OK : Who's gonna win it? McCain/Palin or Obama/Biden?

[Wagner]

why didn't you show who voted quick

[Quicksilver]

Didn't think it was important i guess.
Is that the way it's normally done?

[AzX5]

Originally Posted by AVB-AMG

I was a moderate Republican for 32 years. While I have not significantly changed my stand on the key political issues, I have witnessed my party shift dramatically to the right. So by todays standards I am considered a conservative Democrat. I have lost faith that the Republican party will shift back to the center and embrace moderates like me, so I have changed my party affiliation this year to become a registered Democrat.

You can say the same thing of the Democratic Party. They have been hijacked by the Michael Moore, MoveOn.org, left-wing Hollywood loones. Democrats like JFK would be considered moderate Republicans today, small-government, strong defense, etc., etc.

Your logic makes sense, you just have the parties swapped.

[Wagner]

Originally Posted by Quicksilver

Didn't think it was important i guess.
Is that the way it's normally done?

I'd just like to know what peeps are actually putting in.

[X5audi]

Originally Posted by MrLabGuy

My vote. Obama Biden...Surprise!

Funny, because I think McCain/Palin will win. They portray themselves to be the underdogs but it's really quite the opposite.

However, I'm very happy with the latest polls.

[trueX5er]

Originally Posted by AVB-AMG

I was a moderate Republican for 32 years. While I have not significantly changed my stand on the key political issues, I have witnessed my party shift dramatically to the right. So by todays standards I am considered a conservative Democrat. I have lost faith that the Republican party will shift back to the center and embrace moderates like me, so I have changed my party affiliation this year to become a registered Democrat. Having said that my take on the candidates is as follows:

McCain: Was a moderate, maverick who has done a 180 deg. turn on a number of key issues to appeal to the right wing fanatics. He has abandoned his honest, straight talk pledge and is now following the advice of his Rove disciple aide and tell out-right lies. It is very sad to see and hear. I am also very concerned about his age and health will increase the chances that his insulting pick of the extremely light-weight Sarah Palin as his running mate to appeal to the narrow minded group of Republicans who only seem to care about where a person stands on the 3G's (God, Guns & Gays), regardless of whether she has capability, intelligence and education to serve as our President in a moments notice. (I do believe that the majority of registered voters of both Parties don't think she does have those vital qualities). I also am concerned that someone who has a literal belief in the bible, including creationism, would impose her beliefs on the rest of the country. McCain's unwillingness to consider negotiating with our adversaries and propensity to out-Bush GW by shooting from the hip, scares the hell out of me. I think he will commit our country to another military conflict or possibly war, that we cannot afford to fight, due to lack of money and manpower. Finally, what he has said and done in the past 3 weeks regarding the financial market crisis has convinced me that he is clueless on what to say and do (as well as to what not to say or do....), to help re-establish confidence in both the markets and public to loosen up credit to keep us from spiraling down into a recession, if not a depression.

Obama: He does not have enough experience, but then who really does, when it comes to the Presidency. I have more faith that he has had the solid education and has demonstrated the necessary intelligence, wisdom to make the right and best choices and decisions to get this country back on track. Also, it will be refreshing to finally have a President again who is able to articulate an idea or concept so we can clearly understand him and not be embarrassed, (unlike George Bush). Biden can be counted to put his foot firmly in his mouth, but has experience in foreign relations to serve as an important adviser to B. Obama. Also, if anything were to happen to Obama I believe that Biden could step in immediately and not totally screw up things. Therefore, I am planning of voting for the Obama/Biden ticket on Nov. 4th.
P.S. - In an ideal world, I would like to see an independent ticket of Michael Bloomberg as President and Hillary Clinton as his VP and Bill Clinton as the U.S. Ambassador to Russia, (this would get him out of the country, far away from Washington. Remember, after the Monica Lewinsky episode and impeachment proceedings a poll was taken in Russia and a vast majority said they would like Bill Clinton to be the President of Russia.....)
So that is my 5 cents opinions....
AVB-AMG

Extremely well said, and to an extent.


Oh, and my choice is "To Early to Call"

[Quicksilver]

Not knowing is part of the fun right???

Other wise people, fickle as they are,
If they knew others were watching
might not vote for who they would really
vote for......

Originally Posted by Wagner

I'd just like to know what peeps are actually putting in.

[AVB-AMG]

Originally Posted by MrLabGuy

I understand your logic and it makes sense when you consider the articulation and intelligence of Obama. One question though...What do you think of the politics of Nancy Pelosi? Doesn't it scare you to think that all three branches of government will be controlled by the far Left?

