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-   -   P0300, P0302, P0304, P0306, Engine running rough with little power (https://xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-forums/x5-e70-forum/102321-p0300-p0302-p0304-p0306-engine-running-rough-little-power.html)

X5Cat 11-28-2015 12:05 AM

6 Attachment(s)
Is this what I'm looking for? Not sure why I can't get Freeze Frame on anything but P0306.

jfoj 11-28-2015 12:44 AM

OK, we are starting to get data.

Typically there is only Freeze Frame info for a single code and it is usually for the first code triggered.

A few initial thoughts.

Misfires appear to occur right on start up, in this case engine was 185F or almost warmed up. I cannot tell much from Fuel Trims as engine was still on Open Loop.

What does warrant more investigation is the 11.62 Voltage. The E70 seems to poorly, if at all, notify the driver of charging system problems. This may be a Red Herring as the engine was only running for 3 seconds, so the charging system may not have fully kicking in. Also the interface may have a poor Voltage detection circuit. I would really want to watch the charging Voltage and make sure it actually operates in the 13.5-14.5 Volt range. You can watch it with your App, but may want to confirm with a Voltmeter.

Need to see if I can find any info on the P116E code, this is not a standard OBDII code, most OBDII code are all PXXXX with the X always being a number, but I have seen a few BMW's spit out some strange codes.

Next I would like to see a 4 minute warm idle Log. The tool is always Logging while connected to the vehicle.

This Log will need to be posted or sent to me.

Read my comments in this thread about Log setup.

http://www.xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-foru...07-x5-53k.html

X5Cat 11-28-2015 11:11 AM

jfoj,

Some of my own thoughts in red:

Typically there is only Freeze Frame info for a single code and it is usually for the first code triggered. What triggers the Freeze Frame ? Is there a way I can get a fresh Freeze Frame? Would there be any point?

Misfires appear to occur right on start up....Yes, it shakes from startup to shutoff, with that classic uneven exhaust stream that comes with missing cylinders.

I cannot tell much from Fuel Trims as engine was still on Open Loop.What's Open Loop, and is there a way for me to check it out of Open Loop?

What does warrant more investigation is the 11.62 Voltage...would really want to watch the charging Voltage and make sure it actually operates in the 13.5-14.5 Volt range.Yes, I noticed that as I was running the scan last night, so I cranked the engine and watched the "Dashboard" on the scan tool: 14.4V, I think it said. Also checked with my digital voltmeter a couple of days ago, want to say it was like 13.8V, with battery around 12.8V at rest. Also, when I ran scan last night I was guilty of having the X with doors open, dome lights and ignition on for quite some time, and it has been sitting around for a couple of days without running while I was doing similar things with doors open, etc. While it does make me wonder why no higher than 11.62V after 3 secs, I agree it could be a red herring.

...would like to see a 4 minute warm idle Log.I'm working on figuring out from your link how to do that.

jfoj 11-28-2015 11:38 AM

Freeze Frame is triggered or captured once the SES/CEL/MIL turns on. Typically the Freeze Frame will be triggered by the very first code, unfortunately there are times when many other codes may be triggered, but the Freeze Frame will typically be for the very first code that illuminates the SES/CEL/MIL.

Open Loop is usually only for the first 1-2 minutes of cold start. Once the O2 sensors warm up and respond then the DME changes into Closed Loop or feedback controlled fuel management. The Fuel System Status indicates the "Loop" status. OBDFusion is one of the few tools that constantly monitors this PID and allows it to be graphed. See the graph in the Link I posted earlier, you can see the Fuel System Status go to state 4 which is an Open Loop state once the engine has warmed up sufficiently. In the case of this specific engine/graph, the Loop Status should not have gone to state 4 during warm up but it was due to a lazy O2 sensor in that specific bank.

Fuel System Status has a number of states.
State 1 is Open Loop
State 2 is Closed Loop

As for the Charging Voltage, I just wanted to point this out and I was not sure there was a problem. The Freeze Frame info is just a snap shot and it was only 3 seconds into the engine running. So it sounds like the Charging Voltage is probably fine based on your further monitoring and checking.

Have you driven or fully warmed up the vehicle since you changed the spark plugs?

Will be very interested to see any Log. A Report is also helpful, but not as much as a Log. If you run a Report, make sure the engine is running, otherwise some of the data will be useless.

X5Cat 11-28-2015 12:03 PM

Just successfully accessed and emailed myself a practice log file. Now go warm up the X and try it for real....

I don't remember for sure if I fully warmed it up after changing the plugs.

X5Cat 11-28-2015 01:30 PM

2 Attachment(s)
jfoj,

I hope you can read this. I saved as pdf. You may have to zoom in. Due to size limitation, I had to cut the log in half. It was actually one continuous log, for almost 7 1/2 minutes.

Thanks!

X5Cat 11-28-2015 02:09 PM

If you notice the engine temp high in the beginning (213, 217 range), I sat with the vehicle idling for a while, while the iPhone had trouble connecting with the WiFi. After I finally got it to connect and got moving it cooled down. Does bother me that it was idling that hot, though, and in a mild ambient temperature (about 70 degrees). Maybe it is related to the way the engine is running.

jfoj 11-28-2015 02:37 PM

I need the files in a .CSV format.

The easiest way it to set up a DropBox Free account. Do this on your computer.

BUT, WARNING - YOU DO NOT WANT TO INSTALL THE DROPBOX SOFTWARE. IT WILL DO SOME CRAZY THINGS IF YOU DO NOT DISABLE AND MANAGE IT.

What you do is during the DropBox Free sign up process, once you enter your user name and password, when the prompt shows up to download and install the software, just use the Back browser button. This will take you to your Account and then you can upload the files either directly from the phone once you enter the DropBox user name and password in the OBDFusion App.

Then when you find the files in DropBox, choose Share, then a URL will pop up, just copy and paste the URL back into a forum reply here.

X5Cat 11-28-2015 02:48 PM

Okay, try this:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hsawhshlzm...04432.csv?dl=0

jfoj 11-28-2015 02:52 PM

So from an initial take here are a few observations.

Short Term Fuel Trims are opposed and very high.

I am suspicious of the P116E code. I have not found much on this, but often these screwy OBDII codes from BMW with the Hex letters tend to have something to do with the MAF.

I am not seeing a MAF reading on the Log, not sure if you capatured the proper PID, if so, the MAF is dead, the wiring is loose or broken or there may be a blown fuse somewhere.

I would start by checking the fuses for the DME. I do not recall if the E70 has fuses inside the DME box like the E54/E46/E39/E38 etc.

I think you need to make sure the MAF PID is the correct one, if there is not value being read, you need to start focusing on that issue first.


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