Possible source of concern for BMW AG
 

Hello folks. I have not been on this forum for a very long time, and stopped by just to make this post. There are so many things going on at this time, that i simply don't have time to come here as much as I wish I could.

So, long story short - my wife (yeah, I know, I know!!!) is driving my car last Thursday, and the car shuts off on her. she tries to restart it, to no avail, calls me in panic, I am coming home from work, find her stranded a mile away from home on a shoulder (some strangers pushed the car to the shoulder) with kids sitting on the side of the shoulder, waiting for me. I tried to start the car, the auto starter is cranking strong, nothing else is happening. Sounds as if engine is flooded or if there is no fuel coming. I can't listen to the pump priming, so I have the car towed home.

As I listen to the pump, I do not hear it priming, so I check fuse 47 in glove compartment, it is good (tested good), I dig into the glove compartment for the relay, swap it with other same relays, still, no priming.

pull the rear seat, cut the sound barrier, test the voltage on the pump pins, good voltage. Look at the pump's connectors, one connector is darker than the rest, and seems to have oil residue around it... hmmm..

it is middle of night on Thursday, going on to Friday, so I get on line, order a new pump from BMW of Fairfax for about $330 with the tax. Early in the morning call them, confirm they have the part, pick it up in the afternoon, come home and replace the pump in the late evening (spill total about 10mL of fuel!). Car starts right up, after test drive around house, still starts right up. All good!

Total cost is

$330 for the pump
$1 for a hose clamp from Home Depot
$5 for rubber mallet (that I can use for my work later)
$20 for shop towels (that I will use for my work later)

But the kicker is here... As I went to inspect the old pump, I see that one of the power pins has fallen into the opening of the plastic housing. What??!! Did not take a genius to realize, that the pin overheated and MELTED the plastic around itself and the pin fell through.

This is a serious reason for a concern - a HEAT source next to highly COMBUSTIBLE substance!!! I smelled gasoline inside the car for some time, and was "blaming" the fuel filter, but once the pump was replaced, there is no more gasoline smell. So, this plastic melting business was going on for some time.

Here are some pictures

Has the X been operated in a low voltage state (battery below 12.2v or alternator charging below 13.5 v)?

Just pointing out that as volts drop, amps increase (lots of heat).

OBC shows 13.2 - 13.8V during driving, with occasional 14.1V. Car is driven at highway speeds for 40 miles one way about 4-5 times a week. This battery was changed for an AGM on 10/30/13, was strong then, still shows no signs of weakness. Load tested the battery, in rest state under load showed 11.9V, which is within specs of a good battery.

Nevertheless, I will continue watching the battery, just in case it has some issues.

Please file a report with NHTSA. Every safety problem you have. I'm still dumbstruck my 01 was never recalled for the seat mat or ABS module.

https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/VehicleComplaint/

I've not experience this issue in any of our cars.

But I would cut and re-splice and source out new connectors and pins.

For peace of mind.

I am not going to reuse this pump, so no need to fix connector. Main concern is, source of ignition inside a gas tank.

Sent from my LG-E980 using Tapatalk

Wow that could have been really bad.. glad your family was ok. I've never seen that happen before.

WOW! I suppose the fuel wouldn't ignite unless there was some kind of spark (or the flash point of the fuel.) still scary stuff! definitely file a complaint with bmwna and send them a photo!!!!!

That level of heat shouldn't (can't) ignite fuel but why take the risk!! :confused:

Fuel pumps worry me; electric motors immersed in fuel. Yikes... :yikes: I've replaced a few but never seen your issue. My motorcycle (a BMW) is known for breaking the wire that got hot in your car. Double yikes.. :yikes: :yikes:

What did the mating connector look like? As it has the female pin, the issue could be there, with a loose fitting socket. The replacement pump connector may suffer the same fate. It might be a good idea to check the mating connector, retention the contacts with a small (jewelers) screwdriver or the like, and use a good contact treatment.

*edit* just re-read this thread realised that jopecasa suggested replacing the mating connector - good idea! :thumbup:

+1 for immediately checking the mating connector. The one you took a picture of looked fine, I bet you have a bad connection on the female end. I had this issue on a coil for the ignition. And, gasoline as a liquid isn't as flammable as the fumes. ANd if you were smelling gas, that was the fumes. Think of that connector/heat like a welder. The pump was calling for amperage, and the connection was weak. And like a welder, it was arcing and sparking(maybe not literally)trying to get the connection to that bullet connector. Good luck.

I did not replace the mating connector as I have completed the work in the middle of a night (it would have been a cool fireworks show if the thing would go KABOOM!!! lol).

I will check the mating connector as soon as I get a chance, to see if it has any burn marks, and will see if i can replace it. I am sorry, jopecasa, I have mistakenly thought you suggested repairing the connector on the pump, but repairing/replacing mating connector makes sense.

I do not know the flash point of the 92 octane fuel with 10% ethanol, nor I am aware of the conditions needed for fuel to ignite, such as presence of oxygen/air in the tank. But still, the fact of electricity inside fuel tank got me to think if this idea safe in the first place. I am not sure if there any better engineering solutions to this submerged fuel pumps...

Once I get a chance, I will see what is needed to submit to the NHTSA, and to the BMW NA, or BMW AG. I don't want to get the BMW in trouble with authorities, so maybe it should go to the BMW first...

As far as pumps in the fuel tank, almost 100% of cars today go that route and have for many years. The pump completely immersed in the fuel doesn't allow oxegyn to be present, so the "sparks" of the motor running don't go anywhere. And actually there probably aren't any sparks because of what I said. So, by design it is fine and very dependable. Better to concentrate on the issue you found. I would be very surprised if you received any kind of response from any of those agencies you mentioned. But, please keep us posted.

Could the pump failing (motor) have been drawing too much current and caused the problem?

Conversely, perhaps the female connection was not as tight as normal/required and contributed to the pump's demise?

I think the first is more likely in this case though. Can't hurt sending info to BMW NA though I am not sure there is a design fault/safety issue. They should be able allay your concerns assuming they don't just respond with a "Thank you for contacting BMWNA" form letter.

Thread title is a stretch...

Their S54/S65/S85 rod bearing issues in hundreds, maybe thousands of ///M cars are barely tipping the scale as far as being a problem for them. I don't think they'll give an issue like this a second look, even if you weren't the only one to report a similar case.

My two cents...

Damn, that sucks. Looks like another thing to check.

Glad everyone is ok.

I would replace pump harness plug ASAP! Based on the picture, that pin reached pretty high temperature and most likely lost its silver coating and spring action causing point of high resistance. This pump could easily draw 10 Amp of current, which will cause overheat at the point of high resistance, possibly overheat and damaging connection pin on the new pump assembly. As for the cause of the problem in the first place – I would think that worn out pump caused higher current draw or possible issue with fuel pressure regulator, obstructed fuel filter, etc. All of this may cause fuel pump to draw excessive current. Good idea to check fuel pressure both at idle and under load.

Do you think this recall is talking about my issue? my year is not covered but symptoms are very close...

Sounds like it. Interesting...

Interestingly enough, the part number 16116768357 comes in RealOEM for 4.8is only, and not cross-referencing to any other models

The pump's screw ring is cross-referencing for many models (16116762417) from 1995 on some bimmers, to 2016 on some RR cars. I am not saying that the pumps are the same because the retaining ring is the same...

I need to put this on my to do list to get the info out to the BMW AG (or BMW NA) and give them the pictures of my pump, maybe I get lucky and recover my $300 I paid for the part...