Xoutpost.com - Engine temperature

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Penguin (Post 703385)

I would be quite happy with that, but it is not on my X5 Diesel, although the gauge appears to have been styled for it at one point (to match the appearance of the speedometer which uses a similar approach to show the cruise control speed with a white segment on a rotating ring/disc which shows through a cutout). I believe it is only the M vehicles that have this "limit" feature.

Very likely. My M3 has that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noodle555 (Post 703383)

Now that's cool. I would love to customize the look of my display.

Yup, best of both worlds IMHO. Those who want the data get it, while those who prefer simplicity get that as well. Sorta like some of the earlier GPS models that allowed you to define your own data screen (Garmin GPS III), and which some current trail GPS's still have as a feature.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ABMW (Post 703239)

There's lots of talk about the removal of temp and oil pressure gauges throughout the auto industry.

When was the last time you saw a modern car overheat or a vehicle loose oil pressure? (exclude Fords and GM products)

The human factor and the decluttering of automobiles is being taken into consideration and instrument panels are being simplified across the board.

The exact same thing is taking place within the aviation industry , and gauges that have been standard for 60-years are now being removed or replaced with digital gauges that must be searched for through menus or are no longer present, at all.

IDrive was an attempt at simplifying the driving experience. Obviously it was a failure, and it took many years to get it right. But in it's current state, it's very "close" to where it should be.

We'll slowly start to see the removal of such gauges from all automobiles, as other indicators and instruments are added.

Though, their removal does not at all signify the designers wish for the cars to loose their sporting appeal.

Rather, quite the contrary. It's one less thing the driver must focus on, and it can be argued that drivers can actually drive quicker and safer as a result.

Sure it's nice to see a temp. gauge, for nostalgia,but a warning light will perform the same function, if required.

Trust me, the gauges were not removed at a whim. BMW, along with every other company that builds machines which interface with humans, hires psychologists who work together with engineers to create a safe and modern interface.

I'm sure there is an exact reason as to why the temp. gauge was removed, and my bet is the answer rests somewhere along the lines of what I've written above.

A customer brought a Kia through the shop (bent a tie rod hitting the curb right in front of us) and I noticed that it didn't have a guage, but more of an idiot light. I prefer the guage, and actually I still prefer the temp guages of older cars where they're not buffered, but in fact react differently if you're even in a head wind. The guage in my truck will literally change if there is a strong wind blowing, if I'm towing my trailer vs sitting at a stoplight, etc. I've had my 7 overheat and I didn't like that it took it going past 113*C before it finally bumped past the middle mark, and it has a cushion range of like 89-113 before it changes up or down from the middle...that's a big range to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ABMW (Post 703258)

You're assuming modern engines require a period of warming before they're ready to be driven off.

There are many out there that disagree with you. Google "do car engines need to be warmed."

I won't get into the debate, but it's obvious by googling that the debate was settled some time ago.

There are opinions ALL over the web, so it all needs to be taken w/ a grain of salt Between owning both E34 and E39 M5's, one having written instructions while the other has a progressive tach, I absolutely believe that engines need to be warmed up before driving past say 3-4k rpms on a cold engine. If engines didn't need to be warmed up, why do we use mutli-weight oils if, in you opinion, it's all the same regardsless of the engine temp? Sorry, but I'm not a buyer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by motordavid (Post 703265)

Not really an issue with me, in terms of disappearing gauges, but it does seem odd and, cheap, imo.

Now this I will believe. I know for my work truck, it doesn't have a tachometer because it was an option on the base models. I think removal of gauges on BMW's is coming down to the bean counters still charging the same prices for our cars, but if they can save $20 for a needle and have a $2 bulb come on, then they're going to do so. Reliable cars hurt the bottom line for the shareholders, so why let us know that are engines are cooking themselves to death. What happens when the bulb burns out? :dunno: I hope to god they're using LED's.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penguin (Post 703235)

Judging from the way I have seen them drive SUVs, I can't imagine soccer-moms being any more interested in fuel economy than in engine temperature. :D

LOL...they typically ignore CEL's lights, let alone an overheating light!

I was also surprised by this. My Z4 has a water temp gauge and I just assumed the X would have the same thing. Personally I would like to have both an oil and water temp gauge. I could give up the stupid swinging fuel economy thing anytime. I always wait for the water temp to come up before I get on it in the Z4 but still wish I had the oil temp as this would be a better indicator of engine temp and if I recall takes longer to heat up than the water temp.

