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Vibration at idle in Drive solved.
:thumbup:Just wanted to share something with everyone.
I was experiencing a lot of vibrations at idle in gear, stopped with foot on the brake. This was occuring in both reverse and drive. I previously replaced both engine mounts and this did not resolve the problem. This weekend I replaced the right front CV Shaft in my 2003 X5 3.0l and now the vibration is non existent and the car drives as smooth as when it was new. |
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Very sorry, Could you put a Diagram of CV shaft from RealOEM for me?
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The right front inner CV joint had a lot of play. I removed the front wheel and grabbed the shaft and moved it up and down. The inner joint has about a 1/4 of play. I went to Advanced Auto and bought the completeshaft NEW for $115 dollars, plus sockets to remove the old one and mount the new one, two different sizes.
Check your cv joints. Prior to this I had replaced all the motor mounts and the vibration persisted. The motor mount change was a waste of moeny. |
Good find. I have the same issue. Could be one of them
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Mine vibrates at idle at times but it has two new cv axles and wheel bearings so that isn't the fix for mine.
Mine is bad when the ac is off but not that bad when the ac is on as it raises the idle some. Pressing the gas pedal to raise rpm 50 to 100 rpm makes it stop vibrating completely. |
Did u use reman axles? Some people have had terrible results with those. Also hows the condition of your guibos? Have u also tried/checked out all the common things eg cleaned icv, checked motor mounts/trans mount etc?
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As for hunting for the vibration I haven't at all. I read several places it was kind of normal and bmw even had a tis about changing the idle speed to solve it for people so I just figured it was something I had to live with. If its not normal I may hunt for the cause. It has over 200k miles on it so motor mounts could be shot and a number of other areas. Im waiting for next year to do a suspension refresh with all new struts, bushings etc. |
How bad of a vibration is it? I can feel it ever so slightly when I’m at a stop light. In neutral , it’s perfectly smooth. I don’t think it’s alarming just a light buzz in my seat.
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I changed both front output shaft's last week. Old one's had lot of play. Now with new shaft's I can feel quite a vibration while foot on the brake and on d/r. It seem to resonate more when ac is on. But as soon as you let go of the brake it goes away and while driving no issues. Probable next best bet will be engine mount's... Old shaft's probably ate all vibration because they had so much play in them? :D
When the car is cold, doesn't seem to have that problem. |
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New motor mounts are in. No change on the vibration...:rolleyes:
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Not yet, but I tried it with d on and with gas pedal and it won't go away until 900'ish rpm...
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Trans mount will be next... Gotta figure out how to change it without expensive tool made for the job.:D
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https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07PV5XGCV...ations_asins_1 Sent from my SM-A730F using Tapatalk |
Wish I could get it for that price in europe.
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Sent from my SM-A730F using Tapatalk |
I just looked and they ship to Finland for 43.13 USD
Sent from my SM-A730F using Tapatalk https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...b7395a5616.jpg |
Yep, with import fees and taxes price is gonna grow.:(
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This one listed as zero taxes, import duties but not sure how they can know it for sure.
You could do it without the tool but you may as well do the guibo, center support bearing at the same time. Sent from my SM-A730F using Tapatalk |
These days every shipment goes to customs outside europe in finland... And of course you have to pay. But gotta look if I could get from europe.
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I have been dealing with this issue for a few years. Same thing as has been described -- car shaking a little while stopped in drive which goes away when the engine is unloaded by shifting to neutral.
Recently I was driving on the highway and got a check engine light with the car all of a sudden shuddering under acceleration, extremely lumpy idle, was able to get home fortunately and parked the car. The next morning the SES light was off and the car was back to normal. Codes revealed a cylinder 6 misfire. I took the car to my indy and he said that compression check was OK with all cylinders at about 175 except for #1 at 150. He said he wasn't sure but thought that the ignition coil of #6 had a hiccup. The coils were 21 years old, car has 204,000 miles on it. Long story short, all the coils were replaced and now the car idles completely smoothly in drive. So, it was malfunctioning coils all along, they just weren't bad enough to trigger a code. I think that the ignition coils should probably be considered a routine maintenance items, like spark plugs, and replaced every 100,000 miles along with the plugs. |
Mine developed the same idle shake a few months ago. The SES light set last week for a #3 misfire. Reset and it has gone away. New plugs and coils are going in this week. Mine also needs a front right shaft. The boot is in bad shape. It could tear apart any day. Luckily, I have all four shafts ready to go on. I'll report back which part fixes my vibration.
