Obama: Ayres is just some guy who lives in my neighborhood

[MrLabGuy]

Originally Posted by AVB-AMG

To: MrLabGuy & Wagner:

Hey guys....
You both have certainly demonstrated your knowledge and verboseness on a wide range of political issues surrounding this upcoming Presidential race. I appreciate many of the points of view that you both have expressed and agree with some and disagree with others, and I have tried to explain my opinions. We are all obviously very interested in the outcome of this Presidential election, but come on... really now. I have been called O.C. (primarily by my wife), but you guys are taking the cake on this... As my teenage neice would say: "get a life...."
Do you really think you are going to change anyone's mind here?
I really tend to doubt it. I dare say that most of us have already made up our minds of who we are going to vote for and why...

I wish I had the free time that you two apparently have to spend on researching, articulating and typing to generate this obsessive, adnauseam posting on obscure things that probably don't have a real bearing on the important issues that are most important to most of the voters. I guess you just like to "stir up the pot" and see what happens. That can be interesting for awhile but gets old very quickly.

It is almost as if you are trying to win an argument that cannot and will not be won here in this format. Certainly not in a forum comprised of BMW owner's and aficionados. Just cast your vote on Nov. 4th and wait with the rest of us to see what the results are.

I would hope that even though the Republican and Democrat Presidential campaigns are both now going to an even lower/dirtier level on their television and mailer ad campaigns for the last 4 weeks of the campaign, that it will not be a parallel situation in this forum. I'd like to think that we are all respectful of each other, so as to not turn our posts into a silly WWF-like contact sport remarks that degrades into name-calling sarcasm and cynicism, let alone down-right misleading statements or lies. If that is your intention or idea of fun then you are missing my point entirely.

So, on behalf of anyone and everyone else in this forum who shares my sentiments, I respectfully request that you guys "lighten up", take a breath and go for a long drive in your BMW (I assume you both have BMW's.....?), out in the fresh air with some nice pleasant scenery, away from your computer and Internet. It is amazing what it will do for your perspective and tolerance of other people's opinions. Remember, we may not agree on many things but it does get a bit tiresome to listen to (or read), opinions that evolve into obsessive and unyielding rants.

My thoughts and opinion,

AVB-MAG

Thanks for your thoughts and I appreciate your concern for my well being. I assure you life is good and I'm quite the jovial guy living life to its fullest. I work out every day, I have hobbies like high fidelity music, oil painting, piano and photography.I keep up on the issues. I have a wonderful family consisting of a wife I've been with since we were 15 years old which is 27 years to date. We have a wonderful 2 year old as seen in my avatar. I have a wonderful job in the medical sales field which pays me enough commission to afford a very flexible work schedule.

My issue with Ayres has to do with his background and his very radical ideology. He likes Obama and even announced his campaign coming out party in his home. The foundation he has provided millions to push his radical agenda on school kids which Obama helped organize and run. Ayres has no apologies for his past and in fact still holds the same radical beliefs. Instead of working with bombs he now works with dollars but his agenda has not changed. Obama was very much a part of his activities as seen in his participation in Ayres foundation.

Now Obama wants to be the President of the United States and does not want anyone to know about or talk about his past and present associations. Look at his patterns not just Ayres. Rev. Wright and other show who Obama chooses to associate with and though he is one of the most Liberal Senators in his short time his history revels more about his radical beliefs. He's been able to move to the Left to get elected but I fear his real agenda will ultimately harm America.

If you and others feel comfortable ignoring this side of Obama then go ahead. Eric does not seem to care that Ayres used bombs because he believes you should be able to do anything illegal or not to change the direction of America. I'm betting that Eric is in the minority. Those of you who say Ayres and Wright don't matter make me worry even more.

Good day...I'm off to do a couple of hours worth of work and then do my part to stimulate the economy by shopping for some new toys.

[AVB-AMG]

Originally Posted by Wagner

Ah, where did I post to this thread again? Oh to say it was a political forum, which it is. Feel free not to enter it unless you want to see this chatter I respectfully ask that you don't enter a political forum to say "don't talk politics". Thanks for coming out though.

Also, it is sort of funny that 10 of your 33 posts are in Political forums on a BMW board

Wagner:

I am afraid you missed my point.

I recognize the difference and make the distinction between "chatter" and "talking politics" and when it digresses to "obsessive, silly and inconsequential" posts. From what I have been reading most recently of your posts, it seems like they are starting to voice what some (me), may interpret as somewhat of a superior attitude along with unpleasant sarcasm. Don't get me wrong. I appreciate well placed appropriate sarcasm, but yours are not of that vein.

Oh, by the way, I also went thought a short phase of experimenting using various "Smiles" but grew tired of their silliness, realizing that they ultimately can and usually do distract and detract from the point being made in the narrative. For such serious topics they tend to trivialize and juvenilize you and your points, having the opposite intended effect.

As far as posts go, as a previous owner of two BMW X5's and with my wife currently having a 335ci, more than 2/3's of my posts in this forum are on BMW-related topics, primarily for X5's and the X6, (sort of appropriate for the BMW X5world forum, don't you think....).
From what I can see the vast majority of your posts, of the 14,854 posts, (and counting.... at 11.3 posts per day!), have been made in the "Lounge" and now the politics sub-forum, and are non-BMW related. Are you still interested in discussing BMW's at all or just focusing on politics?

I am curious. Do you also do a "cut & past" of your posts here on some other political blog which would be a more appropriate venue for this topic and where you would be exposed to even more different opinions? If so, which one?