Not a slam but an honest question I'm having difficulty accepting.

MrLabGuy:

Let me answer your two questions:

1. Nancy Pelosi - I think Nancy Pelosi is a most unfortunate choice by the Democrats as the House Leader. She is too liberal for my tastes. My feelings about her are not because she is a woman, but because she has exhibited an amazing insensitivity on how to build a bi-partisan coalition and consensus to actually have the House of Representatives accomplish something, (i.e pass legislation). I am as frustrated as most Americans with Congress over the past 8 years, so that includes both Republican controlled and Democrat controlled Congress. They just do not seem to get it! Their rhetoric, debate and choice of issues do not truly reflect the concerns and wishes of most Americans. Ultimately, we all want our elected representatives to accomplish legislation that will benefit most of us, realizing that compromise is part of diplomacy and politics. Their polarization has frozen most bills so nothing worthwhile seems to be accomplished. The most recent example of Pelosi's ignorance was her highly partisan speech just prior to the vote this past Monday for the $700 billion financial crisis bailout/rescue bill. Was it the reason that the bill failed? No, I don't think so, but it was an amazing display of ignorance, insensitivity and stupidity since she alienated most Republican members of the House. She is certainly allowed to express her opinion, (which I happen to agree with....), but I think most people would have waited until after the vote was completed, not before it. I think the President and Congress did a pathetic job of explaining why this bill was and is so important to ALL Americans. We will see later this week what finally happens with the bill that the Senate just passed this evening...

2. All 3 branches of the Government controlled by the far left - I don't believe that all 3 branches of government are controlled by the far left.
Supreme Court - The Supreme Court clearly demonstrated that they are leaning to the right (Republican), when they were asked to decide whether or not to validate the vote count in Florida immediately after the disputed 2000 Presidential election. With their 5 to 4 vote in favor of ratifying the FL vote count without further re-counting, their decision gave George Bush the Presidency with an Electoral College numerical win, even thought Al Gore won the total popular vote. Subsequently, when George Bush appointed John Roberts to become the new Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, the court shifted further to the right. The next President will most likely have the opportunity to appoint at least one if not two new Supreme Court Justices that will have a significant impact on the country's legal rulings over the next several generations.
Congress - The Senate currently has 49 Democrats and 49 Republicans and 2 Independents, pretty much even. Where as the House of Representatives currently has a majority of Democrats, (235 Democrats to 199 Republicans). This is not an overwhelming majority that would allow the Democrats to implement their agenda without some compromise with Republicans, let alone overturn a Presidential Veto. It forces Congress to work together, a seemingly foreign concept over the past 7 years.

Finally, we all have now experienced 7 years of a Republican President & Administration (Executive Branch), a Republican controlled Senate and House of Representatives (Congress) and a right-leaning (Supreme Court). Look where it has gotten us! Our country is a real mess, thanks to this approach (or lack of) to leadership. While ordinarily I would agree with the premise that it is better to have different parties controlling the Executive Branch and Congress, I think we need to have at least one term, possibly two of a Democrat President and Democrat controlled Congress to start the process of swinging the political pendulum back toward the center from its far right position. Changes will not happen overnight. We need to have legislation and programs put in place that address our immediate needs and we need an Administration that will enforce the existing regulations, something that obviously has not been done for far too long.

I hope I have answered your questions sufficently...

AVB-AMG

[AVB-AMG]

Originally Posted by AzX5

You can say the same thing of the Democratic Party. They have been hijacked by the Michael Moore, MoveOn.org, left-wing Hollywood loones. Democrats like JFK would be considered moderate Republicans today, small-government, strong defense, etc., etc.

Your logic makes sense, you just have the parties swapped.

AzX5:
I think Michael Moore is an entertaining left-wing fanatic whose rants do not represent all Democrats, just as the crap that Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter spew out do not represent all Republicans.

JFK is so far from today's Republican sensibilities that I had to LOL at your statement. JFK is a pure Democrat who started the Peace Corps for youth to help other less fortunate people in other countries. He was certainly more moderate than our current President George Bush who created one of the largest deficits in US government history (and we thought only Democrats did that....) and expanded the government bureaucracy by creating The Bureau of Homeland Security. Hmmm.

