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  #21  
Old 02-10-2011, 06:44 PM
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I think the 335d is a terrible value. It costs like a 335i, but performs like a 325. It is a sport sedan without a manual transmission. It has no history of extra longevity or high resale value in this market, which would have helped to justify the price.

BMW was too caught up in trying to protect their performance image, IMO. If they had brought in a 320d, and been honest about it, selling reasonable performance with outstanding fuel economy, they could have sold many more, again, IMO. the 35d makes some sense in an X5 due to the very high weight of that vehicle. But in the new 2011 X3, a 20d would make more sense. Will they do it? Probably more likely they will stick the old 35d engine in there as well. Too bad. If I did get a new X3 or X1, a 20d model would by far be my preference.


Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but nobody that has driven that car would say it performs like the 325. It blows the NA engine out of the water. Every car magazine ranks the two 335 models as nearly identical in performance. If the manual is the deal breaker then so be it.

As far as longevity, I would say that with all the HPFP issues the i has, the d looks like the reliability champion so far. We'll see in a few years, but I can't imagine an engine with an RPM sweet spot of 1/3rd redline would not outlast one that is "rev happy".

For resale, the fact that the used d's are so expensive on the used market compared to the rest of the 3er's leads me to believe resale will be just fine. Unless of course diesel fuel gets to be much more expensive than premium.

I do agree with you in that I wish BMW would bring the 20d over for the smaller vehicles. I would die for a car with 328 type performance that gets 50mpg or more. I think that the greenies fearing diesel and enviro policies in several states kept this from happening.
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  #22  
Old 02-10-2011, 06:55 PM
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325 comparison is overblow, yeah. How about it has the fuel economy of the 325, with the power of the 328, for the cost of the 335i?

Yes, the rpm sweet spot is down (just as it is with the 335i) but I would worry about the peak cylinder pressures as much as the rpm. That is more likely to impact longevity. Those with 300,000 mile 3.0 X5s on this board haven't been shy of using rpms. I don't think running a BMW inline six up through the rev range compromises its reliability.
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  #23  
Old 02-10-2011, 07:04 PM
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How about it has the fuel economy of the 325, with the power of the 328, for the cost of the 335i?
That is a really good way to describe it. Even if you were more generous and said it has the economy of the 325, with the power of a 330, for the cost of a 335i, it still wouldn't be a good deal, imo.
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  #24  
Old 02-10-2011, 07:22 PM
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I wasnt aware a 325 got 40mpg on the highway. I also wasnt aware that the 328 matched the 335i 0-60. The d does both(OK, .1 sec slower than the 335i).

And I don't care if it's a Chevy, a BMW, or a Ferrari, running an engine balls out at high RPM's constantly is going to wear it out faster than running it slower. That is just common sense. Why do you think rental cars run like hell after 50,000 miles? I'd like to know the service history of dealer loaners since they more than likely get driven harder than people's personal vehicles. I would be willing bet a bunch of money that the vast majority of 300,000 mile X5's were not redlined very often. Of course if you lease, it doesnt matter and becomes someone else's problem...... :-)

Maybe it's just my driving style, but I feel the d fits me better than the i. I like having tons of power available at low rpm's so I dont HAVE to rev it all the way up. In real world day-to-day driving how often do you really need or want to run 8000 rpm?
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Old 02-10-2011, 07:31 PM
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I literally floor my e36 325i multiple times per day and I now have over 320,000 miles on it. As long as you have the right amount of the correct oil in the engine, I really don't think high rpm's have that much affect on a BMW 6 cylinder engine. Now, some rental-car special, i.e. Malibu, Fusion, Altima, etc may not handle it as well.
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  #26  
Old 02-10-2011, 07:32 PM
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I got this from the fuel economy website link I provided earlier.
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  #27  
Old 02-10-2011, 08:19 PM
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Thanks for proving my point with the above data.
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  #28  
Old 02-10-2011, 09:22 PM
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Fair enough, but I used the opinions of all the actual purchasers of new BMWs, who voted with their wallets, and had two options available to them. Asking just the diesel owners if they are a good idea would be like going to a Republican convention and asking for opinions on Obama. (I knew you'd like that one, lol)
I believe people who vote with their wallets are often swayed by public opinion, and TV commercials. Accurate knowledge about other options especially in the diesel area are often clouded by something as simple as "where would I buy fuel" and they listen to nothing more than the negative comments of others rather than informing themselves with the facts from people who know the product.

