What's the matter with Donald Trump.

[Maruzo]

Originally Posted by crystalworks

What do you mean by this?

Remember the herd immunity you mentioned a couple of months ago?

I said the goal should never be to intentionally allow it to happen, since doing that is basically giving up the fight against this virus outbreak and just let the virus weed out the weak and feeble.

While nature does that all the time, we shouldn't allow that to happen if we have the right tools and the right strategy to avoid LETTING hundreds of thousands die unnecessarily.

I think that's what Trump wanted to do from the start. He was basically giving us up to the mercy of the virus right from the get go.

But that's just my opinion.

The fact is, we've failed so miserably in trying to contain this pandemic that the tide of the infection is probably at a stage where the rate of infection is far outpacing the effort of containment.

Dr. Fauci and many others has been warning us we'll see a massive increase in infection this winter season. He's right on the money.

The vaccine wont be ready for the general public for at least a few months.

I think that's why Biden is asking the American public to mask up for 100 days. Give the distribution channel time to set up and distribute the vaccine in time to put this virus out of commission.

[crystalworks]

Originally Posted by Maruzo

We are on track to have the outbreak infect over the entire population in the very nearly future.

I just wanted to know what you meant by the above. It didn't compute. We are sitting at almost 15.5 million which is nowhere near the entire population. I just wanted to clarify your statement.

Originally Posted by Maruzo

I think that's why Biden is asking the American public to mask up for 100 days. Give the distribution channel time to set up and distribute the vaccine in time to put this virus out of commission.

Definitely. Masks should be worn by all in public spaces. People not doing so are being obstinate for the sake of being so. I said that since day 1, when the CDC and WHO were advising against it.

Regarding herd immunity. I was taking the position (or trying to) there was likely not going to be anything we could do (besides masking up) until a vaccine was available. That's all. Regardless of who is in power the American public is not going to comply with a long term lockdown. The people are too divided and most lack the financial ability to stop working, as Americans don't save very well given our debt and consumer driven economy. If we reached herd immunity first, so be it, but we are obviously far from that with the "low" number of cases relative to population (~4.7% of the populous).

I guess I'm just more pragmatic in thinking that, realistically, we were not going to be able to save everyone and/or stamp out this virus in quick fashion. Many who passed had underlying conditions and were vulnerable. I obviously feel for all of those who have lost someone. I have multiple family members who were infected and we were all very fortunate that their effects were minor.

Yes, I have always agreed Trump is an idiot. But placing "hundreds of thousands" of dead at his feet is probably not only incorrect, but closed-minded. I think I am just tired of the tribal politics being spewed from both sides of the political aisle. It's a disservice to the country every bit as much as Trump's challenging the election results is.

[Maruzo]

He’s more than just an idiot. To simply state he’s an idiot is to dismiss or discount his negative impact on our country.

The buck does stop with him, and his negative impact on the covid effort accounts for a large portion of the blame on the 284,000 dead and counting.

We were never going to come out of this without significant casualties, but we could have saved a lot more people if he had done what he needed to do instead of taking the cowards way out.

That part of blame will remain his long after this pandemic is over.

I don’t know why you keep thinking this is tribal politics. I simply pointed out his fucks ups.

[crystalworks]

Originally Posted by Maruzo

He’s more than just an idiot. To simply state he’s an idiot is to dismiss or discount his negative impact on our country...

I don’t know why you keep thinking this is tribal politics. I simply pointed out his fucks ups.

Because he's barely more of a money grubbing idiot than most of our elected officials. The rest of them just go out of their way to hide it. So out of touch with reality and the majority of the American populous that someone like Trump can actually be elected. It's a reflection of the system itself.

Please enumerate the damages that Trump has done. I very much want to know because as far as I can tell... aside from covid, nothing is that different. And the few things that are, will be reversed by Biden/Harris (Paris climate accord, trade, etc). Not that those things help the average US citizen in any way.

bcredliner is right. Major changes need to take place, campaign reform, term limits, lobbying, Citizen's United, etc. Until that happens, our government is not acting in our best interest. Whether they are on the blue side of the aisle, or the red. 250 years is a good run for a republic. The people have lost their self reliance and sense of pride in individual responsibility.

[AVB-AMG]

Originally Posted by crystalworks

Because he's barely more of a money grubbing idiot than most of our elected officials. The rest of them just go out of their way to hide it. So out of touch with reality and the majority of the American populous that someone like Trump can actually be elected. It's a reflection of the system itself.

Please enumerate the damages that Trump has done. I very much want to know because as far as I can tell... aside from covid, nothing is that different. And the few things that are, will be reversed by Biden/Harris (Paris climate accord, trade, etc). Not that those things help the average US citizen in any way.

bcredliner is right. Major changes need to take place, campaign reform, term limits, lobbying, Citizen's United, etc. Until that happens, our government is not acting in our best interest. Whether they are on the blue side of the aisle, or the red. 250 years is a good run for a republic. The people have lost their self reliance and sense of pride in individual responsibility.

crystalworks:

I agree that there is rot in both political parties and that major reforms need to be made, especially for national fair and uniform voting system in every state; basic political campaign reform; term limits for Senators, Representative, and Supreme Court Justices, lobbying regulations, etc...