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Mine has developed lot's of other issues too. Started with running lean codes and sometimes bank2 misfire codes. Also icv jamming codes. When it was -27c in here Finland It was very hard to get it started. I had to keep it alive with throttle for a while to get it to idle. After it idled few minutes it dropped few cylinder's off and again it was bank2 misfire (4-5-6 cylinder). I have tracked down all intake leaks and fixed them. ICV and MAF are new. Changed another set of ultrasonic cleaned injectors. And no change. Long before these vanos was rebuild, new lifters and valve stem seals.
Since I bought MAF made by hella, I'm waiting a good used original to arrive tomorrow, so I can test if it's the culprit. Also some previous owner has changed throttle body to aftermarket Topran, which is chinese. Bought a used original and waiting it to arrive also. Mine's at almost 165k miles but I have owned 20+ bmw's and never have had problem with coils, but I guess that's next step. |
How is your CCV system?
I had similar issues with mine a couple years ago and it was a combination of cracked plastic hoses and needing a new CCV system. |
Forgot that, I renewed ccv couple of months ago. Today I got original maf and now it seems to work fine. We will see, when I drive it more. But seems very promising, since lean codes came up pretty much as soon as I started the car and let it run for a while.
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I thought I had mine solved with new coils but it didn't work. Mechanic said it was the transmission so I had a new one put in and no difference. The CV shafts were also replaced, with the motor mounts, new flex discs, new driveshaft support, and new transmission mount and it made no difference.
The vibration is always there but gets worse every 10 seconds or so, which is really weird. It is worse when the wheel is turned and at idle, there is occasionally a clicking sound going on, like a clutch somewhere is engaging, and that makes it worse. Anyone know what system is being engaged when that happens? The only thing left that I can think of is the harmonic balancer, which is now 23 years old. Mechanic says that it visually looks fine. Or possibly the the main fan -- someone said in another thread that if the viscous clutch is misaligned that can do it. I have no idea what that means.... There has to be a solution to this issue. If unlimited money and time can be thrown at it, there must be a fix somehow. Is there anything else that is literally unfixable on these vehicles even if unlimited money can be spent? |
Maybe try a different mechanic. If it has some kind of pattern and associated noise like you are saying, it should be findable. Have you tried taking some belts off to eliminate some things??
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It's a 5-minute job to take the fan and clutch off if you have wrenches -- which can be had on Amazon for $20 or so IIRC. I leave mine off all winter actually, no need for it. That would diagnose whether the fan clutch might have anything to do with it, but I doubt it. |
Well well.. that clutch thing going on and off is the AC compressor. On my V8 I had a vibration and harshness circa 2500rpm and could never figure out what it was. It got way worse at 4krpm. Turns out that the ac compressor was knackered.
I had a new one installed and much better. I reckon the power steering pump may be a bit worn too.. Before that I had swapped out new motor mounts which made everything worse so I put the old ones back on. At the moment it’s sat on the drive as it went into trans failsafe the other week (see other posts) and I’ve bought another car to use while I get the X5 fixed. I intend to put in new driveshafts anyway and various other things - one of which is removing the wheel arch liners and sound deadening underneath. I spoke to a guy here in the uk who had done it on a V8 Volvo XC90 and it made a massive difference to the drive experience. I might try new motor mounts again but original BMW instead of eBay. Maybe the trans mount too. |
Haha, I was going to ask where you got the motor mounts that made it worse from! ;)
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Yes it was dreadful. Almost like the mounts were solid aluminium.. Its a right pain to change them on the V8 too. Twice.
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zonefive was a rich man, keeps replacing everything when nothing yet solves the problem... soon will become a poor man :dunno: |
Aurelius, believe it or not, I'm not running out of money anytime soon.... not that it is important.