It's kinda like those Republicans you spoke of. Their opinions on Obama (like a choice in a different driving machine) would be far different if it wouldn't cost them the a future election. Some people as usual without accurate knowledge, just have to follow the Jones.
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  #29  
Old 02-10-2011, 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted by GoVols! View Post
I wasnt aware a 325 got 40mpg on the highway. I also wasnt aware that the 328 matched the 335i 0-60. The d does both(OK, .1 sec slower than the 335i).

And I don't care if it's a Chevy, a BMW, or a Ferrari, running an engine balls out at high RPM's constantly is going to wear it out faster than running it slower. That is just common sense. Why do you think rental cars run like hell after 50,000 miles? I'd like to know the service history of dealer loaners since they more than likely get driven harder than people's personal vehicles. I would be willing bet a bunch of money that the vast majority of 300,000 mile X5's were not redlined very often. Of course if you lease, it doesnt matter and becomes someone else's problem...... :-)

Maybe it's just my driving style, but I feel the d fits me better than the i. I like having tons of power available at low rpm's so I dont HAVE to rev it all the way up. In real world day-to-day driving how often do you really need or want to run 8000 rpm?
FSETH's graph certainly shows some good numbers for the comparison. I tend not to use US government figures, because they aren't close to reality, and there are so many correction factors that I think the tests are not reproducable. I use either Transport Canada, or the UK government figures. Going with the UK figures, because they are listed conveniently on www.bmw.co.uk, the 335d has a 0-62 mph time of 6.0. The 335i is at 5.6, the 325 is at 6.7, and the 330 (when it was listed) was down the middle of those, same as the 328, very close to the 335d. Yes, it is only one aspect of performance. The mileage of the 335d on the combined cycle is listed as 42.2 mpg (remember that is Imperial gallons). The 335i is at 34 mpg, the 325 is at 39 mpg, and the 323 (when it was listed) was at 42. The 320i is listed at 44. My analogy therefore wasn't correct. It should have been the mileage of the 323, the acceleration of the 328/330, and the cost of the 335i. I will further grant you that in the US, you got rebates so that the 35d didn't cost that much. The rest of us don't get those rebates.

I don't have a concern over running my BMW gasoline engines to redline most times I drive them, after they are properly warmed up. It has not resulted in increased oil consumption or engine wear. If you read posts by wallyx5, he discusses his 300,000 mile 3.0 X5 that he regularly runs at high speeds. These engines do much better with that use than they do on short trips and at idle.

If your 35d works for you, that is fantastic. They are great engines. My only comment would be that if you like to take advantage of the low speed torque, and keep engine rpms down, and always have throttle response available, then that is not so much a diesel characteristic as it is a turbocharged engine characteristic. Your diesel just happens to be a turbocharged design. My 535i has the same characteristics, but with the added bonus that I can rev it if I want to. It has a six speed manual, and I can pretty much shift it 1-3-5 or 2-4-6, it has far more gears than it needs in daily driving, given the available torque just off idle.
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  #30  
Old 02-10-2011, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quicksilver View Post
I believe people who vote with their wallets are often swayed by public opinion, and TV commercials. Accurate knowledge about other options especially in the diesel area are often clouded by something as simple as "where would I buy fuel" and they listen to nothing more than the negative comments of others rather than informing themselves with the facts from people who know the product.

It's kinda like those Republicans you spoke of. Their opinions on Obama (like a choice in a different driving machine) would be far different if it wouldn't cost them the a future election. Some people as usual without accurate knowledge, just have to follow the Jones.
So the 99% of BMW car purchasers in the US in 2009 that picked a gasoline engine model, compared to the 1% that picked a diesel model, were just ill-informed? Looks like BMW has some education to do then.
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