That being said all car purchases are a compromise and I have never bought a car that had everything that I wanted or the way I wanted it. When I can I custom build a car on the web?

Quote:

Originally Posted by NotEntirelyJack (Post 703484)

I always wait for the water temp to come up before I get on it in the Z4

That is better than not having a gauge, but you might be interested to know that BMW on the Z4 (and maybe others) "normalized" the temperature gauge. what does this mean? Well, auto manufacturers got tired of idiots bringing their cars in with complaints when they drove in 110 degree weather in stop and go traffic with the air conditioner full-blast and they saw the temperature gauge was showing hotter than "normal." Of course, running a bit hotter under such conditions is quite normal, but lots of idiots thought the dealer's explanation was so much BS and said if it was operating properly, it should always show the same temperature when warmed-up.

So, how did the manufacturers address this dissatisfaction? They "normalized" or "buffered" the gauges. This means that when the temperature is within a range defined by the manufacturer as "normal," the gauge needle is forced to point straight-up, no matter what the actual temperature is. So once your Z4 temperature get warm enough, the needle will quickly go to straight-up. And it will not leave that position if it gets hotter or colder until the temperature goes out of the normal range, and then the needle will quickly move to the red overheating zone.

So these type of temperature gauges are better than idiot lights, but they no longer are really showing the normal fluctuations in coolant temperature.

Coolant temperature gauges have been buffered for awhile; I know my X3 shows the "normal straight up" position even if it isn't fully warmed. Around 78°C is when it approaches the mid position, and the temperature can waver between 86-98°C while driving in the M54 engine. With these newer engines that run even hotter, my mom's N52 runs anywhere from 92-107°C while driving regardless of outside temperature.

Nonetheless, BMW heard your complaints and is bringing them back. The 7er and 5er are examples of the new generation of gauges.

I prefer the oil temperature gauge if it has to have any sort of temperature gauge- more useful than coolant temp in determining when it's safe to rev beyond 5000rpm. However, I still believe that the energy control gauge is more meaningful to me on a daily basis.

If I unlock the OBC, there is what seems like an oil temp, but it's either missing the sensor or is an option that needs to be turned on. I just remember seeing one that said "OEL TEMP" but it's noton the list below.

1. Display Car's identification number, HW/SW version, construction date
2. A very beautiful instrument test
3. Current consumption (liters/hour)
4. Average consumption (liters/100 km)
5. Current range
6. I think this is remaining fuel in tank. Three sets of numbers: A/B/C. And I've noticed A+B=C.
7. Engine RPM / Coolant Temp (C)
8. Current Speed (kph)
9. System voltage at Term. "R" (Battery Voltage)
10. Country/Language (US, Spa, Ger, Jap, etc.)
11. Units am/pm
12. Average Speed
13. ETA
14. Date of Software Mask
15. Production Diagnosis
16. ""
17. Display Vehicle Specific Data
18. Alarm Changeover (cont. vs. intermittent OBC chime)
19. Lock/Unlock
20. Correction factor for fuel consumption (nicht ändern!)
21. Reset all defect codes

1. Several numbers and data
2. [Dispay Test]
3. VBR: x,x (liters/hr)
4. RW-VBR: x,x (liters/100 km)
5. RW: x (km)
6. Thttp://www.bimmerboard.com/images/emoticons/2.gifliters)
7. TMTL: x,x (liters) / KTMP C
8. V: x (kph)
9. UB: xx,xx (V)
10. LAND: 2=USA, 3=I, 4=E, 5=J, 6=F, 7=CDN, 8=AUS/GOLF, 0=D, 1=GB
11. EINHEIT 1: B3, B4, B5, B6, B7, B8, B9, BA, BB, BC, BD, BE, BF, B0, B1 EINHEIT 2: [similar to above, I didn't want to mess with it]
12. VANK: xx,x (kph)
13. ANKhttp://www.bimmerboard.com/images/emoticons/8.gifxhttp://www.bimmerboard.com/images/emoticons/8.gifx
14. ROM:
15. DIAG: 01 01 000 E3
16. PORT: 01 101010000, 02 101010000, 03...etc
17. PROM: 00 12, 01 37, 02 18, 03 E6, 04 02, 05 B3, 06 FF, 07 7E
18. HORN: DTON or [DTON flashing]
19. LOCK: ON
20. KVBR: 1000
21. RESET?