When I turn the wheel when the car is stationary, the vibration gets much worse, so I think it definitely could be the power steering pump. I'm on a first name basis with pretty much every BMW indy in the San Diego area, no one has been able to solve this problem. Just like on this board, this is something that has eluded everyone, forever. |
I've noticed that the vibration only occurs when there is a load on the engine at idle, by placing it in drive or reverse with the brake on, and when that happens the rpms drop about 75 from 780 to about 705, and occasionally into the 650-700 area when the AC unit clutch activates, and the vibration gets much worse.
Are the rpms supposed to drop that much when the engine is engaged/loaded by the transmission? |
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The RPMs may drop that much (I have a manual so I don't know exactly, but that sounds right) but that may not be causing your vibration. The engine mounts act as a band-pass filter, transmitting vibrations in certain RPMs but not in others. The engine mounts, especially ones that are faulty, worn out, or just cheap, transmit vibrations in the low RPM ranges. The engine is making the same vibrations as any other RPM, but at lower RPMs they are just transmitted to the cabin better. Power steering pump getting a load (by turning the wheel when stationary) or turning the AC on, or putting it in D or R with your foot on the brake, these things will all lower the RPM. You said you replaced them already, what brand did you use? Also did you replace the transmission mount? (I think there is only one on top of the trans) I concur with Fifty150hs, I would double check the engine mounts -- I have had cheap brand RockAuto engine mounts that were bad the moment they came in the mail (for other makes). I would also agree that you could try raising your idle speed to try to alleviate the problem. |
The engine mounts were replaced with BMW mounts 30,000 miles ago, and then at 15,000 miles ago, just to make sure it wasn't the mounts. The transmission mount was also changed with OEM with no difference.
This is a major problem with the M54 engine on the E46 forums, and no one has been able to figure it out there either. I did find a couple places that sell ECUs that have them reprogrammed to raise the rpm to 900, vs 650, and I think I'll try that. Has anyone ever used a tuned ECU? I searched for ECU in this forum and it said the search term was too short. https://revmatchmotorsport.com/tunes/p/e46-tune https://www.redline-motorsport.com/product/ms43-tuning/ |
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It isn't the torque converter. I replaced the transmission with a rebuilt one, including the TC, and it made no difference.
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No, the mechanic I went to last said that if the harmonic balancer were the problem, then vibrations would get worse at higher rpms.
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Yep - anything rotating that's out of balance will typically cause increasing vibration as RPMs increase. Something that causes vibration at only low RPMs is either something that stops turning at higher RPMs, or an issue with an engine mount, which only transmits low-RPM vibrations through the engine into the chassis. That's why I still think this is engine-mount related. |
This problem started when the zener changed his driveshafts so that might be a clue. A driveshaft that is a hair to long or possibly binding just a bit could be a problem.
OK, sorry I think I am getting zone5 and Zener mixed up! ;) |
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Like I said, there are numerous stories of the mounts being replaced and it didn't matter. Two separate mount installations for me in 30k miles and zero difference.
I just ordered a new ECU with a 900 rpm idle and when I install it I will report back. It would be nice to find the root cause but I think that would probably involve a full effort by the BMW engineering team. |
900 RPM is really fast, maybe try lowering the RPM to 500 or 550. A big problem with these threads is that everyone has a different idea of what is a vibration, mis(fire), buzz, hesitation, bog, noise etc. so that adds to the confusion and getting to the root of the issue.
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Vibration is worse at lower rpms. This is a problem on many, many M54 engines, strangely doesn't appear to affect the V8s.
There are threads all over the internet for this problem and no one has solved it. https://xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-forums/...ss-online.html |
Are you sure you don't have a miss or weak cylinder? What are you using for scan tool? Have you done a compression test? Have you eliminated rotating elements? Have you tried to feel for vibrations in the engine bay? Did you check the driveshafts or for any other possible mechanical (maybe exhaust) transfer? You have lots of clues and things you could check but it seems you don't want to or are too lazy to follow any of them.
Have you tried lowering the idle RPM or are you just saying that it's worse ? |
It's fascinating that someone will call another person lazy from the comfort of their chair, behind a screen, when that person would never, ever do that in person for fear of getting punched in the face, or worse.
Just an observation. Not going to answer your questions -- don't interact with people like you. |
Yeah, that sounds about right.
Of course I am the lazy one because I am sitting at the computer instead of actually working on YOUR car. That is fascinating. How old are you ? |
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