with BMW AG.
The BMW name, marks, M stripe logo, and Roundel logo as well as X3, X5 and X6 designations used in the pages of this Web Site are the property of BMW AG.
This web site is not sponsored or affiliated in any way with BMW AG or any of its subsidiaries.