AVB-AMG

[Wagner]

Originally Posted by AVB-AMG

Wagner:

I am afraid you missed my point.

I recognize the difference and make the distinction between "chatter" and "talking politics" and when it digresses to "obsessive, silly and inconsequential" posts. From what I have been reading most recently of your posts, it seems like they are starting to voice what some (me), may interpret as somewhat of a superior attitude along with unpleasant sarcasm. Don't get me wrong. I appreciate well placed appropriate sarcasm, but yours are not of that vein.

Oh, by the way, I also went thought a short phase of experimenting using various "Smiles" but grew tired of their silliness, realizing that they ultimately can and usually do distract and detract from the point being made in the narrative. For such serious topics they tend to trivialize and juvenilize you and your points, having the opposite intended effect.

As far as posts go, as a previous owner of two BMW X5's and with my wife currently having a 335ci, more than 2/3's of my posts in this forum are on BMW-related topics, primarily for X5's and the X6, (sort of appropriate for the BMW X5world forum, don't you think....).
From what I can see the vast majority of your posts, of the 14,854 posts, (and counting.... at 11.3 posts per day!), have been made in the "Lounge" and now the politics sub-forum, and are non-BMW related. Are you still interested in discussing BMW's at all or just focusing on politics?

I am curious. Do you also do a "cut & past" of your posts here on some other political blog which would be a more appropriate venue for this topic and where you would be exposed to even more different opinions? If so, which one?

AVB-AMG

Wow you have a lot of gaul for someone brand new to a forum to be so direct in your opinions, amazing. I guess that is the 'joy' for lack of a better word, of the Internet.

Not sure what your point is here. You don't like reading political threads that what, you don't agree with? Don't like the tone of? or Can't express an opinion on? Frankly I don't really care as you seem to be the ONLY person who has ever expressed this in the years I've been on this forum.

I'll give you credit for trying your little jabs such as "cut and paste" and what not. Really I'd prefer that you simply address an opinion, but I'm guessing you can't for one reason or another.

[GUINNESS]

Ummm, for those people who do not feel like reading posts 9 thru 13, let me summarize with a picture and Webster's definition....

dictionary results for: off-topic
Webster's New Millennium™ Dictionary of English - Cite This Source - Share This Main Entry: off-topic
Part of Speech: adj
Definition: differing from the main topic; not relevant
Etymology: 1982-87


Webster's New Millennium™ Dictionary of English, Preview Edition (v 0.9.7)
Copyright © 2003-2008 Lexico Publishing Group, LLC

Now back to your Obama/Ayres political bantering.

[Wagner]

Awesome.

[JCL]

Well, I read posts 9 through 13. I think that AVB-AMG has a point. I don't think there is a problem with political posts per se, but the excessive detail about trivia gets tiresome, not acknowledging both sides of an issue is even more tiresome, and those are the conclusions that I took away from his first post in this thread. Yes, this is the political forum. That isn't the issue. How about a debate, and not name-calling, or continuous sarcasm? Nobody here wants to be called a bully I presume.

On a side note: Wagner, what do you have against the Gauls? I know they are French, and that creates challenges for some Americans, but lets be tolerant now....

Carry on. (shamelessly lifted from one of our favourite two 'Vette drivers).

[MrLabGuy]

Originally Posted by JCL

Well, I read posts 9 through 13. I think that AVB-AMG has a point. I don't think there is a problem with political posts per se, but the excessive detail about trivia gets tiresome, not acknowledging both sides of an issue is even more tiresome, and those are the conclusions that I took away from his first post in this thread. Yes, this is the political forum. That isn't the issue. How about a debate, and not name-calling, or continuous sarcasm? Nobody here wants to be called a bully I presume.

On a side note: Wagner, what do you have against the Gauls? I know they are French, and that creates challenges for some Americans, but lets be tolerant now....

Carry on. (shamelessly lifted from one of our favourite two 'Vette drivers).

Yeah...I see your point. Details seem to get in the way of the Obama campaign.

How about this:

Republicans...Bad
Democrats...Worse

I'm voting for the lesser of two evils.

[tijanaw]

Originally Posted by MrLabGuy

Yeah...I see your point. Details seem to get in the way of the Obama campaign.

How about this:

Republicans...Bad
Democrats...Worse

I'm voting for the lesser of two evils.

I think at this point, even my 15 months old baby knows who you voting for. carry on.....

[Eric5273]

Originally Posted by MrLabGuy

I'm voting for the lesser of two evils.

When you do that, do you know what you end up with? Evil.

Why don't you instead vote for one of the many other candidates. Surely one of them must represent your views more than these two. How about Bob Barr? He's a good conservative and would surely be closer to what you believe than McCain.

If you think voting for a third party is wasting your vote, just remember that your vote means nothing anyway since you are in CA. Obama is going to win your state by a landslide regardless of whether you vote or not. So why not instead use your vote to protest the two party system by voting for someone who you actually like.

[MrLabGuy]

Originally Posted by Eric5273

When you do that, do you know what you end up with? Evil.

Why don't you instead vote for one of the many other candidates. Surely one of them must represent your views more than these two. How about Bob Barr? He's a good conservative and would surely be closer to what you believe than McCain.

If you think voting for a third party is wasting your vote, just remember that your vote means nothing anyway since you are in CA. Obama is going to win your state by a landslide regardless of whether you vote or not. So why not instead use your vote to protest the two party system by voting for someone who you actually like.

I'm considering Bob Barr.