I guess that I at this point in my life I recognize the inherent problems and limitations of our 2-Party political system. The simplistic labels of liberal vs. conservative do not fit most people's beliefs, values, morals and sentiments. My rather simplistic assumption is that approx. 25% of the American voting public are hard-core, left-wing liberal Democrats and that another 25% are equally adamant, hard-core right wing conservative Republicans. That leaves approximately 50% of the voting American public as more realistically Independents who do not really want to be labeled either a Democrat or Republican. They may allow themselves to be labeled as such since they want to be accepted and liked by their family, neighbors and co-workers, need to do so in order to vote in the Primaries and ultimately don't want to make a big issue that they don't necessarily fit into a defined group or political platform. These are people who is some cases will tell a pollster what they think they may want to hear then vote their true beliefs.

The other concern I have about the current state of the Republican party is that far too many Republicans of all ages seem to display an attitude of fear against change. This fear is also augmented and personified by a self-centered sense of entitlement, selfishness and greed. They have a resentment to the concept that others deserve equal chances for success., (i.e. natural born citizens vs. naturalized citizens). They have obviously decided to become a party that excludes variety to a point of blatant bigotry and racism, expressed with a real mean spiritedness and intolerance, (i.e as exhibited by most conservative radio talk show hosts). They ridicule and ostracize those who do not accept all of their beliefs and insist on imposing their religious beliefs and rules on the rest of us. Unless the Republican party recognizes and accepts that these traits are causing many more people to reject and leave the party than join it, it runs the risk of becoming a minority party for years to come.
(BTW, I am a WASP that was born in the U.S.A. in the midwest)
AVB-AMG

[AzX5]

Originally Posted by AVB-AMG

AzX5:
I think Michael Moore is an entertaining left-wing fanatic whose rants do not represent all Democrats, just as the crap that Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter spew out do not represent all Republicans.

JFK is so far from today's Republican sensibilities that I had to LOL at your statement. JFK is a pure Democrat who started the Peace Corps for youth to help other less fortunate people in other countries. He was certainly more moderate than our current President George Bush who created one of the largest deficits in US government history (and we thought only Democrats did that....) and expanded the government bureaucracy by creating The Bureau of Homeland Security. Hmmm.

I guess that I at this point in my life I recognize the inherent problems and limitations of our 2-Party political system. The simplistic labels of liberal vs. conservative do not fit most people's beliefs, values, morals and sentiments. My rather simplistic assumption is that approx. 25% of the American voting public are hard-core, left-wing liberal Democrats and that another 25% are equally adamant, hard-core right wing conservative Republicans. That leaves approximately 50% of the voting American public as more realistically Independents who do not really want to be labeled either a Democrat or Republican. They may allow themselves to be labeled as such since they want to be accepted and liked by their family, neighbors and co-workers, need to do so in order to vote in the Primaries and ultimately don't want to make a big issue that they don't necessarily fit into a defined group or political platform. These are people who is some cases will tell a pollster what they think they may want to hear then vote their true beliefs.

The other concern I have about the current state of the Republican party is that far too many Republicans of all ages seem to display an attitude of fear against change. This fear is also augmented and personified by a self-centered sense of entitlement, selfishness and greed. They have a resentment to the concept that others deserve equal chances for success., (i.e. natural born citizens vs. naturalized citizens). They have obviously decided to become a party that excludes variety to a point of blatant bigotry and racism, expressed with a real mean spiritedness and intolerance, (i.e as exhibited by most conservative radio talk show hosts). They ridicule and ostracize those who do not accept all of their beliefs and insist on imposing their religious beliefs and rules on the rest of us. Unless the Republican party recognizes and accepts that these traits are causing many more people to reject and leave the party than join it, it runs the risk of becoming a minority party for years to come.
(BTW, I am a WASP that was born in the U.S.A. in the midwest)
AVB-AMG

I agree with just about everything you said. I disagree with your opinion that the Republican party is any more racist or intolerant than the Democratic party (just look at which party has the most minorities appointed to high office positions). I know of many racists that are Hillary democrats that would rather not vote at all than vote for Obama, which is very sad considering there is very little difference in policy between Obama and Hillary. And nowhere did I state or imply Bush is a moderate, only that JFK would fit right in as a moderate in today's Republican party.

Both parties disgust me and neither candidate is impressive in the least, but I am a conservative-leaning independent who is sick of the Harry Reid, Nancy Pelosi nuts who have steered the Democratic party far to the left and don't know the meaning of bi-partisanship. Obama will fall right along those party lines as he always has, whereas McCain will compromise to get things done (IMO).