Regarding Donald Trump, I believe that he has never had a coherent vision of what the Presidency was intended to be by our Founding Fathers. When an egomaniac real estate grifter becomes president, the first never to have served either in the military or public office, you get a miserable reduction in the competence and prestige of the office.

After four years, it is quite apparent that this president is the most inappropriate, unfit and ridiculous leader we've ever elected. He is a mafia-style Brutus ignoramus that, given his narcissistic personality disorder and pathological lying, along with his deep insecurities, should never have been allowed to exploit the powers of the presidency...for his own narrow, and capricious, self-interests. Remember that one of Donald Trump 2016 campaign promises included to “drain the swamp”, but he then proceeded to install various lobbyists, corporate plunderers and other unqualified people with various vested interests, into key cabinet and agency positions. His administration has been a revolving door, where by this year anyone with any real competence had left the Trump administration and the remainders and/or replacements are all junior varsity political hacks and compliant sycophants, including his Chief of Staff, Press Secretary and Secretary of State who are all totally incompetent.

Anyone who has been paying attention can see and understand that Trump functions as though he is acting as the CEO of this country, which he thinks is his private company. His narcissism prevents him from seeing anything as more important than himself. In his official capacity, Trump acts the part of a sleazy, ingenuine populist; he proposes simple-minded solutions that do not work, to problems that he does not understand. He always acts with the goals of pandering to his political base’s prejudices and in his personal financial interests of those of his family members and his corporate donors. In reality, Mr. Trump does not function as President of the United States, he functions as the President of his minority political faction. Donors get it; giving Trump money generates lucrative perks and benefits. Trump buys rich friends via “deregulation”, i.e. his negating environmental protections to allow industries to dump toxins saves industry more money than it cost them to buy Trump’s affections. Thinking of Trump’s administration as a pay-to-play influence peddling racket operated by a career grifter makes more sense than calling Trump a President.

Another question you may want to ask is what actual Trump campaign promises were met...
Did his bring back manufacturing jobs? No. Did he save the coal industry? No. Did he repeal and replace Obamacare with a better and less expensive healthcare plan? No. Did he build a wall along our entire southern border, that Mexico would pay for? No. Did he solve our illegal immigration problem at our southern border? No. What he did do was fill almost 2/3’s of the Federal judiciary with conservative judges sympathetic to the religious right. His biggest act was the deficit-busting tax cut, that was not really Trump’s idea, but that of the Republican congress, for the benefit of their corporate “constituents” and campaign finance patrons.

Finally, one of the most frightening aspects of Trump's presidency has been the way he has normalized unenlightened self-interest as an expression of patriotism and national pride. For many folks, his platform of "America First" has become shorthand for "Me First," and the idea that American exceptionalism is predicated not on communal values but the myopic selfishness of individuals. We see that Trump is a nihilist. Even worse, he is the personification of all would-be dictators who merge the office being held with one's own "being"; i.e., Trump doesn't represent the people of the United States, he is the avatar of "The People," or approximately 47% of the body politic who have bought into the “cult of Trump”.

I can hardly wait for Trump to vacate the White House, if necessary, being frog-walked out by the Secret Service and FBI…

AVB-AMG

[AVB-AMG]

Originally Posted by Maruzo

He can’t even bring himself to properly convince the public to use a face mask, much less social distance or avoid large gatherings.

Originally Posted by Maruzo

I think that's why Biden is asking the American public to mask up for 100 days. Give the distribution channel time to set up and distribute the vaccine in time to put this virus out of commission.

Maruzo:

We all have seen this year how a number of vocal people on the right are enraged at any suggestion that their actions should take other people’s welfare into account. This rage is sometimes portrayed as love of freedom. But these same people who insist on the right to pollute are notably unbothered by, say, federal agents tear-gassing peaceful protesters. What they call “freedom” is actually the absence of responsibility. Rational policy in a virus pandemic, however, is all about taking responsibility. The main reason you shouldn’t go to a bar and should wear a mask isn’t just for self-protection, although that’s part of it; the point is that congregating in noisy, crowded spaces or exhaling aerosol droplets into shared air where you are exposed to it for a reasonable period of time, puts other people at risk. I do not believe that wearing a mask is the sole solution to reducing the virus pandemic, but it is a significant contributing factor, along with social distancing and frequent hand washing, let alone avoiding congregating with many folks indoors. These precautions should be very clear to everyone by now.

It is also quite clear now that Republicans have sacralized selfishness, regardless that it has been hurting their own political prospects, by insisting on the right to act selfishly even when it puts others at risk. Their idea of freedom seems to be freedom to care only about themselves abandoning any pretense of caring for their neighbors. Not wanting to wear a mask at this time seems to be a mixture of selfishness, emotional immaturity and inability to deal with a short period of discomfort for a temporary and minor inconvenience of mask wearing.

I understand and agree that wearing a face mask can be a real PITA!. I hate how my reading glasses usually fog up when I am wearing a face mask, requiring that I frequently remove them. But I still wear the damn thing!
Especially now, since we know that wearing a mask is one of the basic things that appears to have the most meaningful effect of reducing the spread of the airborne COVID-19 virus particles.

So at this point, I just may have a tee shirt made with the slogan;
"Wearing a mask is not a political statement - it's an IQ test."

AVB-AMG